Brexit....the way ahead
Discussion
Yes...I know ....you're all fed up with it...
However lets be positive and have a sensible rational debate on the best way to proceed.
Let's concentrate on the fact that we are leaving the EU and not debate on whether we should have remained.
There are reasonable arguments on both sides but,after the latest TM feck up,I have concluded that,FOR AN EASY LIFE,the best deal was to have remained a member.
I suggest that the great majority of our politicians haven't the slightest clue how to proceed,
and why should they have never even run a corner sweet shop.
Therefore let's start by replacing TM as soon as possible,she has lost credibility,that'll probably have to be at the next Tory conference.
Make David Davis PM,then draft in Nigel Farage,he knows the EU back to front and surely is best placed to lead the negotiations.
Why Farage ?
Well there's no way the EU can give us a really good deal otherwise it will encourage other members to leave on the same terms.
So we have to have someone totally in favour of project Brexit and has the charisma to take the majority of the U.K. with him.
Next draft in the very best business leaders we have,as advisors,those with experience of doing deals abroad.
The likes of Digby Jones,Alan Sugar,Martin Sorrel.
What do you think ?
However lets be positive and have a sensible rational debate on the best way to proceed.
Let's concentrate on the fact that we are leaving the EU and not debate on whether we should have remained.
There are reasonable arguments on both sides but,after the latest TM feck up,I have concluded that,FOR AN EASY LIFE,the best deal was to have remained a member.
I suggest that the great majority of our politicians haven't the slightest clue how to proceed,
and why should they have never even run a corner sweet shop.
Therefore let's start by replacing TM as soon as possible,she has lost credibility,that'll probably have to be at the next Tory conference.
Make David Davis PM,then draft in Nigel Farage,he knows the EU back to front and surely is best placed to lead the negotiations.
Why Farage ?
Well there's no way the EU can give us a really good deal otherwise it will encourage other members to leave on the same terms.
So we have to have someone totally in favour of project Brexit and has the charisma to take the majority of the U.K. with him.
Next draft in the very best business leaders we have,as advisors,those with experience of doing deals abroad.
The likes of Digby Jones,Alan Sugar,Martin Sorrel.
What do you think ?
Farage?? You're joking.
The only way we will get a half decent deal is unity, so DD as Brexit bloke needs to up his game, become a statesman and gather a cross party group together of MPs and businessmen.
Its clear the electorate aren't behind TM and whatever vision of Brexit she thinks she has but getting rid of her doesn't change the practicalities. Let her fester in the mess she's made.
The only way we will get a half decent deal is unity, so DD as Brexit bloke needs to up his game, become a statesman and gather a cross party group together of MPs and businessmen.
Its clear the electorate aren't behind TM and whatever vision of Brexit she thinks she has but getting rid of her doesn't change the practicalities. Let her fester in the mess she's made.
I don't think the election result has altered the process.
TM is still prime minister, she has activated article 50 Brexit will go ahead.
The EU has to negotiate with someone and it really doesn't matter to them who that is.
TM is only the British face of the talks. The negotiations will go on between we have never heard of.
TM, David Davis, BoJo will be rolled out to tell us what a good deal we are getting.
JC, Abbottomaus, Krankie will tell us it's a bad deal.
(irrespective of the actual terms of the deal)
TM is still prime minister, she has activated article 50 Brexit will go ahead.
The EU has to negotiate with someone and it really doesn't matter to them who that is.
TM is only the British face of the talks. The negotiations will go on between we have never heard of.
TM, David Davis, BoJo will be rolled out to tell us what a good deal we are getting.
JC, Abbottomaus, Krankie will tell us it's a bad deal.
(irrespective of the actual terms of the deal)
PurpleMoonlight said:
Not Farage.
He is despised by a large proportion if not all the EU.
That's no bad thing, but on the other hand he is something pf a lightweight. Daniel Hannan is the one. Speaks French, very bright (extraordinarily so for a politician) and can't be accused of being a 'Little Englander' because he's not English.He is despised by a large proportion if not all the EU.
Another possibility is Steve Baker (if he still has his seat). Active in the leave campaign and popular even with his opponents.
V40Vinnie said:
On what level of impossibility would it be for the general public to vote for the terms of the Deal, or is that too far-fetched?
The EU don't want the UK to leave. If they knew we were to have a vote to approve the deal then their motivation will be to make the deal as bad as possible. If May had any nous she'd say that after a 'period of reflection' that in the national interest she is going to assemble a cross-party negotiating team (or at the least a cross-party 'working group') to steer the country through Brexit. And if everyone agrees to 'back off!!!' And let her lead the country for the next two years there she will step down following Brexit in 2019 with a view to their being another general election in 2020.
I think that the election has changed the tone of the Brexit route. The huge young vote that turned out this time when they didn't for the referendum reminds us that there are a broad range of views.
I do wonder if there is a deal to be done around EFTA, where we retain power over free trade, agriculture, fisheries, whilst staying in the Single Market.
The pre-condition would have to be some work permit system formalising the right to free movement of Labour so that we can work with the EU to manage migration, both because we have too much net migration and because we are draining proactive young people from many EU states.
Thoughts?
This won't happen but it would be nice to allow a re-vote on Brexit and if the country chooses to remain (which I think it will if the young people vote in force), then the UK needs to get on its knees, bow its head, and say I'm sorry to the EU will you take me back. And get stuck with higher contributions to the union but a more stable country and healthier economic future.
But that won't happen. Theresa May will try to cling to power making stupid speeches and talking down to the public trying to remind us that she knows what's best for us, including even more internet surveillance and a reduction in human rights, etc. but the hung parliament won't let her do anything of note. So, we will end up with no extension from the EU on Brexit and will end up with some generic set of WTO treaties and also end up with several negotiations with various countries for the next 10 years.
But that won't happen. Theresa May will try to cling to power making stupid speeches and talking down to the public trying to remind us that she knows what's best for us, including even more internet surveillance and a reduction in human rights, etc. but the hung parliament won't let her do anything of note. So, we will end up with no extension from the EU on Brexit and will end up with some generic set of WTO treaties and also end up with several negotiations with various countries for the next 10 years.
there are two moments in a nations history when consensus government is the only way forward, these are times of war and i believe Breixt.
brexit is a defining moment in our history it will shape our future for the next 50 years at least.
I agree with armando iannucci it is time for all our political parties to get together and work together in the national interest appoint a non political head of negotiation and approach this as a unified GB plc.
it will never happen
while the careerist power and glory hungry f
kwits in parliament and beyond ( i include farrage in that lot) squabble over who will try to gain the glory for leading us in to the wilderness.
brexit is a defining moment in our history it will shape our future for the next 50 years at least.
I agree with armando iannucci it is time for all our political parties to get together and work together in the national interest appoint a non political head of negotiation and approach this as a unified GB plc.
it will never happen
while the careerist power and glory hungry f
kwits in parliament and beyond ( i include farrage in that lot) squabble over who will try to gain the glory for leading us in to the wilderness.V40Vinnie said:
On what level of impossibility would it be for the general public to vote for the terms of the Deal, or is that too far-fetched?
What do you think would happen if we voted that we didn't like the deal?The EU negotiators will turn around and say that's the best they can do. We would then be left with the results of two referendum, one saying we should leave, the other saying the best deal available isnt wanted. The only option is exit with no deal.
voyds9 said:
I don't think the election result has altered the process
But it has altered the likely outcome.The UK has a limited time to negotiate a deal with the EU, because March 2019 is a hard deadline (no chance of getting all 27 to agree to extend it).
It has already been decided that the deal will need approval by parliament. With a hung parliament what sort of deal do you think can be negotiated that will gain enough approval to go through? Probably a bit of a muddle that doesn't make anyone happy.
Is there a likelihood the EU will seek to gain from this situation. Why wouldn't they.
EFTA - Norway won't allow it. EFTAish - free movement is the big issue. Why would the EU give away the benefit of a single market without free movement in return? Free movement with restrictions. I suppose theoretically possible, but I bet it would require the UK paying a large annual cheque to the EU.
I am very pleased to see you all agree with me.
Of course it could be that TM,and those Machiavellian forces behind pulling the strings,have played a blinder.
Let's face it no one could seriously believe that the Tory "manifesto" combined with the other bks could possibly result in anything other than Tory losses or a hung parliament.
Therefore I suggest there will not be a Brexit.
Within a couple of years,if not sooner,there will an election and the question of membership of the EU will be forefront and ,guess what,the vote will be to stay in.
Of course it could be that TM,and those Machiavellian forces behind pulling the strings,have played a blinder.
Let's face it no one could seriously believe that the Tory "manifesto" combined with the other b
ks could possibly result in anything other than Tory losses or a hung parliament.Therefore I suggest there will not be a Brexit.
Within a couple of years,if not sooner,there will an election and the question of membership of the EU will be forefront and ,guess what,the vote will be to stay in.
DELETED: Comment made by a member who's account has been deleted.
I regret that on an open forum I don't want to reveal those details.I will say that I have been in business,running my own companies,all my life.
Not suggesting I know more than anyone else,just your average Joe,that's learnt a bit along the way.
PurpleMoonlight said:
avinalarf said:
Therefore I suggest there will not be a Brexit.
Within a couple of years,if not sooner,there will an election and the question of membership of the EU will be forefront and ,guess what,the vote will be to stay in.
Oh, I thought you wanted a serious discussion.Within a couple of years,if not sooner,there will an election and the question of membership of the EU will be forefront and ,guess what,the vote will be to stay in.
If they had a vote tommorow it would go ,at least, 55% to 45% to stay in.
Why ?
1) Now more problems are being exposed people are beginning to look into the tunnel and they are scared,not the fervent Brexiteers but those that reluctantly voted to exit,plus the young vote has realised they can change things and most of them want to stay in.
2) There is a majority of Remainers in the Tories,Labour and Lib Dems that want to stay in.
3) Most crucially there are a majority of corporations large and small that want to remain.
4) If,as now being discussed,we stay in the single market,the only way to we might get a fairer deal with the EU,that will not satisfy hard core Brexiteers,and frankly I think if that's the outcome we should stay in.
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