Derbyshire police want to stop vigilante paedo hunters....
Discussion
http://www.derbytelegraph.co.uk/news/derby-news/pa...
Yes they are vilgilantes but they are doing all the hard work for the police and catching them.
As long as they are not beating them up when they catch them im all for it.
Yes they are vilgilantes but they are doing all the hard work for the police and catching them.
As long as they are not beating them up when they catch them im all for it.
Eric Mc said:
What if they get it wrong?
From what I understand they are arranging to meet them etc and have all "chats" printed out ready to hand over to the police, and from what other clips iv seen of them in action on Bookface they seem to cover all the bases. So as to not get it wrong.
Whilst I don’t disagree that they have helped bring some vile people to justice where does this kind of thing end? Are we going to turn into a Statsi style East Germany where everyone is informing on everyone else with their Facebook evidence and dash cam film etc?
The problem with vigilantism is that they don’t know what they are stepping into. They might have snared a guy for attempting to meet a 12 year old but in the process be stomping all over an international investigation to snare a huge ring. Too often vigilante action focuses on the narrow outcome and the wider picture needs to be looked at.
The problem with vigilantism is that they don’t know what they are stepping into. They might have snared a guy for attempting to meet a 12 year old but in the process be stomping all over an international investigation to snare a huge ring. Too often vigilante action focuses on the narrow outcome and the wider picture needs to be looked at.
Eric Mc said:
What if they get it wrong?
As I understand it the vigilantes communicate with the suspected Paedo for some time,posing as a child. The Paedo has ample opportunity to end the communication before the final meet is arranged and is exposed for what he is, before they are then handed over
to the police.
What are the chances of an innocent party turning up to meet the child?
craigjm said:
Whilst I don’t disagree that they have helped bring some vile people to justice where does this kind of thing end?
They've been perfectly willing to allow Community Speed WatchMany people I know have no issue with speeders
I'm unaware of anyone happy with kiddie fiddlers.
This is what happens when the public feel nothing is happening. They see it as easy, post a message on a website, bad guy takes bait, bad guy caught and ask if it is that easy why do the police not do that?
In my case I was burgled, the police guy was fine but said little they could do. I went on Ebay found my goods same day and arrest made. They have no one looking for stolen goods, if they turn up then they will take action. Again if it was easy for me and many others why do they not.
Speedwatch members, they do it because they do not get what they feel they should get for the money they pay.
We should have no need for vigilantes but whilst the police spunk millions chasing up dead peoples pasts as it is on message, real live criminals are left to others to catch.
In my case I was burgled, the police guy was fine but said little they could do. I went on Ebay found my goods same day and arrest made. They have no one looking for stolen goods, if they turn up then they will take action. Again if it was easy for me and many others why do they not.
Speedwatch members, they do it because they do not get what they feel they should get for the money they pay.
We should have no need for vigilantes but whilst the police spunk millions chasing up dead peoples pasts as it is on message, real live criminals are left to others to catch.
I'm against the Vigilante groups who attempt Citizen Arrests. They are amateurs and act accordingly.
The problem with Amateurs is that there is an element of ego involved, of adventurism and these get in the way and can - and have - caused damage to the Paedo's families.
I wasn't even aware these Vigilantes existed until I received a very alarming link to a certain Group's Facebook page concerning a relative of mine!
It transpired that her boyfriend was grooming 12 year olds. Now, he needs the full weight of the Law thrown at him, no issue with that at all!
The work the Vigilante Group did in gathering evidence using decoys etc is fantastic, great stuff and to be applauded.
It goes wrong when they want glory. Not only to make an arrest and the kicks they get from that, but to show it live to the World.
I firmly believe that if altruism was their goal, they would hand their evidence to the Police and let the professional's take over after a job well done.
What happened in my Family Member's case was her boyfriend was called out while she and their baby son were at home. A live broadcast went out and neighbours recognised the road and the Family. She then received violent threats! She didn't know what the Paedo was up to. She kicked him out immediately but you can imagine that not only did she discover she was living with a Paedo, had a child with a Paedo, but had to deal with being labelled complicit by morons too.
That Group, deserve to be shut down and censured by the Police. Criminal.
The problem with Amateurs is that there is an element of ego involved, of adventurism and these get in the way and can - and have - caused damage to the Paedo's families.
I wasn't even aware these Vigilantes existed until I received a very alarming link to a certain Group's Facebook page concerning a relative of mine!
It transpired that her boyfriend was grooming 12 year olds. Now, he needs the full weight of the Law thrown at him, no issue with that at all!
The work the Vigilante Group did in gathering evidence using decoys etc is fantastic, great stuff and to be applauded.
It goes wrong when they want glory. Not only to make an arrest and the kicks they get from that, but to show it live to the World.
I firmly believe that if altruism was their goal, they would hand their evidence to the Police and let the professional's take over after a job well done.
What happened in my Family Member's case was her boyfriend was called out while she and their baby son were at home. A live broadcast went out and neighbours recognised the road and the Family. She then received violent threats! She didn't know what the Paedo was up to. She kicked him out immediately but you can imagine that not only did she discover she was living with a Paedo, had a child with a Paedo, but had to deal with being labelled complicit by morons too.
That Group, deserve to be shut down and censured by the Police. Criminal.
Coolbanana said:
I'm against the Vigilante groups who attempt Citizen Arrests. They are amateurs and act accordingly.
The problem with Amateurs is that there is an element of ego involved, of adventurism and these get in the way and can - and have - caused damage to the Paedo's families.
I wasn't even aware these Vigilantes existed until I received a very alarming link to a certain Group's Facebook page concerning a relative of mine!
It transpired that her boyfriend was grooming 12 year olds. Now, he needs the full weight of the Law thrown at him, no issue with that at all!
The work the Vigilante Group did in gathering evidence using decoys etc is fantastic, great stuff and to be applauded.
It goes wrong when they want glory. Not only to make an arrest and the kicks they get from that, but to show it live to the World.
I firmly believe that if altruism was their goal, they would hand their evidence to the Police and let the professional's take over after a job well done.
What happened in my Family Member's case was her boyfriend was called out while she and their baby son were at home. A live broadcast went out and neighbours recognised the road and the Family. She then received violent threats! She didn't know what the Paedo was up to. She kicked him out immediately but you can imagine that not only did she discover she was living with a Paedo, had a child with a Paedo, but had to deal with being labelled complicit by morons too.
That Group, deserve to be shut down and censured by the Police. Criminal.
Isn't that what the media do with so very many cases when people are suspected or charged - I think there should be a ban on reporting until they have been found guilty.The problem with Amateurs is that there is an element of ego involved, of adventurism and these get in the way and can - and have - caused damage to the Paedo's families.
I wasn't even aware these Vigilantes existed until I received a very alarming link to a certain Group's Facebook page concerning a relative of mine!
It transpired that her boyfriend was grooming 12 year olds. Now, he needs the full weight of the Law thrown at him, no issue with that at all!
The work the Vigilante Group did in gathering evidence using decoys etc is fantastic, great stuff and to be applauded.
It goes wrong when they want glory. Not only to make an arrest and the kicks they get from that, but to show it live to the World.
I firmly believe that if altruism was their goal, they would hand their evidence to the Police and let the professional's take over after a job well done.
What happened in my Family Member's case was her boyfriend was called out while she and their baby son were at home. A live broadcast went out and neighbours recognised the road and the Family. She then received violent threats! She didn't know what the Paedo was up to. She kicked him out immediately but you can imagine that not only did she discover she was living with a Paedo, had a child with a Paedo, but had to deal with being labelled complicit by morons too.
That Group, deserve to be shut down and censured by the Police. Criminal.
craigjm said:
The problem with vigilantism is that they don’t know what they are stepping into. They might have snared a guy for attempting to meet a 12 year old but in the process be stomping all over an international investigation to snare a huge ring. Too often vigilante action focuses on the narrow outcome and the wider picture needs to be looked at.
^^^This
I can understand whilst people are motivated to do this. The public also have a bit more freedom than the police when it comes to how they can approach these things (no entrapment etc). The issue is they don’t just take the evidence to the police. They plaster it all over social media which creatures a duty of care towards the people whom they are targeting which is far from ideal.
Yes, vigilantes are really really good idea. One of the best ideas ever. What could possibly go wrong.
https://www.theguardian.com/uk/2000/aug/30/childpr...
https://www.theguardian.com/uk/2000/aug/30/childpr...
jjlynn27 said:
Yes, vigilantes are really really good idea. One of the best ideas ever. What could possibly go wrong.
https://www.theguardian.com/uk/2000/aug/30/childpr...
THEY'RE WELSH !https://www.theguardian.com/uk/2000/aug/30/childpr...
Really that's the best you can come up with ?
Not quite sure how the groups who go online, acting as children can get the wrong person.
gothatway said:
craigjm said:
The problem with vigilantism is that they don’t know what they are stepping into. They might have snared a guy for attempting to meet a 12 year old but in the process be stomping all over an international investigation to snare a huge ring. Too often vigilante action focuses on the narrow outcome and the wider picture needs to be looked at.
^^^This
Please don't cite the Bradford, etc etc convictions, not they aren't paedos imo, they just aren't international.
gooner1 said:
gothatway said:
craigjm said:
The problem with vigilantism is that they don’t know what they are stepping into. They might have snared a guy for attempting to meet a 12 year old but in the process be stomping all over an international investigation to snare a huge ring. Too often vigilante action focuses on the narrow outcome and the wider picture needs to be looked at.
^^^This
Please don't cite the Bradford, etc etc convictions, not they aren't paedos imo, they just aren't international.
I’m not saying that there is anything wrong with snaring the one guy but unless you know the whole picture you don’t know if he is already under survielence and being investigated for a bigger prize.
craigjm said:
gooner1 said:
gothatway said:
craigjm said:
The problem with vigilantism is that they don’t know what they are stepping into. They might have snared a guy for attempting to meet a 12 year old but in the process be stomping all over an international investigation to snare a huge ring. Too often vigilante action focuses on the narrow outcome and the wider picture needs to be looked at.
^^^This
Please don't cite the Bradford, etc etc convictions, not they aren't paedos imo, they just aren't international.
I’m not saying that there is anything wrong with snaring the one guy but unless you know the whole picture you don’t know if he is already under survielence and being investigated for a bigger prize.
ks, from the News I'm told there are literally hundreds of sites sharing illegal images and there are literally thousands of Paedos in the UK - it's simply that the Police don't have the resources and don't like being shown up.Gassing Station | News, Politics & Economics | Top of Page | What's New | My Stuff