Young people getting shot/stabbed
Discussion
Whats peoples thoughs on this, the news seems to portrey these people as innocent young kids out on the streest doing nothing and are getting killed. But I say most of the time there is always some background story that we dont know about.
This recent young girl who was killed, big news at the time.
http://www.dailymail.co.uk/news/article-5675421/Fa...
Over Christmas a nice fella came down from the midlands to buy my car, he had a cockney accent and we got talking. He was from Hackney and said that he had to move away beacuse he didnt want his 2yr old daughter to be brought up there. He was saying that the drugs/gangs/crime is now so bad that he could not take it anymore.
I tend to agree that in most cases there is a background story as to why young people are getting killed, and in general terms, they are probably in some kind of "gang", and within these gangs there tends to be rivalries. It's always been thus, but the stakes seem to get higher these days.
There was recently a guy who got stabbed in Newcastle City Centre. The headlines were that the guy who got stabbed was popular, much loved, and wouldn't hurt a fly. The picture of him even looked as though butter wouldn't melt.
However, when you dug beneath the surface, it wasn't difficult to find pictures of the guy using drugs, and hanging about with exactly the sorts of people you would expect to be caught up in this sort of thing. Even tributes to him saying "he didn't take any s
t" and all that sort of thing. Now, I am not saying that deep down he wasn't a nice guy, he may well have been, but he clearly did hang around in the sort of circles where it wasn't difficult to envisage his ultimate fate.
In some areas I suspect the kids have got no chance, as they are quite often so rough that it's best to be in a gang for your own protection (else, you end up an outcast, and then relentlessly bullied). Ironically, the outcome is usually like the stories described.
There was recently a guy who got stabbed in Newcastle City Centre. The headlines were that the guy who got stabbed was popular, much loved, and wouldn't hurt a fly. The picture of him even looked as though butter wouldn't melt.
However, when you dug beneath the surface, it wasn't difficult to find pictures of the guy using drugs, and hanging about with exactly the sorts of people you would expect to be caught up in this sort of thing. Even tributes to him saying "he didn't take any s
t" and all that sort of thing. Now, I am not saying that deep down he wasn't a nice guy, he may well have been, but he clearly did hang around in the sort of circles where it wasn't difficult to envisage his ultimate fate.In some areas I suspect the kids have got no chance, as they are quite often so rough that it's best to be in a gang for your own protection (else, you end up an outcast, and then relentlessly bullied). Ironically, the outcome is usually like the stories described.
TameRacingDriver said:
I tend to agree that in most cases there is a background story as to why young people are getting killed, and in general terms, they are probably in some kind of "gang", and within these gangs there tends to be rivalries. It's always been thus, but the stakes seem to get higher these days.
There was recently a guy who got stabbed in Newcastle City Centre. The headlines were that the guy who got stabbed was popular, much loved, and wouldn't hurt a fly. The picture of him even looked as though butter wouldn't melt.
However, when you dug beneath the surface, it wasn't difficult to find pictures of the guy using drugs, and hanging about with exactly the sorts of people you would expect to be caught up in this sort of thing. Even tributes to him saying "he didn't take any st" and all that sort of thing. Now, I am not saying that deep down he wasn't a nice guy, he may well have been, but he clearly did hang around in the sort of circles where it wasn't difficult to envisage his ultimate fate.
In some areas I suspect the kids have got no chance, as they are quite often so rough that it's best to be in a gang for your own protection (else, you end up an outcast, and then relentlessly bullied). Ironically, the outcome is usually like the stories described.
It's a tradition of sorts to never speak ill of the dead. Even when they were a right sThere was recently a guy who got stabbed in Newcastle City Centre. The headlines were that the guy who got stabbed was popular, much loved, and wouldn't hurt a fly. The picture of him even looked as though butter wouldn't melt.
However, when you dug beneath the surface, it wasn't difficult to find pictures of the guy using drugs, and hanging about with exactly the sorts of people you would expect to be caught up in this sort of thing. Even tributes to him saying "he didn't take any s
t" and all that sort of thing. Now, I am not saying that deep down he wasn't a nice guy, he may well have been, but he clearly did hang around in the sort of circles where it wasn't difficult to envisage his ultimate fate.In some areas I suspect the kids have got no chance, as they are quite often so rough that it's best to be in a gang for your own protection (else, you end up an outcast, and then relentlessly bullied). Ironically, the outcome is usually like the stories described.
tbag. Usually when someone gets stabbed, it has to do with drugs (barring that, money or women), so for most of us the risk is negligible. That being said we're experiencing an increase in crime because the economy is suffering. Its a well established link, as an economy worsens crimes like petty theft increases and as more people get robbed, more fight back which turns a bag snatch into a stabbing, this is something the average person needs to be weary of.
patientadvice said:
Another promising footballer.
Apparently a promising musician, but close 
I'm not saying he deserved it as I probably only know half of the facts (apparently, he was attacked and tried to defend himself, but was then stabbed through the heart), but it would be fairly easy to imagine he was in fact, part of a gang of sorts.
http://news.bbc.co.uk/1/hi/wales/south_east/840604...
Not gang violence but I always remember this news story when the BBC interviewed people in the local area and everybody said they were good guys, safe as houses them boys, well known in the community.
Thieving scum springs to mind. But the BBC portrayed them as somthing different.
They were discussing knife crime on LBC the other day. A few callers were ex or even current gang members/knife carriers.
What was interesting was that one lad talked of the yearning for fame and that despite prison, the kudos of being famous for murdering someone was too great an attraction.
What scares me is that even my middle class, do my best to bring them up correctly, teen boys, speak in that feux Jamaican accent and talk of stabbings and 'shanking' as if it was nothing more than a punch up.
This didn't happen at the older one's private school, but sadly money problems mean that both lads go to the local comp now, and I really don't like the type of kids that they are now forced to share space with.
What was interesting was that one lad talked of the yearning for fame and that despite prison, the kudos of being famous for murdering someone was too great an attraction.
What scares me is that even my middle class, do my best to bring them up correctly, teen boys, speak in that feux Jamaican accent and talk of stabbings and 'shanking' as if it was nothing more than a punch up.
This didn't happen at the older one's private school, but sadly money problems mean that both lads go to the local comp now, and I really don't like the type of kids that they are now forced to share space with.
croyde said:
They were discussing knife crime on LBC the other day. A few callers were ex or even current gang members/knife carriers.
What was interesting was that one lad talked of the yearning for fame and that despite prison, the kudos of being famous for murdering someone was too great an attraction.
What scares me is that even my middle class, do my best to bring them up correctly, teen boys, speak in that feux Jamaican accent and talk of stabbings and 'shanking' as if it was nothing more than a punch up.
This didn't happen at the older one's private school, but sadly money problems mean that both lads go to the local comp now, and I really don't like the type of kids that they are now forced to share space with.
Do you not mercilessly rip it out of them for talking that way. My stepson soon stopped when we continually pointed out he's no G, he's just a white, middle class schoolboy from South Staffordshire. He might carry on doing it with his mates but he'll never talk like that in the house again, I don't think.What was interesting was that one lad talked of the yearning for fame and that despite prison, the kudos of being famous for murdering someone was too great an attraction.
What scares me is that even my middle class, do my best to bring them up correctly, teen boys, speak in that feux Jamaican accent and talk of stabbings and 'shanking' as if it was nothing more than a punch up.
This didn't happen at the older one's private school, but sadly money problems mean that both lads go to the local comp now, and I really don't like the type of kids that they are now forced to share space with.
Pothole said:
Do you not mercilessly rip it out of them for talking that way. My stepson soon stopped when we continually pointed out he's no G, he's just a white, middle class schoolboy from South Staffordshire. He might carry on doing it with his mates but he'll never talk like that in the house again, I don't think.
Oh, do everything from taking the pee to getting really peed off about it.In comparison their sister has been privately schooled in secondary, right up to 18 years old, in South London but talks posher than the Queen.
Being I'm from Sarf London, born and bred, I take the pee out of her too
croyde said:
Pothole said:
Do you not mercilessly rip it out of them for talking that way. My stepson soon stopped when we continually pointed out he's no G, he's just a white, middle class schoolboy from South Staffordshire. He might carry on doing it with his mates but he'll never talk like that in the house again, I don't think.
Oh, do everything from taking the pee to getting really peed off about it.In comparison their sister has been privately schooled in secondary, right up to 18 years old, in South London but talks posher than the Queen.
Being I'm from Sarf London, born and bred, I take the pee out of her too
The rise in violence on the streets of UK cities is an entirely foreseeable and predictable outcome of 10 years of Tory government cuts to social services, educational services, law enforcement and welfare spending. With a shrinking economy and continual doom mongering about young peoples chances of having parity of wealth to todays 30 and 40 somethings they inevitably feel opportunities are few and far between to get them out of poverty and off the streets. Drug and alcohol use in pockets are so prevalent it makes a complete mockery of the law that even most law abiding people would find obvious.
It's a disgrace but it's what we voted for. A summer of violence is waiting to erupt, and it won't be dealt with effectively by moral judgment and argument, a pragmatic workable solution must be found.
It's a disgrace but it's what we voted for. A summer of violence is waiting to erupt, and it won't be dealt with effectively by moral judgment and argument, a pragmatic workable solution must be found.
FredClogs said:
The rise in violence on the streets of UK cities is an entirely foreseeable and predictable outcome of 10 years of Tory government cuts to social services, educational services, law enforcement and welfare spending. With a shrinking economy and continual doom mongering about young peoples chances of having parity of wealth to todays 30 and 40 somethings they inevitably feel opportunities are few and far between to get them out of poverty and off the streets. Drug and alcohol use in pockets are so prevalent it makes a complete mockery of the law that even most law abiding people would find obvious.
It's a disgrace but it's what we voted for. A summer of violence is waiting to erupt, and it won't be dealt with effectively by moral judgment and argument, a pragmatic workable solution must be found.
The UKs economy has been growing continously since 2010. It's a disgrace but it's what we voted for. A summer of violence is waiting to erupt, and it won't be dealt with effectively by moral judgment and argument, a pragmatic workable solution must be found.
Shakermaker said:
Without the figures to hand, do the stats say that 10 years ago, we had more violence AND more police? With no other context that is a bad thing.
I dont remember the timing but a few years ago maybe 6/7 years ago there was this spate of media wirlwind around this very same subject, it was reported almost 1 every week was getting stabbed, there might of been a knife amnistey I think. The media then moves onto another topic and we dont hear about it for a while but it is still happening.I dont think the tories could have done that in about 4 years, yes we need the figures over the last 20 years
https://www.independent.co.uk/news/police-knife-am...
This happened in 1996 after a school teacher was killed, which party gets the blame.
PAULJ5555 said:
This recent young girl who was killed, big news at the time.
http://www.dailymail.co.uk/news/article-5675421/Fa...
Are you suggesting that Tanesha Melbourne was involved in her fathers alleged connection to the supply of drugs? Or that her death was somehow linked to it?http://www.dailymail.co.uk/news/article-5675421/Fa...
FredClogs said:
The rise in violence on the streets of UK cities is an entirely foreseeable and predictable outcome of 10 years of Tory government cuts to social services, educational services, law enforcement and welfare spending. With a shrinking economy and continual doom mongering about young peoples chances of having parity of wealth to todays 30 and 40 somethings they inevitably feel opportunities are few and far between to get them out of poverty and off the streets. Drug and alcohol use in pockets are so prevalent it makes a complete mockery of the law that even most law abiding people would find obvious.
It's a disgrace but it's what we voted for. A summer of violence is waiting to erupt, and it won't be dealt with effectively by moral judgment and argument, a pragmatic workable solution must be found.
Agreed - not sure many on here will however.....It's a disgrace but it's what we voted for. A summer of violence is waiting to erupt, and it won't be dealt with effectively by moral judgment and argument, a pragmatic workable solution must be found.
ciege said:
FredClogs said:
The rise in violence on the streets of UK cities is an entirely foreseeable and predictable outcome of 10 years of Tory government cuts to social services, educational services, law enforcement and welfare spending. With a shrinking economy and continual doom mongering about young peoples chances of having parity of wealth to todays 30 and 40 somethings they inevitably feel opportunities are few and far between to get them out of poverty and off the streets. Drug and alcohol use in pockets are so prevalent it makes a complete mockery of the law that even most law abiding people would find obvious.
It's a disgrace but it's what we voted for. A summer of violence is waiting to erupt, and it won't be dealt with effectively by moral judgment and argument, a pragmatic workable solution must be found.
Agreed - not sure many on here will however.....It's a disgrace but it's what we voted for. A summer of violence is waiting to erupt, and it won't be dealt with effectively by moral judgment and argument, a pragmatic workable solution must be found.
bugmenot said:
PAULJ5555 said:
This recent young girl who was killed, big news at the time.
http://www.dailymail.co.uk/news/article-5675421/Fa...
Are you suggesting that Tanesha Melbourne was involved in her fathers alleged connection to the supply of drugs? Or that her death was somehow linked to it?http://www.dailymail.co.uk/news/article-5675421/Fa...
FredClogs said:
The rise in violence on the streets of UK cities is an entirely foreseeable and predictable outcome of 10 years of Tory government cuts to social services, educational services, law enforcement and welfare spending. With a shrinking economy and continual doom mongering about young peoples chances of having parity of wealth to todays 30 and 40 somethings they inevitably feel opportunities are few and far between to get them out of poverty and off the streets. Drug and alcohol use in pockets are so prevalent it makes a complete mockery of the law that even most law abiding people would find obvious.
It's a disgrace but it's what we voted for. A summer of violence is waiting to erupt, and it won't be dealt with effectively by moral judgment and argument, a pragmatic workable solution must be found.
what an absolute load of crapIt's a disgrace but it's what we voted for. A summer of violence is waiting to erupt, and it won't be dealt with effectively by moral judgment and argument, a pragmatic workable solution must be found.
my grandparents and parents grew up at a time when there were no social services - you relied on your family; education exisited but a lot of the male teachers had gone to war and not come back; law enforcement was one bobby on foot or a bike and welfare ? what was that ? you had to work to get money. People living in this country back then did not go and get a gun or knife and be violent to survive - the participants in todays society that are being violent want to be violent and they want to kill each other - they have a choice & I dont care if they feel deprived, have a lack of opportunity they do not need to live violent lives. There are many places and examples of communities around the world that are poor and don't have what even these people have in the UK and those people do not behave in that manner.
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