Rebuilding UK Manufacturing...?
Discussion
For many years I have subscribed to the basic view that manufacturing takes place in China, and that thoughts of rebuilding UK manufacturing capacity should be considered fantasy.
Yesterday morning I drove through the Brenner Pass, from northern Italy into southern Austria. Along the way I looked carefully at the many manufacturing businesses lining both sides of the road. This is a landlocked area with tough geography, a relatively harsh climate and enduring political disarray. And yet, it supports a concentrated and vibrant industrial base. Not dirty primary industries (steel making, refining etc) but specialist skilled manufacturers operating out of modern high-tech premises.
Why should the same not be possible here, with our obvious advantages in terms of climate, language, global access etc?
Yesterday morning I drove through the Brenner Pass, from northern Italy into southern Austria. Along the way I looked carefully at the many manufacturing businesses lining both sides of the road. This is a landlocked area with tough geography, a relatively harsh climate and enduring political disarray. And yet, it supports a concentrated and vibrant industrial base. Not dirty primary industries (steel making, refining etc) but specialist skilled manufacturers operating out of modern high-tech premises.
Why should the same not be possible here, with our obvious advantages in terms of climate, language, global access etc?
WindyCommon said:
For many years I have subscribed to the basic view that manufacturing takes place in China, and that thoughts of rebuilding UK manufacturing capacity should be considered fantasy.
Yesterday morning I drove through the Brenner Pass, from northern Italy into southern Austria. Along the way I looked carefully at the many manufacturing businesses lining both sides of the road. This is a landlocked area with tough geography, a relatively harsh climate and enduring political disarray. And yet, it supports a concentrated and vibrant industrial base. Not dirty primary industries (steel making, refining etc) but specialist skilled manufacturers operating out of modern high-tech premises.
Why should the same not be possible here, with our obvious advantages in terms of climate, language, global access etc?
Don't we also have a lot of manufacturing in this country? Nissan, JLR, Honda (not for long), Toyota, JCB, MclarenYesterday morning I drove through the Brenner Pass, from northern Italy into southern Austria. Along the way I looked carefully at the many manufacturing businesses lining both sides of the road. This is a landlocked area with tough geography, a relatively harsh climate and enduring political disarray. And yet, it supports a concentrated and vibrant industrial base. Not dirty primary industries (steel making, refining etc) but specialist skilled manufacturers operating out of modern high-tech premises.
Why should the same not be possible here, with our obvious advantages in terms of climate, language, global access etc?
It just needs to be high value work to justify the (relatively) higher wages required to live in the UK and fight competition from guys like Steyr in Austria.
Attitudes towards long term strategy?
Attitudes towards investment in people and equipment?
The availability of a reliable, skilled workforce?
I don't argue that there are no examples in this country, because there are some really shining examples. I think the Austrians go for real long-term industry, family controlled, jobs for life, constantly reinvesting, growing, keeping up with the times and often being the one to keep up with. I've seen this in Italy, Austria, Germany and Spain.
Attitudes towards investment in people and equipment?
The availability of a reliable, skilled workforce?
I don't argue that there are no examples in this country, because there are some really shining examples. I think the Austrians go for real long-term industry, family controlled, jobs for life, constantly reinvesting, growing, keeping up with the times and often being the one to keep up with. I've seen this in Italy, Austria, Germany and Spain.
glazbagun said:
WindyCommon said:
For many years I have subscribed to the basic view that manufacturing takes place in China, and that thoughts of rebuilding UK manufacturing capacity should be considered fantasy.
Yesterday morning I drove through the Brenner Pass, from northern Italy into southern Austria. Along the way I looked carefully at the many manufacturing businesses lining both sides of the road. This is a landlocked area with tough geography, a relatively harsh climate and enduring political disarray. And yet, it supports a concentrated and vibrant industrial base. Not dirty primary industries (steel making, refining etc) but specialist skilled manufacturers operating out of modern high-tech premises.
Why should the same not be possible here, with our obvious advantages in terms of climate, language, global access etc?
Don't we also have a lot of manufacturing in this country? Nissan, JLR, Honda (not for long), Toyota, JCB, MclarenYesterday morning I drove through the Brenner Pass, from northern Italy into southern Austria. Along the way I looked carefully at the many manufacturing businesses lining both sides of the road. This is a landlocked area with tough geography, a relatively harsh climate and enduring political disarray. And yet, it supports a concentrated and vibrant industrial base. Not dirty primary industries (steel making, refining etc) but specialist skilled manufacturers operating out of modern high-tech premises.
Why should the same not be possible here, with our obvious advantages in terms of climate, language, global access etc?
It just needs to be high value work to justify the (relatively) higher wages required to live in the UK and fight competition from guys like Steyr in Austria.
You mean Steyr, that once Chinese-owned company?
Now owned by Thales (French). Racal here in UK is part of Thales.
What do Steyr make?
Don't tell Greta!
At the end of the day, nobody - NOBODY - can compete with the Big C.
dandarez said:
Who owns Steyr?
You mean Steyr, that once Chinese-owned company?
Now owned by Thales (French). Racal here in UK is part of Thales.
What do Steyr make?
Don't tell Greta!
At the end of the day, nobody - NOBODY - can compete with the Big C.
Well that’s that then. What should we be, a nation of shopkeepers? (Checks high streets) Oops... You mean Steyr, that once Chinese-owned company?
Now owned by Thales (French). Racal here in UK is part of Thales.
What do Steyr make?
Don't tell Greta!
At the end of the day, nobody - NOBODY - can compete with the Big C.
Ayahuasca said:
We could do shipbuilding.
Why are many cruise ships built in Germany and Italy, and none in the UK?
Could it be they have cheap labour? Didn't Germany accept over 1 million immigrants to help with their labor shortage?Why are many cruise ships built in Germany and Italy, and none in the UK?
At the end of the day it'll be labour costs, cost of material, taxes and any government grants that decide.
The way around that is to produce products that require innovation, or high skill levels. Take motorsport, we seem quite dominate in that, don't Tata steel in Port Talbot make a special steel as examples
Yes. 28.4% vs our 20.2% in 2017 according to https://www.cia.gov/library/publications/resources...
WindyCommon said:
Yes. 28.4% vs our 20.2% in 2017 according to https://www.cia.gov/library/publications/resources...
Thanks for that I guess they've not got much in the way of a financial centre so more money goes into industry?
UK manufacturing is doing okay, but it is much more about higher value, often final assembly production than it has been historically.
In cash terms, automotive and aerospace (and defence) components do perhaps paint a better picture than what we see in our everyday lives.
If the UK consumer is prepared to pay more for the UK made product then we can see a shift. There have been efforts to do that with clothing, but it seems everyone wants to buy cheap.
In cash terms, automotive and aerospace (and defence) components do perhaps paint a better picture than what we see in our everyday lives.
If the UK consumer is prepared to pay more for the UK made product then we can see a shift. There have been efforts to do that with clothing, but it seems everyone wants to buy cheap.
WindyCommon said:
Yes. 28.4% vs our 20.2% in 2017 according to https://www.cia.gov/library/publications/resources...
That is industry not manufacturing. We are the 8th biggest (depending on which figures you believe) manufacturer in the world and have pretty much full employment. Our economy is far better balanced AFAICS, why would we want to increase industrial output. It is on the whole Noisy, dirty, hard on the people who work in it and bad for the environment. borcy said:
Does Austria have a greater industrial base %wise than the UK?
WindyCommon said:
Yes. 28.4% vs our 20.2% in 2017 according to https://www.cia.gov/library/publications/resources...
Vanden Saab said:
That is industry not manufacturing.
PH sometimes..!The UK should have a more balanced economy, but I fear that we have missed the boat, heading for a zero CO2 is not conducive to heavy engineering.
An idea would be that we build a Engineering University on a river in the North, attached to it would be multiple covered slipways,
The latest engineering equipment would be available, private companies could hire the slipways, hopefully bringing work and experience into the area.
An idea would be that we build a Engineering University on a river in the North, attached to it would be multiple covered slipways,
The latest engineering equipment would be available, private companies could hire the slipways, hopefully bringing work and experience into the area.
The pathway of Special Enterprise Zones with some combination of tax, regulatory (eg. planning) advantages and perhaps direct grants is well mapped. Implementing this requires difficult choices to be made, and the hands of otherwise self-determining agencies (councils, regulators etc) to be directed. This - surely - is the the job of central government; only they have the levers and the power to work across all agencies.
I read that our new government will commit £100bn to the former "red wall" constituencies. This is fine, but I would like to see this money committed with a long term vision in mind, and the political will to subordinate existing interests where necessary.
Governments, just like company management teams, have a responsibility to make choices between attractive alternatives and then to drive successful execution. What is required is vision and sufficient political will.
Perhaps - with a decent majority, a reasonable economy and the likelihood of regaining authorities ceded to the EU - Boris and his team have an opportunity here to achieve more than many (most!) of their predecessors?
I read that our new government will commit £100bn to the former "red wall" constituencies. This is fine, but I would like to see this money committed with a long term vision in mind, and the political will to subordinate existing interests where necessary.
Governments, just like company management teams, have a responsibility to make choices between attractive alternatives and then to drive successful execution. What is required is vision and sufficient political will.
Perhaps - with a decent majority, a reasonable economy and the likelihood of regaining authorities ceded to the EU - Boris and his team have an opportunity here to achieve more than many (most!) of their predecessors?
Edited by WindyCommon on Saturday 21st December 10:21
Vanden Saab said:
That is industry not manufacturing. We are the 8th biggest (depending on which figures you believe) manufacturer in the world and have pretty much full employment. Our economy is far better balanced AFAICS, why would we want to increase industrial output. It is on the whole Noisy, dirty, hard on the people who work in it and bad for the environment.
Because we're still consumers, and all we've done is move the dirt, noise and pollution to other countries.We can manufacture to a better standard, with better working conditions but it costs the consumer more for the ultimately the same product (for example who cares if UK clothing lasts longer if it'll be out of fashion in 12 months anyway?).
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