British summer time

[Dr Jekyll]

I'm tempted to go back to GMT+1 all year round. Anyone else remember going to school in the dark?

[Cold]

This discussion's inevitability is as reliable as the clocks changing.

[gregs656]

I'd like to try it.

The dates of the changes aren't great in Britain, BST ends too early and starts too late.

[Haltamer]

https://www.timeanddate.com/sun/uk/london

I'd agree with the above. Shuffling the changeover left slightly would be nice; I'd much prefer the additional light in the evenings.

[fat80b]

I went with GMT all year round. and have never quite understood the arguments as to why we can't do that.

It usually seems to come down to Scottish farmers - Not sure why the time on a watch makes any difference to their day?

or road safety - why is evening darkness somehow safer than morning darkness? - presumably it is by some stats somewhere otherwise it wouldn't be said.....

[Scotty2]

Why don't we shift it by 1/2 and hour and stick with that?

[louiebaby]

If we can have people cooking their dinner during daylight hours, it really helps to balance the national grid.

[Swervin_Mervin]

gregs656 said:

I'd like to try it.

The dates of the changes aren't great in Britain, BST ends too early and starts too late.

7mo on BST, 5 on GMT at present.

It's a curious system isn't it? I mean, the solution to gaining some extra working light in the evening is to change time itself, rather than just change your working hours.

[ScotHill]

Whatever the UK decides I think Scotland should run ten minutes ahead of that, just so we can look strong and decisive while Westminster flails around as a blustering copycat.

[ScotHill]

Failing that, it doesn't really matter what happens in the summer as there's so much daylight, so as long as GMT is still in the winter I don't really mind if the clocks change or not.

[FunkyNige]

fat80b said:

I went with GMT all year round. and have never quite understood the arguments as to why we can't do that.

It usually seems to come down to Scottish farmers - Not sure why the time on a watch makes any difference to their day?

or road safety - why is evening darkness somehow safer than morning darkness? - presumably it is by some stats somewhere otherwise it wouldn't be said.....

It's so we don't have both commutes in darkness - if we didn't change the time it would be 9am sunrise and 5pm sunset late December, changing the clocks makes it 8am sunrise and 4pm sunset so at least the morning commute is in daylight.
Spain is the crazy one, they are on the same longitude as us but use the same time as central Europe (Franco wanted to be closer to Germany so changed it, they were the same as us).

[gregs656]

Swervin_Mervin said:

7mo on BST, 5 on GMT at present.

It's a curious system isn't it? I mean, the solution to gaining some extra working light in the evening is to change time itself, rather than just change your working hours.

Ontario is 8 and 4, and it works better IMO. The day lengths on the 'change days' are more similar.

[Biggy Stardust]

I don't get the extra hour's sleep anyway; I have a cat.

[louiebaby]

FunkyNige said:

It's so we don't have both commutes in darkness - if we didn't change the time it would be 9am sunrise and 5pm sunset late December, changing the clocks makes it 8am sunrise and 4pm sunset so at least the morning commute is in daylight.

Spain is the crazy one, they are on the same longitude as us but use the same time as central Europe (Franco wanted to be closer to Germany so changed it, they were the same as us).

Good points on the commute. Maybe it would make sense to have the drive home in the light, since people are more tired at the end of the day?

Isn't London on the same Meridian as Paris? Yet they're an hour ahead?

[Swervin_Mervin]

FunkyNige said:

fat80b said:

I went with GMT all year round. and have never quite understood the arguments as to why we can't do that.

It usually seems to come down to Scottish farmers - Not sure why the time on a watch makes any difference to their day?

or road safety - why is evening darkness somehow safer than morning darkness? - presumably it is by some stats somewhere otherwise it wouldn't be said.....

It's so we don't have both commutes in darkness - if we didn't change the time it would be 9am sunrise and 5pm sunset late December, changing the clocks makes it 8am sunrise and 4pm sunset so at least the morning commute is in daylight.
Spain is the crazy one, they are on the same longitude as us but use the same time as central Europe (Franco wanted to be closer to Germany so changed it, they were the same as us).

It wouldn't be 5pm sunsets in December - GMT is the norm, not BST i.e. we change TO BST, not from it (so to speak)

ETA: Spain has been discussing moving back to UTC AFAIK as they grapple with a cultural attachment to light nights and early starts but a reduction in midday breaks.

Edited by Swervin_Mervin on Monday 19th October 15:29

[Vincecj]

GMT+1 in the Winter and GMT+2 in the Summer

[Johnnytheboy]

Have a listen to the last few minutes of the Today Programme from this AM on BBC Sounds. They got a sleep psychologist (?) and Peter Hitchens on, and.... they agreed that changing the clocks was a Bad Thing.

I agree 100% with Hitchens: when we aren't on GMT we are just lying about what the time is.

People who want more light in the evenings should just start their days earlier instead of making the rest of us go along with their fiction.

[ScotHill]

Johnnytheboy said:

I agree 100% with Hitchens: when we aren't on GMT we are just lying about what the time is.

The time is a human invention anyway, at least hours minutes and second, but what exactly is it that dictates that 00:00GMT or 12:00GMT is the 'correct' time at that point in time, according to the logic above? I'm assuming it's something to do with the position of the sun at a certain time, maybe on a certain day of the year, but beyond that I wasn't paying attention at school.

[motco]

ScotHill said:

Johnnytheboy said:

I agree 100% with Hitchens: when we aren't on GMT we are just lying about what the time is.

The time is a human invention anyway, at least hours minutes and second, but what exactly is it that dictates that 00:00GMT or 12:00GMT is the 'correct' time at that point in time, according to the logic above? I'm assuming it's something to do with the position of the sun at a certain time, maybe on a certain day of the year, but beyond that I wasn't paying attention at school.

Twelve noon is midday which is when the sun is at it's highest point and, at Greenwich, due south. It is a fact of geography which cannot be altered. Unlike your working hours...

[gazapc]

A comprimise would be shift the clocks forward at the end of February rather than the end of March. That way we are equally timed <2 months either side of the winter solstice.The current situation leads to the whole of March having very light mornings and dark evenings. It would also mitigate the Scot's concerns.

Johnnytheboy said:

People who want more light in the evenings should just start their days earlier instead of making the rest of us go along with their fiction.

Or people who want more light in the mornings could just get up earlier?
In March, far more people are up and about at say 1820 rather than 0620 when the sun currently rises, so it is not a minority of people.