Bit Coin mining needs a power station
Discussion
Isnt Bit coin mining using loads of power a crazy idea?
https://www.bbc.co.uk/news/av/technology-58020010
Surely the coins could be generated virtually without using any power?
https://www.bbc.co.uk/news/av/technology-58020010
Surely the coins could be generated virtually without using any power?
Yes it is and no it can’t
The actual work of mining crypto takes a lot of processing power and that has to be done somewhere.
The talk of people buying power stations and countries selling their infrastructure for mining is the logical next step to crypto becoming a boom investment market.
It’s bonkers though. Literally burning through huge amounts of resources for what in most instances amounts to pyramid or pump and dump schemes.
The actual work of mining crypto takes a lot of processing power and that has to be done somewhere.
The talk of people buying power stations and countries selling their infrastructure for mining is the logical next step to crypto becoming a boom investment market.
It’s bonkers though. Literally burning through huge amounts of resources for what in most instances amounts to pyramid or pump and dump schemes.
saaby93 said:
Surely the coins could be generated virtually without using any power?
Crypto currency mining requires substantial amounts of very hard maths. This takes power. And do quickly enough to be viable - a lot of power.A quick Google suggests 1 Bitcoin requires ~1.5MW to mine. Not my numbers and seems a lot. But still.
Edit; good story from a few years back here.
https://www.politico.com/magazine/story/2018/03/09...
Edited by Mr E on Sunday 15th August 07:23
You’re not understanding what they are or what virtual means.
Just because something doesn’t have a physical presence doesn’t mean that it doesn’t cost anything to create. A computer somewhere is working to make it and this uses resources.
Each coin has complex encryption to make it virtually impossible to copy. This is what gives them value, it also means you need a lot of computing power to mine new ones.
Just because something doesn’t have a physical presence doesn’t mean that it doesn’t cost anything to create. A computer somewhere is working to make it and this uses resources.
Each coin has complex encryption to make it virtually impossible to copy. This is what gives them value, it also means you need a lot of computing power to mine new ones.
saaby93 said:
Why cant it?
If theyre virtual all you have to do is say yes when someone wants to buy one.
How much do £50 notes cost to produce?
If there is no material involved surely they should cost nothing to make = no energy used.
The whole point is that, unlike pounds and dollars, you cannot "just" magic up another few trillion of them. The system requires computational work which cannot be avoided. So it requires power.If theyre virtual all you have to do is say yes when someone wants to buy one.
How much do £50 notes cost to produce?
If there is no material involved surely they should cost nothing to make = no energy used.
saaby93 said:
Why cant it?
If theyre virtual all you have to do is say yes when someone wants to buy one.
How much do £50 notes cost to produce?
If there is no material involved surely they should cost nothing to make = no energy used.
Ah. A crash course in blockchain here needed. If theyre virtual all you have to do is say yes when someone wants to buy one.
How much do £50 notes cost to produce?
If there is no material involved surely they should cost nothing to make = no energy used.
Bit coin (and other crypto currency) isn’t just something that’s issued. You can’t just make more.
The point is that there is genuinely a finite amount of possible solutions to the blockchain maths, and ergo a finite number of bitcoins ever. And anyone can mine them by solving equations. By hand if you like.
Very simply. Think of it like prime numbers. If I said “my new currency is backed by prime numbers, and if you can find and prove you know a prime first, you get a token linked to that prime that is unique.
The first 20 are trivial and can be done in your head. The next 50 might take an hour on a bit of paper. Once you’re a few hundred primes in, you’ve written a bit of code. When you’re looking for stuff with a few million digits, you it’s very computationally intense, and requires a lot of power.
ZedLeg said:
You’re not understanding what they are or what virtual means.
Just because something doesn’t have a physical presence doesn’t mean that it doesn’t cost anything to create. A computer somewhere is working to make it and this uses resources.
Each coin has complex encryption to make it virtually impossible to copy. This is what gives them value, it also means you need a lot of computing power to mine new ones.
It's that process that I'm querying with this thread.Just because something doesn’t have a physical presence doesn’t mean that it doesn’t cost anything to create. A computer somewhere is working to make it and this uses resources.
Each coin has complex encryption to make it virtually impossible to copy. This is what gives them value, it also means you need a lot of computing power to mine new ones.
If you take the virtual £50 note example with no material costs - all it needs is to be created at some issuer with a unique serial number.
Generation of web domain names is an example of something unique created for no material cost but many with some value.
Car registration numbers the same.
Edited by saaby93 on Sunday 15th August 07:35
saaby93 said:
Why cant it?
If theyre virtual all you have to do is say yes when someone wants to buy one.
How much do £50 notes cost to produce?
If there is no material involved surely they should cost nothing to make = no energy used.
About 13p to print a polymer banknote.If theyre virtual all you have to do is say yes when someone wants to buy one.
How much do £50 notes cost to produce?
If there is no material involved surely they should cost nothing to make = no energy used.
What’s powering all these ‘free’ virtual machines?
saaby93 said:
ZedLeg said:
You’re not understanding what they are or what virtual means.
Just because something doesn’t have a physical presence doesn’t mean that it doesn’t cost anything to create. A computer somewhere is working to make it and this uses resources.
Each coin has complex encryption to make it virtually impossible to copy. This is what gives them value, it also means you need a lot of computing power to mine new ones.
It's that process that I'm querying with this thread.Just because something doesn’t have a physical presence doesn’t mean that it doesn’t cost anything to create. A computer somewhere is working to make it and this uses resources.
Each coin has complex encryption to make it virtually impossible to copy. This is what gives them value, it also means you need a lot of computing power to mine new ones.
If you take the virtual £50 note example with no material costs - all it needs is to be created at some issuer with a unique serial number.
Generation of web domain names is an example of something unique created for no material cost but many with some value.
Mr E said:
Ah. A crash course in blockchain here needed.
Bit coin (and other crypto currency) isn’t just something that’s issued. You can’t just make more.
The point is that there is genuinely a finite amount of possible solutions to the blockchain maths, and ergo a finite number of bitcoins ever. And anyone can mine them by solving equations. By hand if you like.
Very simply. Think of it like prime numbers. If I said “my new currency is backed by prime numbers, and if you can find and prove you know a prime first, you get a token linked to that prime that is unique.
The first 20 are trivial and can be done in your head. The next 50 might take an hour on a bit of paper. Once you’re a few hundred primes in, you’ve written a bit of code. When you’re looking for stuff with a few million digits, you it’s very computationally intense, and requires a lot of power.
Okay, so once you have found your 'prime number' that nobody else has you have created a bitcoin. How does that get converted into real money that I can buy a Ferrari with?Bit coin (and other crypto currency) isn’t just something that’s issued. You can’t just make more.
The point is that there is genuinely a finite amount of possible solutions to the blockchain maths, and ergo a finite number of bitcoins ever. And anyone can mine them by solving equations. By hand if you like.
Very simply. Think of it like prime numbers. If I said “my new currency is backed by prime numbers, and if you can find and prove you know a prime first, you get a token linked to that prime that is unique.
The first 20 are trivial and can be done in your head. The next 50 might take an hour on a bit of paper. Once you’re a few hundred primes in, you’ve written a bit of code. When you’re looking for stuff with a few million digits, you it’s very computationally intense, and requires a lot of power.
saaby93 said:
It's that process that I'm querying with this thread.
If you take the virtual £50 note example with no material costs - all it needs is to be created at some issuer with a unique serial number.
Generation of web domain names is an example of something unique created for no material cost but many with some value.
Car registration numbers the same.
Remember that with the examples you cite someone is in control of those (basically Government when you get to the top).If you take the virtual £50 note example with no material costs - all it needs is to be created at some issuer with a unique serial number.
Generation of web domain names is an example of something unique created for no material cost but many with some value.
Car registration numbers the same.
That isn't the case with most cryptocurrencies as the whole point is they're decentralised which is what makes them attractive to some people.
saaby93 said:
Mr E shows what the process is and why this thread is querying it.
It doesnt show why there cant be a simpler process as per the creation of unique domain names or car registration numbers
There can be if you like. Feel free to issue your own currency based on serial numbers that you decide. It doesnt show why there cant be a simpler process as per the creation of unique domain names or car registration numbers
How will you convince other people of it’s inherent store of value?
(The only reason some people think there’s inherent value in blockchain is that you cannot just create more. There is a finite amount available, and it’s increasingly hard to find)
saaby93 said:
Mr E shows what the process is and why this thread is querying it.
It doesnt show why there cant be a simpler process as per the creation of unique domain names or car registration numbers
There is a simpler system. We have it now with pounds and dollars. The ruling class rob everyone by "creating" more of them at the click of a button and giving them all to their mates for dodgy PPE and testing businesses.It doesnt show why there cant be a simpler process as per the creation of unique domain names or car registration numbers
That is what Bitcoin etc are intended to prevent.
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