Racist orchestra?
Discussion
Biggus thingus said:
If they have 14 replacement musicians that are at least as good as the 14 they have let go, and that tick all the necessary diversity boxes that they feel they need to be ticking, then fair enough I guess.If they don't, then they are being stupid and need to be called out on it and they should be being advised of the diversity of opportunity, not outcome.
The article notes they hired 12 new musicians, but doesn't note what diversity criteria they tick. And even with 12 it would leave them seemingly 2 down.
Maybe "diversity" was just used as a smokescreen to get rid of deadwood.
Kes Arevo said:
It reads precisely what was done. You are not rehired because skin colour, sexuality, gender. The new people were hired because of skin colour/sexuality/gender.
Playing devil’s advocate, maybe the ones who have been there for years were hired because of skin colour/sexuality/gender. Now there have been new auditions maybe the new people have been hired on the basis of musical skill, regardless of skin colour/sexuality/gender.
Kes Arevo said:
thebraketester said:
It's what was done.
It reads precisely what was done. You are not rehired because skin colour, sexuality, gender. The new people were hired because of skin colour/sexuality/gender.https://englishtouringopera.org.uk/news/english-to...
Of course, the eto would have to be pretty frikin special to admit theyd decided based on race/ethnicity grounds!
Can't help feeling they'd have done better to adopt blind auditions. When I performed music as a youngster, competitions would have judges behind a curtain to avoid bias.
Still, accusations of racism coming from white people (who typically have far better outcomes in the UK) are going to ring pretty hollow in most people's ears....read the room guys, this just sounds like you want the status quo to remain unchallenged.
Scrump said:
Playing devil’s advocate, maybe the ones who have been there for years were hired because of skin colour/sexuality/gender.
Now there have been new auditions maybe the new people have been hired on the basis of musical skill, regardless of skin colour/sexuality/gender.
If that were the case, they would be hiring on ability, and not based on diversity. Now there have been new auditions maybe the new people have been hired on the basis of musical skill, regardless of skin colour/sexuality/gender.
Ian Geary said:
Kes Arevo said:
thebraketester said:
It's what was done.
It reads precisely what was done. You are not rehired because skin colour, sexuality, gender. The new people were hired because of skin colour/sexuality/gender.https://englishtouringopera.org.uk/news/english-to...
Of course, the eto would have to be pretty frikin special to admit theyd decided based on race/ethnicity grounds!
Can't help feeling they'd have done better to adopt blind auditions. When I performed music as a youngster, competitions would have judges behind a curtain to avoid bias.
Still, accusations of racism coming from white people (who typically have far better outcomes in the UK) are going to ring pretty hollow in most people's ears....read the room guys, this just sounds like you want the status quo to remain unchallenged.
Ian Geary said:
Still, accusations of racism coming from white people (who typically have far better outcomes in the UK) are going to ring pretty hollow in most people's ears....read the room guys, this just sounds like you want the status quo to remain unchallenged.
Discrimination based on skin colour is bad, unless that skin colour is white, in which case meh?Righto.
If they are discriminating based on arbitrary characteristics, f
k em.Kes Arevo said:
Scrump said:
Playing devil’s advocate, maybe the ones who have been there for years were hired because of skin colour/sexuality/gender.
Now there have been new auditions maybe the new people have been hired on the basis of musical skill, regardless of skin colour/sexuality/gender.
If that were the case, they would be hiring on ability, and not based on diversity. Now there have been new auditions maybe the new people have been hired on the basis of musical skill, regardless of skin colour/sexuality/gender.
“ The auditions were immensely rewarding and exciting; several musicians were offered opportunities to work with English Touring Opera for the first time, based on their ability.”
https://englishtouringopera.org.uk/news/english-to...
I read that as they held open auditions. This may have had the effect of a more diverse orchestra, particularly if previous contracts had not been made based purely on musical skills
Or maybe not.
Scrump said:
They have not said they hired based on diversity. They say they based on ability:
“ The auditions were immensely rewarding and exciting; several musicians were offered opportunities to work with English Touring Opera for the first time, based on their ability.”
https://englishtouringopera.org.uk/news/english-to...
I read that as they held open auditions. This may have had the effect of a more diverse orchestra, particularly if previous contracts had not been made based purely on musical skills
Or maybe not.
Hence why I said skin colour/sexuality/gender.“ The auditions were immensely rewarding and exciting; several musicians were offered opportunities to work with English Touring Opera for the first time, based on their ability.”
https://englishtouringopera.org.uk/news/english-to...
I read that as they held open auditions. This may have had the effect of a more diverse orchestra, particularly if previous contracts had not been made based purely on musical skills
Or maybe not.
Scrump said:
Kes Arevo said:
Hence why I said skin colour/sexuality/gender.
Kes Arevo said:
If that were the case, they would be hiring on ability, and not based on diversity.
The post that was responding to suggests the new hires were based in a ity, not diversity, and yet they cited diversity.
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