Chinese energy crisis - is this the next big world disaster

[Pistom]

We seem to be lurching from one crisis to the next. With recent news of the energy shortages impacting Chinese manufacturing, it will be interesting to see how this pans out over the coming months.

https://www.theguardian.com/world/2021/sep/30/chin...

[PorkyBlinders]

Yep, just had a warning at our work, with some of our manufactures in China.

Worrying.

[Four Litre]

Crazy times for sure and I cant help thinking we are in for a shock at some point soon.

The thing that concerns me the most is not the event, but peoples behavior and how they deal with it. Recent events like Covid and the self inflicted 'petrol crisis' have demonstrated how close we are to carnage, it wont take much to push things over the edge.

I always thought Mad Max was fantasy, turns out it may of been a premonition!!!

[Gecko1978]

Four Litre said:

Crazy times for sure and I cant help thinking we are in for a shock at some point soon.

The thing that concerns me the most is not the event, but peoples behavior and how they deal with it. Recent events like Covid and the self inflicted 'petrol crisis' have demonstrated how close we are to carnage, it wont take much to push things over the edge.

I always thought Mad Max was fantasy, turns out it may of been a premonition!!!

During COVID pubs closed an you could not leave your home and we fined people for taking a walk with a mate....what did people do, moan on social media, we dont have it in us to riot and over throw the goverment the closest it came was right at the start where the message was "Police by consent" i.e. please obay the law cos we cant control all of you, and we did

[CambsBill]

Wonder if this is another part of the reason for the recent banning of crypto transactions, associated as it is with huge energy usage?

https://www.bbc.co.uk/news/technology-58678907

[Pistom]

CambsBill said:

Wonder if this is another part of the reason for the recent banning of crypto transactions, associated as it is with huge energy usage?

https://www.bbc.co.uk/news/technology-58678907

That's an interesting connection!

[jet_noise]

Better get building those coal power stations

[bodhi]

jet_noise said:

Better get building those coal power stations

From what I can tell it's not a lack of power stations, its a lack of coal to put in them after their fallout with Australia.

Anyone know any other countries with loads of coal deposits they aren't using?

[CloudStuff]

My benchmark for a crisis is BTC < 5k$.

Then it's buy, buy buy!

[Earthdweller]

Pistom said:

CambsBill said:

Wonder if this is another part of the reason for the recent banning of crypto transactions, associated as it is with huge energy usage?

https://www.bbc.co.uk/news/technology-58678907

That's an interesting connection!

It is, a large number of “data centres” have been opened in Ireland recently to the point that their drain on electricity is on the verge of taking down their domestic power supplies with the Govt being unable to guarantee supplies of electricity will not be interrupted this winter


Dr Patrick Bresnihan of National University of Ireland, Maynooth, will tell the Oireachtas Committee on the Environment and Climate Change that while data centres currently represented 11 per cent of grid capacity, the energy used by those existing connections will rise to almost 30 per cent of overall capacity by the end of the decade. If all other data centres proposed for Ireland are allowed, their energy use would comprise 70 per cent of capacity on the national grid.

He said that an average data centre used as much electricity as a small city like Kilkenny. He also said that an average centre was also a large consumer of water, using an estimated 500,000 litres per day.

Dr Bresnihan said that Singapore had become the first country in the world to introduce a moratorium on data centres. It has said it will only lift the moratorium when renewable energy capacity has been increased plus data storage technologies have been sufficiently developed to reduce the energy burden.

“From these figures it is evident that Ireland shoulders more than a fair share of the energy and water burden of global digital activities… In a context where households are facing increased energy bills and carbon taxes, the continued granting of planning permission to energy-intensive data centres is already being perceived as unfair,”

https://www.irishtimes.com/news/politics/data-cent...

[FourWheelDrift]

jet_noise said:

Better get building those coal power stations

China burns enough already not even including their power stations - "The coal burned by China’s aluminium industry provides about 427,000 gigawatt hours of electricity a year. That is sufficient to power all of Scandinavia, or the UK and Netherlands put together" producing 431.27 Mt of CO2 p/a just from the Aluminium industry alone.

https://twitter.com/bopinion/status/14426917723547...

[Ivan stewart]

bodhi said:

jet_noise said:

Better get building those coal power stations

From what I can tell it's not a lack of power stations, its a lack of coal to put in them after their fallout with Australia.

Anyone know any other countries with loads of coal deposits they aren't using?

Maybe we could sell them some , seems we have a fair bit left !!

[garagewidow]

Earthdweller said:

Pistom said:

CambsBill said:

Wonder if this is another part of the reason for the recent banning of crypto transactions, associated as it is with huge energy usage?

https://www.bbc.co.uk/news/technology-58678907

That's an interesting connection!

It is, a large number of “data centres” have been opened in Ireland recently to the point that their drain on electricity is on the verge of taking down their domestic power supplies with the Govt being unable to guarantee supplies of electricity will not be interrupted this winter


Dr Patrick Bresnihan of National University of Ireland, Maynooth, will tell the Oireachtas Committee on the Environment and Climate Change that while data centres currently represented 11 per cent of grid capacity, the energy used by those existing connections will rise to almost 30 per cent of overall capacity by the end of the decade. If all other data centres proposed for Ireland are allowed, their energy use would comprise 70 per cent of capacity on the national grid.

He said that an average data centre used as much electricity as a small city like Kilkenny. He also said that an average centre was also a large consumer of water, using an estimated 500,000 litres per day.

Dr Bresnihan said that Singapore had become the first country in the world to introduce a moratorium on data centres. It has said it will only lift the moratorium when renewable energy capacity has been increased plus data storage technologies have been sufficiently developed to reduce the energy burden.

“From these figures it is evident that Ireland shoulders more than a fair share of the energy and water burden of global digital activities… In a context where households are facing increased energy bills and carbon taxes, the continued granting of planning permission to energy-intensive data centres is already being perceived as unfair,”

https://www.irishtimes.com/news/politics/data-cent...

It's the only way any type of crypto can have any 'worth'.

To have value it has to be a proxy of energy consumption,ie,difficult to obtain and/or limited in supply otherwise anyone can start their own currency but where does its value come from.

[crankedup5]

bodhi said:

jet_noise said:

Better get building those coal power stations

From what I can tell it's not a lack of power stations, its a lack of coal to put in them after their fallout with Australia.

Anyone know any other countries with loads of coal deposits they aren't using?

Germany might be worth a punt.

[arguti]

bodhi said:

From what I can tell it's not a lack of power stations, its a lack of coal to put in them after their fallout with Australia.

Anyone know any other countries with loads of coal deposits they aren't using?

https://www.businessinsider.co.za/the-new-coal-power-station-in-limpopo-will-only-be-used-by-the-chinese-heres-why-its-an-irrational-project-2018-9

And the South Africans thought they were getting extra electricity!

In fact, subsequent to the above and decreased capacity in the South African electricity grid, it turns out that of the premium South African coal is being exported to China.

For further information, see rest Africa or if lazy, google Chinese debt democracy in Africa if you were concerned about Chinese expansion in the South China Sea.

They have been hoovering up the South African mining sector to get control of the strategic minerals, especially those that were exempt from all US sanctions imposed on South Africa during Apartheid.

Edited by arguti on Thursday 30th September 15:29

[PopsandBangs]

Jesus Christ.... the world is a complete stshow at the moment

We are an Electronic Component MFR with subbed factories in China....this has suddenly reared it's head and is going to seriously affect things.... if it wasn't already the perfect storm with raw materials prices, chinese labour prices, RMB/USD, extraordinary shipping increase costs etc etc etc.

As a side note, I swear the world and life has really noticeably taken a MASSIVE nose dive in the last 5 years..... without getting political there was brexit, then trump, division division, division, anger, misinformation, social media division and bks, Hong Kong being grabbed fully by CCP, pandemic, no free world travel, fuel shortage at the moment and panic, afghanistan, energy crises, economic issues everywhere, high street dying, nutter Evironmental protesters..... just too much to mention.

Feels like the end of days maybe need to stop watching the fking "news". But i'm sure back in 2013/14/15/early 16 the world felt a lot more chilled and happy go lucky and ticking over nicely despite the odd issue here and there (namely terrorist attacks) on the whole things were good........

Edited by PopsandBangs on Thursday 30th September 16:04

Edited by PopsandBangs on Thursday 30th September 16:05

Edited by PopsandBangs on Thursday 30th September 16:05

[HorneyMX5]

I feel the same, it does seem like an incoming tide of madness. Maybe this is when the west crumbles?

I’ll be really annoyed if the preppers are right. Those guys are so annoying. &#128514;

[Register1]

FourWheelDrift said:

jet_noise said:

Better get building those coal power stations

China burns enough already not even including their power stations - "The coal burned by China’s aluminium industry provides about 427,000 gigawatt hours of electricity a year. That is sufficient to power all of Scandinavia, or the UK and Netherlands put together" producing 431.27 Mt of CO2 p/a just from the Aluminium industry alone.

https://twitter.com/bopinion/status/14426917723547...

Many folk here, just have no idea how big a manufacturing nation China is.
China manufacturing is vast in every dimension.

[Register1]

arguti said:

bodhi said:

From what I can tell it's not a lack of power stations, its a lack of coal to put in them after their fallout with Australia.

Anyone know any other countries with loads of coal deposits they aren't using?

https://www.businessinsider.co.za/the-new-coal-power-station-in-limpopo-will-only-be-used-by-the-chinese-heres-why-its-an-irrational-project-2018-9

And the South Africans thought they were getting extra electricity!

In fact, subsequent to the above and decreased capacity in the South African electricity grid, it turns out that of the premium South African coal is being exported to China.

For further information, see rest Africa or if lazy, google Chinese debt democracy in Africa if you were concerned about Chinese expansion in the South China Sea.

They have been hoovering up the South African mining sector to get control of the strategic minerals, especially those that were exempt from all US sanctions imposed on South Africa during Apartheid.

Edited by arguti on Thursday 30th September 15:29

RSA have totally crap power stations, that are either broken, or out of service for corrupt officials to make their buck.

To get around this, the clear point objective, is for the Chinese to build their own powerstation.
Ultimately reliable, and if there is any excess, they could consider selling it.

[arguti]

Register1 said:

RSA have totally crap power stations, that are either broken, or out of service for corrupt officials to make their buck.

To get around this, the clear point objective, is for the Chinese to build their own powerstation.
Ultimately reliable, and if there is any excess, they could consider selling it.

Totally agree, the latest power station commissioned in South Africa in august 2021 is already out of action having blown up a substantial portion of it due to staff not following procedures. As with power, the Chinese have been allowed to run their own police force in South Africa as the local force is inadequate to protect Chinese assets.

https://www.thechemicalengineer.com/news/explosion...