Alliance of British Drivers Challenge Climate Crisis

[bad company]

I was shocked to read this apparent ‘fact check’. Any thoughts?

https://www.abd.org.uk/global-climate-crisis-fact-...

[ScotHill]

bad company said:

I was shocked to read this apparent ‘fact check’. Any thoughts?

https://www.abd.org.uk/global-climate-crisis-fact-...

What has that got to do with Driving Sense, ergo hidden agenda, ergo ignore.

---
In 2004, the then chief constable of North Wales Police, Richard Brunstrom, described the Association of British Drivers a an "unduly influential … pressure group." He added, "They have less than 3,000 members, yet they are given enormous attention by the media. … It's ludicrous — this is a bunch of crackpots being given prime airtime. It's just because the media love a controversy."[15]

In 2020, Alan Wenban-Smith, visiting professor of planning at Birmingham City University and a consultant in urban and regional policy,[16] in a letter to the editor published in the Local Transport Today journal, described ABD as "climate change sceptics," who promote the idea that "climate science is not sufficiently robust to bear the weight placed upon it by decarbonisation." Wenban-Smith characterised the group as "lobbyists with obvious axes to grind, who have found ‘stuff on the internet’ from eccentrics and obsessives," and hold "biased and fringe views."[17] Paul Morozzo, a Greenpeace transport campaigner, called the ABD's intention to raise speed limits a "crackpot idea", while the London Cycling Campaign's Simon Munk called it "an organisation notorious for its fringe views on driving and road safety"
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[garagewidow]

Well.

Now i'm confused.

I don't know WHAT to believe.

[CraigyMc]

bad company said:

I was shocked to read this apparent ‘fact check’. Any thoughts?

https://www.abd.org.uk/global-climate-crisis-fact-...

I wonder what the venn diagram is for these guys in other fields. Conspiracy theories, anti-vaxx, etc.

I expect there would be quite a correlation between not believing in stuff you don't want to, and being self-selecting as a "no" to most things reasonable people are for.

[46and2]

Alliance of British Drivers, 3000 members.

Walt thread?

Edited by 46and2 on Friday 5th November 15:29

Edited by 46and2 on Friday 5th November 15:29

[bad company]

I’d love to believe the ABD’s message but . . . . .

[eharding]

46and2 said:

Alliance of British Drivers, 3000 members.

Walt thread?

3000 members at £25 a head per annum (£40 if you want paper copies of the quarterly newsletter) means a nice little not-for-profit earner for somebody, assuming they're not telling porkies about membership numbers. What are they spending the cash on?

[CraigyMc]

eharding said:

46and2 said:

Alliance of British Drivers, 3000 members.

Walt thread?

3000 members at £25 a head per annum (£40 if you want paper copies of the quarterly newsletter) means a nice little not-for-profit earner for somebody, assuming they're not telling porkies about membership numbers. What are they spending the cash on?

The ABD appears to me to be effectively a brand of pro-motor Ltd, which is controlled by its directors. (companies house link -> https://find-and-update.company-information.servic... )

It doesn't appear to be a charity on paper, just a company.

I would opine that it looks like the membership fees effectively get distributed out to the directors, who are all older people (birth dates from 1947 to 1958 inclusive -- although the secretary doesn't appear to have that data public).

Looking back at the previous directors, they are much the same sort of thing, and there are a lot of them...

[foxbody-87]

Maybe I’m a bit of a tinfoil hatter but it seems that most of these seemingly altruistic movements (climate change, BLM, etc) seem to be driven by people who essentially want to faust their worldview on others. You can’t help feeling that although there is probably a lot of sound science behind it, a lot of the ‘measures’ being advocated are a load of old bks that will be a drop in the ocean.
I suppose COP26 was a success in that 40+ countries have agreed to eliminate industrial coal use. Apart from India, China and the USA of course! Whilst we are pissing around banning gas boilers and petrol cars they will be quite literally steamrollering us, economically. But that’s probably a good thing in the long run for the planet as the evidence suggests as GDP rises so does environmental awareness so with any hope once living standards in China and India improve they will probably start working towards greener industry. Just because we’ve had our industrial revolution and the corresponding benefits doesn’t mean we get to stunt their development because ‘we know best’.

[bad company]

I was a member of the ABD some years ago as they helped campaign against constantly reducing speed limits. They did some good work and had a few positive results.

As I said earlier though while I’d love to believe this press release I can’t help thinking it’s almost certainly b******s.

[mike9009]

It doesn't take much digging

First claim with reference debunked

https://www.meereisportal.de/en/seaicetrends/month...

The polar bear claim is from a one woman website. I cannot be bothered to dig through her website, but the reduction in hunting polar bears might have something to do with it. <Waits for someone with another agenda to do some deeper digging on it - thanks>

[Vanden Saab]

mike9009 said:

It doesn't take much digging

First claim with reference debunked

https://www.meereisportal.de/en/seaicetrends/month...

The polar bear claim is from a one woman website. I cannot be bothered to dig through her website, but the reduction in hunting polar bears might have something to do with it. <Waits for someone with another agenda to do some deeper digging on it - thanks>

How is the claim debunked you have just linked their own link
When was hunting for polar bears banned?

[Ivan stewart]

Better to join the RAC or AA If you hate cars , freedom and the economy..

[Essel]

ScotHill said:

bad company said:

I was shocked to read this apparent ‘fact check’. Any thoughts?

https://www.abd.org.uk/global-climate-crisis-fact-...

What has that got to do with Driving Sense, ergo hidden agenda, ergo ignore.

---
In 2004, the then chief constable of North Wales Police, Richard Brunstrom, described the Association of British Drivers a an "unduly influential … pressure group." He added, "They have less than 3,000 members, yet they are given enormous attention by the media. … It's ludicrous — this is a bunch of crackpots being given prime airtime. It's just because the media love a controversy."[15]

As opposed to the association of chief police officers with about 350 members?
https://en.m.wikipedia.org/wiki/Association_of_Chi...

No axe to grind, I haven't checked out the ABD

[RichB]

bad company said:

I was a member of the ABD some years ago as they helped campaign against constantly reducing speed limits. They did some good work and had a few positive results. As I said earlier though while I’d love to believe this press release I can’t help thinking it’s almost certainly b******s.

I joined, like a number of us on Pistonheads several years ago when their message focused on unreasonable speed limits, an overabundance of speed cameras, calling out speed humps that were too high and arguing against city congestion charges. Recently I challenged some of their press releases on Facebook because, as a member, I do not want their energies focused on climate change (for whatever reason) but on key motoring issues. Their PR bloke blasted back saying that climate change is a key issue for the ABD. I must confess I will probably cancel my direct debit as they no longer represent my views.

[Countdown]

Ivan stewart said:

Better to join the RAC or AA If you hate cars , freedom and the economy..

Don't forget democracy and our judeo-christian way of life.

[bad company]

RichB said:

bad company said:

I was a member of the ABD some years ago as they helped campaign against constantly reducing speed limits. They did some good work and had a few positive results. As I said earlier though while I’d love to believe this press release I can’t help thinking it’s almost certainly b******s.

I joined, like a number of us on Pistonheads several years ago when their message focused on unreasonable speed limits, an overabundance of speed cameras, calling out speed humps that were too high and arguing against city congestion charges. Recently I challenged some of their press releases on Facebook because, as a member, I do not want their energies focused on climate change (for whatever reason) but on key motoring issues. Their PR bloke blasted back saying that climate change is a key issue for the ABD. I must confess I will probably cancel my direct debit as they no longer represent my views.

Yes, that just about sums it up. I cancelled my direct debit about 3 years ago but still receive their bumph, I wonder if they still count me as a member?

[mike9009]

Vanden Saab said:

mike9009 said:

It doesn't take much digging

First claim with reference debunked

https://www.meereisportal.de/en/seaicetrends/month...

The polar bear claim is from a one woman website. I cannot be bothered to dig through her website, but the reduction in hunting polar bears might have something to do with it. <Waits for someone with another agenda to do some deeper digging on it - thanks>

How is the claim debunked you have just linked their own link
When was hunting for polar bears banned?

Polar bear hunting stopped in various countries between 1957 and 1973. I wonder why the population increased from 1960.....

I wasn't going to answer because I knew the ABD stat was true but associated with the wrong root cause......

[RECr]

It's a shame that about the only group that seriously pushes back against the likes of BRAKE etc takes political positions on issues that are, at best, tangentially connected to motoring. It just reduces the amount of people who might otherwise be sympathetic to them.

How much influence do they exert these days anyway though? I've not seen them comment when a motoring issue appears in the media for years. I believe that speed cameras being yellow was as a result of their influence but that must be nearly twenty years ago (before I was driving).

[RichB]

RECr said:

It's a shame that about the only group that seriously pushes back against the likes of BRAKE etc takes political positions on issues that are, at best, tangentially connected to motoring...

Yep, I'm out.