PH - Racism - symptoms and root cause
Discussion
Reading some of the polarised and partisan vitriol posted on PH in the context of abhorrent events around the world boils my piss. NPE is notoriously toxic.
Having suffered from racism in childhood (btw only a non victim could ever swallow Farage's no malice intended/harmless banter racist cowardice); I despair at the entitled pontification around here as well as the victim blaming. Most of it IMHO misses the point entirely by talking about the symptom...ie debating the latest event. No one talks about the underlying root cause; and in a way the posters' partisanship and approach reflects the sick environment which is itself part of the root cause.
Now, we're not going to change the world on PH. No, real change requires leaders to grow some balls and start addressing the human emotions of loss, injustice, inequality, impotence, anger and revenge which drives the radicalisation that in turn manifests itself in Bondi and countless other racially/religion motivated outrages.
Anti-semitism is deep rooted, eg treatment of characters like Shylock. It should have had its day a long time ago; along with other forms of discrimination on the basis of race, ethnicity or religion. So when the Israeli government levels Gaza, starves its population, excludes world media, attacks hospitals as reprisal against Hamas, how can that possibly help resolve the wider long term Middle East problem? We could all cite other horrifying examples of religious/ethnic cleansing in addition to the Holocaust.
There was a (now closed thread) about Maccabi Tel Aviv fans being banned from a football match (FFS it is a just a footy game). Yet everyone got lathered up, PM waded in and all politicians called out the Safety Committee decision to stop Maccabi fans from coming to Brum as anti-semitic. It was based upon WMP intelligence that Maccabi fans were racist thugs, but that is now hotly disputed. Well after their next away match, UEFA has fined and imposed a suspended ban on Maccabi for "racist and/or discriminatory behaviour" by its supporters during last week's Europa League game at German side Stuttgart. Pot kettle black comes to mind, which makes much of the PH posturing by the "usual suspects" (used on PH as a derogatory term at others who don't share that partisan line) all look frankly ridiculous.
Rather than throw vitriol at each other, can we please redirect some positive energy at world/religious leaders to reset the root causes of racial/religious prejudices. They are the ones with the platform, so they have responsibility to adapt their language tone and actions to engender public conciliation and calm. As for ourselves, a little inward reflection please, less partisan pontification; instead a positive contribution to breaking down barriers might help as a first step. I believe most PHers are decent humans, but that doesn't consistentky come across in NPE.
Having suffered from racism in childhood (btw only a non victim could ever swallow Farage's no malice intended/harmless banter racist cowardice); I despair at the entitled pontification around here as well as the victim blaming. Most of it IMHO misses the point entirely by talking about the symptom...ie debating the latest event. No one talks about the underlying root cause; and in a way the posters' partisanship and approach reflects the sick environment which is itself part of the root cause.
Now, we're not going to change the world on PH. No, real change requires leaders to grow some balls and start addressing the human emotions of loss, injustice, inequality, impotence, anger and revenge which drives the radicalisation that in turn manifests itself in Bondi and countless other racially/religion motivated outrages.
Anti-semitism is deep rooted, eg treatment of characters like Shylock. It should have had its day a long time ago; along with other forms of discrimination on the basis of race, ethnicity or religion. So when the Israeli government levels Gaza, starves its population, excludes world media, attacks hospitals as reprisal against Hamas, how can that possibly help resolve the wider long term Middle East problem? We could all cite other horrifying examples of religious/ethnic cleansing in addition to the Holocaust.
There was a (now closed thread) about Maccabi Tel Aviv fans being banned from a football match (FFS it is a just a footy game). Yet everyone got lathered up, PM waded in and all politicians called out the Safety Committee decision to stop Maccabi fans from coming to Brum as anti-semitic. It was based upon WMP intelligence that Maccabi fans were racist thugs, but that is now hotly disputed. Well after their next away match, UEFA has fined and imposed a suspended ban on Maccabi for "racist and/or discriminatory behaviour" by its supporters during last week's Europa League game at German side Stuttgart. Pot kettle black comes to mind, which makes much of the PH posturing by the "usual suspects" (used on PH as a derogatory term at others who don't share that partisan line) all look frankly ridiculous.
Rather than throw vitriol at each other, can we please redirect some positive energy at world/religious leaders to reset the root causes of racial/religious prejudices. They are the ones with the platform, so they have responsibility to adapt their language tone and actions to engender public conciliation and calm. As for ourselves, a little inward reflection please, less partisan pontification; instead a positive contribution to breaking down barriers might help as a first step. I believe most PHers are decent humans, but that doesn't consistentky come across in NPE.
te teenager. I can’t see this thread going well. I don’t really know what the point is. It feels like it’s just to tell people to pipe down and accept without question the mass immigration of incompatible cultures that no one asked for.
Anyway, in my mind there are two separate issues - immigration and actual racism. You can be opposed to immigration but not be racist. Unfortunately if you’re against mass immigration many people tar you with the racist brush and it now feels like the word ‘racist’ has lost its meaning.
Or do you want examples of why certain cultures and demographics aren’t liked? Should someone change their view if they’ve had so many negative interactions with that group that they’ve given up trying to be tolerant and understanding?
Anyway, in my mind there are two separate issues - immigration and actual racism. You can be opposed to immigration but not be racist. Unfortunately if you’re against mass immigration many people tar you with the racist brush and it now feels like the word ‘racist’ has lost its meaning.
Or do you want examples of why certain cultures and demographics aren’t liked? Should someone change their view if they’ve had so many negative interactions with that group that they’ve given up trying to be tolerant and understanding?
Crumpet said:
it now feels like the word racist has lost its meaning.
This is how I see it now. When everything is 'racist', then nothing is. Using the term to shut down discussion only devalues it and diminishes the importance of dealing with actual racism.Too many grifters like BLM used 'racism' to their advantage, and are now wondering why it has done the cause more harm than good.
Reinventing history is never going to work out well either...
https://www.bbc.co.uk/news/articles/ce86jzgxxy4o
DeejRC said:
You do realise the entire content and tone of your post was belittling, divisive, argumentative and point scoring right?
Except that it wasn't.If you're not racist, it wasn't directed at you. If you are racist, you do not have any moral high ground.
Unsurprising that this is going down well with the usual suspects.
XCP said:
I just can't understand why Israel are considered to be part of Europe. Football, Eurovision etc.
Or Australia for that matter.
Just causes a lot of problems as far as I can see.
That one is obvious. Or Australia for that matter.
Just causes a lot of problems as far as I can see.
Commercial aspects. Football, Eurovision, et al. Are all businesses. The more people they can get involved the more people they can sell it to, the more money they can make.
It's not a government thing, so why would nationality matter?
It's a fair question but had a rather obviously answer.
WH16 said:
Crumpet said:
it now feels like the word racist has lost its meaning.
This is how I see it now. When everything is 'racist', then nothing is. Using the term to shut down discussion only devalues it and diminishes the importance of dealing with actual racism.Too many grifters like BLM used 'racism' to their advantage, and are now wondering why it has done the cause more harm than good.
Reinventing history is never going to work out well either...
https://www.bbc.co.uk/news/articles/ce86jzgxxy4o
Ironically you're the one trying to shut down conversation by trying to change the meaning of a word that has a quite obvious meaning.
Must be frustrating that it's not working.
WH16 said:
Crumpet said:
it now feels like the word racist has lost its meaning.
This is how I see it now. When everything is 'racist', then nothing is. Using the term to shut down discussion only devalues it and diminishes the importance of dealing with actual racism.Too many grifters like BLM used 'racism' to their advantage, and are now wondering why it has done the cause more harm than good.
Reinventing history is never going to work out well either...
https://www.bbc.co.uk/news/articles/ce86jzgxxy4o
See the current posts on the reform thread, it seems its really difficult to call it out if its ‘your side’ doing it or you don’t like the person who is subject to it.
HocusPocus said:
<<edited for brevity>>
Rather than throw vitriol at each other, can we please redirect some positive energy at world/religious leaders to reset the root causes of racial/religious prejudices. They are the ones with the platform, so they have responsibility to adapt their language tone and actions to engender public conciliation and calm. As for ourselves, a little inward reflection please, less partisan pontification; instead a positive contribution to breaking down barriers might help as a first step. I believe most PHers are decent humans, but that doesn't consistentky come across in NPE.
I agree that some PH posters could do better with their posts, but it is a discussion forum where views are exchanged.Rather than throw vitriol at each other, can we please redirect some positive energy at world/religious leaders to reset the root causes of racial/religious prejudices. They are the ones with the platform, so they have responsibility to adapt their language tone and actions to engender public conciliation and calm. As for ourselves, a little inward reflection please, less partisan pontification; instead a positive contribution to breaking down barriers might help as a first step. I believe most PHers are decent humans, but that doesn't consistentky come across in NPE.
As for 'redirecting some positive energy' at world leaders, that is, with respect rather naive. I doubt that the mad mullahs of Tehran, or Putin, or President Xi in China will be swayed by PH sentiment. Meanwhile, the warlords of Sudan and DR Congo are probably too busy slaughtering innocents to join the PH debate.
Finally, your post is contradictory: you object to "entitled pontification" but then call Farage a racist coward, declare that "FFS it's just a footy game" and other highly charged comments. You're guilty of doing the very thing that you purport to oppose. Vitriol, indeed.
Slow.Patrol said:
s1962a said:
I wouldn't worry too much. The racists on PH don't tend to be very bright, and don't hang around for long either.
Oh dear.I could say that the virtual signallers on PH are incapable of debate, just insults.
But I won't.
Slow.Patrol said:
s1962a said:
I wouldn't worry too much. The racists on PH don't tend to be very bright, and don't hang around for long either.
Oh dear.I could say that the virtual signallers on PH are incapable of debate, just insults.
But I won't.
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