Youve gotta be kidding me!!!!!!!!!!

[segg250]

http://www.telegraph.co.uk/news/worldnews/asia/afg...

Soldier apparently threatened to shoot a suspect unless he gave information and is soldier now faces a war crimes investigation.


WHAT A JOKE

Why dont they just get our soldiers to line up against a wall here in the uk and shoot themselves itll save money on transporting them to war zones to begin with....

[Kermit power]

I don't understand why you think his behaviour was in any way acceptable?

The Telegraph article said:

It is understood that at one stage during the interview, when the suspect was refusing to answer questions, the British interpreter drew his pistol, cocked it and pushed the prisoner's head down on to the table. He then pressed the gun into the back of the suspect's head and said in Pashto – "answer the questions or you're dead."

Why should he not expect to have a ton of bricks dropped on him? If a foreigner had done that to a British Soldier, would you think it a joke if they were threatened with prosecution?

[adycav]

Silly sod thinks he's Jack Bauer.

[DocJock]

Why is it a joke?

We have strict protocols for the treatment of prisoners and this guy is alleged to have broken them.
If we act like the Taliban then we are as bad as them.

[segg250]

No. Rules of war. Too many people simply dont get that it is a WAR not a tea party.

Information has to be gathered to protect his fellow soldiers and himself and in his place if i felt a prisoner was holding out on me i would have done exactly the same and not lost a wink of sleep over it.

All this says to soldiers is if you dont hand out sweeties and lick your prisoners feet clean you will go to jail.

It's a joke.

[Kermit power]

segg250 said:

No. Rules of war. Too many people simply dont get that it is a WAR not a tea party.

Information has to be gathered to protect his fellow soldiers and himself and in his place if i felt a prisoner was holding out on me i would have done exactly the same and not lost a wink of sleep over it.

All this says to soldiers is if you dont hand out sweeties and lick your prisoners feet clean you will go to jail.

It's a joke.

So you would find it acceptable for foreigners to torture British prisoners of war if they don't cough up information?

[Fittster]

segg250 said:

No. Rules of war.

Geneva Conventions?

[DocJock]

segg250 said:

No. Rules of war. Too many people simply dont get that it is a WAR not a tea party.

Exactly, and he has broken them (allegedly)

Discipline is paramount on active duty.
I'm glad I never had to serve with you with an attitude like that.

[mybrainhurts]

Kermit power said:

So you would find it acceptable for foreigners to torture British prisoners of war if they don't cough up information?

Wasn't really torture though, was it...?

If we meet him in the field, we can blow his balls off...

If we capture him, we can't scare him a bit...

Funny old world, innit...?

[segg250]

Kermit power said:

segg250 said:

No. Rules of war. Too many people simply dont get that it is a WAR not a tea party.

Information has to be gathered to protect his fellow soldiers and himself and in his place if i felt a prisoner was holding out on me i would have done exactly the same and not lost a wink of sleep over it.

All this says to soldiers is if you dont hand out sweeties and lick your prisoners feet clean you will go to jail.

It's a joke.

So you would find it acceptable for foreigners to torture British prisoners of war if they don't cough up information?

They do that already or have you been living under a rock. Hell they dont just point a gun at someones head and make threats they will actually physically torture and shoot british prisoners for fun nevermind to get information.

Too many people live in this wonderfull little fantasy land.

[DocJock]

Have you ever been in the Forces or is all this diatribe based on watching Rambo movies?

The reason our Forces are the best is because of their training and discipline.
Acting like some B-movies gangster is not on.

[segg250]

Not b movie gangster. God the attitude of people on here is worrying but should be expected. Somehow it seems that its acceptable that our soldiers should be tortured and killed by our enemies who dont recognise the geneva convention yet they are expected to spend all their time looking over their shoulders and second guessing everything they do incase the should break some silly little rule that will get them arrested.

My best friend was in the army and served in various conflicts and i work with the military and this sort of crap is one of the main reasons he left. Things like having to be shot at before he could return fire etc.

Why should we play by uneven rules.

Edited by segg250 on Sunday 18th October 18:05

[CRA2Y]

adycav said:

Silly sod thinks he's Jack Bauer.

"Damn it, he's just doing what's necessary! People's lives are at stake, damn it!"

[Kermit power]

segg250 said:

Kermit power said:

segg250 said:

No. Rules of war. Too many people simply dont get that it is a WAR not a tea party.

Information has to be gathered to protect his fellow soldiers and himself and in his place if i felt a prisoner was holding out on me i would have done exactly the same and not lost a wink of sleep over it.

All this says to soldiers is if you dont hand out sweeties and lick your prisoners feet clean you will go to jail.

It's a joke.

So you would find it acceptable for foreigners to torture British prisoners of war if they don't cough up information?

They do that already or have you been living under a rock. Hell they dont just point a gun at someones head and make threats they will actually physically torture and shoot british prisoners for fun nevermind to get information.

Too many people live in this wonderfull little fantasy land.

The difference is that you want to remove the laws which would prevent this sort of thing.

Let's say, for sake of argument, that we go to war with France tomorrow. Are you saying you would be happy for French troops to torture British POWs?

We are signatories of the Geneva Convention. We don't decide when we do or don't want to be signatories of the Geneva Convention, we just are.

Of course, there is also the completely separate question of what you would actually hope to achieve by removing our respect for the Geneva Convention?

My sister's first tour after leaving Sandhurst was to Northern Ireland. She was tasked as regimental intelligence liaison officer. At that time, they knew pretty much exactly who the active members of the paramilitary organisations were, and could've taken them out at the drop of a hat. Their respect for the Geneva Convention was one reason that they didn't, but the other was that they knew that if they went outside it, they'd simply make martyrs of the terrorists, and cause a handful of new recruits to come forward to replace every one terrorist they eliminated.

Factor in the added fanaticism of Al Qaeda and the potentially vast population to recruit from compared to Irish Catholics, and just how much do you think Bin Laden would absolutely love for British soldiers to adopt a policy of torturing prisoners?

[esselte]

mybrainhurts said:

Kermit power said:

So you would find it acceptable for foreigners to torture British prisoners of war if they don't cough up information?

Wasn't really torture though, was it...?

If we meet him in the field, we can blow his balls off...

If we capture him, we can't scare him a bit...

Funny old world, innit...?

I suppose the thinking is that once they're caught then they're no longer a threat...?

[AngryApples]

segg250 said:

My best friend was in the army.......

So,

not you then, your mate




I get wound up daily by the lack of support given to our forces in terms of kit, air support, inappropriate vehicles, etc but even I'd say are you really going to get genuine Intel from someone that has a gun to their head?

[DocJock]

segg250 said:

Not b movie gangster. God the attitude of people on here is worrying but should be expected. Somehow it seems that its acceptable that our soldiers should be tortured and killed by our enemies who dont recognise the geneva convention yet they are expected to spend all their time looking over their shoulders and second guessing everything they do incase the should break some silly little rule that will get them arrested.

My best friend was in the army and served in various conflicts and this sort of crap is one of the main reasons he left. Things like having to be shot at before he could return fire etc.

Why should we play by uneven rules.

So, you're just an armchair warrior shooting your mouth then.

You won't find many of us ex-regulars supporting your point of view.
The very fact we have rules and stick to them is one of the reasons our Forces are the best.
It is called discipline and you don't want to rely on a colleague who is indisciplined when your life is at risk.

[segg250]

esselte said:

mybrainhurts said:

Kermit power said:

So you would find it acceptable for foreigners to torture British prisoners of war if they don't cough up information?

Wasn't really torture though, was it...?

If we meet him in the field, we can blow his balls off...

If we capture him, we can't scare him a bit...

Funny old world, innit...?

I suppose the thinking is that once they're caught then they're no longer a threat...?

But this is the point they as anthemselves are a very low direct risk to the soldiers around them. But the information they have is very much a risk to the rest of the soldiers out on the ground confronting the enemy.

[esselte]

segg250 said:

esselte said:

mybrainhurts said:

Kermit power said:

So you would find it acceptable for foreigners to torture British prisoners of war if they don't cough up information?

Wasn't really torture though, was it...?

If we meet him in the field, we can blow his balls off...

If we capture him, we can't scare him a bit...

Funny old world, innit...?

I suppose the thinking is that once they're caught then they're no longer a threat...?

But this is the point they as anthemselves are a very low direct risk to the soldiers around them. But the information they have is very much a risk to the rest of the soldiers out on the ground confronting the enemy.

And you'd trust any information gathered in this way?

[segg250]

DocJock said:

segg250 said:

Not b movie gangster. God the attitude of people on here is worrying but should be expected. Somehow it seems that its acceptable that our soldiers should be tortured and killed by our enemies who dont recognise the geneva convention yet they are expected to spend all their time looking over their shoulders and second guessing everything they do incase the should break some silly little rule that will get them arrested.

My best friend was in the army and served in various conflicts and this sort of crap is one of the main reasons he left. Things like having to be shot at before he could return fire etc.

Why should we play by uneven rules.

So, you're just an armchair warrior shooting your mouth then.

You won't find many of us ex-regulars supporting your point of view.
The very fact we have rules and stick to them is one of the reasons our Forces are the best.
It is called discipline and you don't want to rely on a colleague who is indisciplined when your life is at risk.

If you say so. There are rules for a reason its makes us the best in the world BUT what this soldier did was not torture. All he did was try scare a terrorist into giving information which could save his and his fellow soldiers lives yet now he faces being disciplined and possibly even jail.

Out in the field there are rules which are there for a reason and a soldier not following the rules can get himself and his colleagues killed but in a military compound there is little to no risk to his colleagues by attempting to get info out of a prisoner.