Apparantly Middle Classes should lose ALL forms of Benefits
Discussion
http://news.bbc.co.uk/1/hi/uk_politics/8319646.stm
Why? Why should anyone at all, no matter what "class" they are, be denied maternity pay or child benefit? And why should TV licences for the elderly be taken away? This is far worse than Robin Hood's "rob from the rich to feed the poor", more like "rob from everyone to make sure Mr Lazy f
ker can sit on his arse drinking stella instead of going out and getting a job, which he is perfectly capable of"
And who decides what "class" people are? That has the potential to go wrong. There are probably people out there who live like kings but have no money at all, (I realise these are the sort who contributed to fking the economy up) or conversely, there could be people out there who are quite well off but don't like to show it.
Someone get rid of Brown quickly and effeciently
Why? Why should anyone at all, no matter what "class" they are, be denied maternity pay or child benefit? And why should TV licences for the elderly be taken away? This is far worse than Robin Hood's "rob from the rich to feed the poor", more like "rob from everyone to make sure Mr Lazy f
ker can sit on his arse drinking stella instead of going out and getting a job, which he is perfectly capable of" And who decides what "class" people are? That has the potential to go wrong. There are probably people out there who live like kings but have no money at all, (I realise these are the sort who contributed to f
king the economy up) or conversely, there could be people out there who are quite well off but don't like to show it.Someone get rid of Brown quickly and effeciently
Actually I'm not against this in principle.
I'd rather keep more of my pay due to lower taxes than recieve benefits that mean that state has to poke its nose into my business in order to work out whether or not I am worthy to recieve them.
I have found that in all cases I appear not to be entitled to anything but am obliged to pay the taxes regardless...
The "Benefits Class", of course, also needs to be eradicated by helping them get back to being "Working Class"...
I'd rather keep more of my pay due to lower taxes than recieve benefits that mean that state has to poke its nose into my business in order to work out whether or not I am worthy to recieve them.
I have found that in all cases I appear not to be entitled to anything but am obliged to pay the taxes regardless...
The "Benefits Class", of course, also needs to be eradicated by helping them get back to being "Working Class"...
Don said:
Actually I'm not against this in principle.
I'd rather keep more of my pay due to lower taxes than recieve benefits that mean that state has to poke its nose into my business in order to work out whether or not I am worthy to recieve them.
I have found that in all cases I appear not to be entitled to anything but am obliged to pay the taxes regardless...
The "Benefits Class", of course, also needs to be eradicated by helping them get back to being "Working Class"...
I agree with this.I'd rather keep more of my pay due to lower taxes than recieve benefits that mean that state has to poke its nose into my business in order to work out whether or not I am worthy to recieve them.
I have found that in all cases I appear not to be entitled to anything but am obliged to pay the taxes regardless...
The "Benefits Class", of course, also needs to be eradicated by helping them get back to being "Working Class"...
I think we need to look at benefits not as a right, but as an aid (which is what it is). If a family are doing ok financially, then why should the state pay them to have a kid?
If a family NEEDS the extra cash in order to support a kid then give them benefits, but do not give money to people with kids, just because they have kids, if they do not need the extra cash to support the child (I.E.: if they are financially secure enough to support the child on their own).
Benefits should be going to the poorest people, to help them out financially. Benefits should not be going to people who do not have financial problems/ hardship.
At the end of the day, things like getting pregnant are personal choices, so why should the state pay for everybody's personal choice, unless that financial assistance in actually going to make a difference
Trouble is it is defining 'middle class' as those earning £15k per adult & £5k per child.
So a couple earning £17.5k each with one child are defined as middle class!
Also in the report is saying that the poorest needs to be better provided for by the welfare state. So we need to buy them more stella!
The report is quite misleading as it is stating that an extra 8p on the rate is required to pay for these benefits for the middle class. Surely we are paying this already so it is not an extra 8p. And if they took away these benefits it is sure that they will not hand this 8p back to tax payers.
So a couple earning £17.5k each with one child are defined as middle class!
Also in the report is saying that the poorest needs to be better provided for by the welfare state. So we need to buy them more stella!
The report is quite misleading as it is stating that an extra 8p on the rate is required to pay for these benefits for the middle class. Surely we are paying this already so it is not an extra 8p. And if they took away these benefits it is sure that they will not hand this 8p back to tax payers.
The problem is that benefits are now referred to as entitlements. This single change of phrase has opened the door, because if you are entitled to something, generally you will have contributed beforehand. Thus, swathes of middle classes (if that is what you want to refer to them as) suddenly say, "well, if *he* can be entitled to a benefit and hasn't paid into it, i'm damned sure i am". Enter viscious cicle. No one wants to lose it if someone else gets to keep it.
Remove the lot. I would rather pay the absolute base rate of tax to cover state pension and emergency access to hospitals etc and then choose my own level of expenditure to other services (health care, insurance, child care etc), than pay into a huge system where i have to prove i can take out of the pot - or someone else takes more share than they are morally obliged to. It gives me no pleasure at all to get handouts from the Government.
Remove the lot. I would rather pay the absolute base rate of tax to cover state pension and emergency access to hospitals etc and then choose my own level of expenditure to other services (health care, insurance, child care etc), than pay into a huge system where i have to prove i can take out of the pot - or someone else takes more share than they are morally obliged to. It gives me no pleasure at all to get handouts from the Government.
dpbird90 said:
http://news.bbc.co.uk/1/hi/uk_politics/8319646.stm
Why? Why should anyone at all, no matter what "class" they are, be denied maternity pay or child benefit? And why should TV licences for the elderly be taken away? This is far worse than Robin Hood's "rob from the rich to feed the poor", more like "rob from everyone to make sure Mr Lazy fker can sit on his arse drinking stella instead of going out and getting a job, which he is perfectly capable of"
And who decides what "class" people are? That has the potential to go wrong. There are probably people out there who live like kings but have no money at all, (I realise these are the sort who contributed to fking the economy up) or conversely, there could be people out there who are quite well off but don't like to show it.
Someone get rid of Brown quickly and effeciently
Whats this got to do with Brown....?Why? Why should anyone at all, no matter what "class" they are, be denied maternity pay or child benefit? And why should TV licences for the elderly be taken away? This is far worse than Robin Hood's "rob from the rich to feed the poor", more like "rob from everyone to make sure Mr Lazy f
ker can sit on his arse drinking stella instead of going out and getting a job, which he is perfectly capable of" And who decides what "class" people are? That has the potential to go wrong. There are probably people out there who live like kings but have no money at all, (I realise these are the sort who contributed to f
king the economy up) or conversely, there could be people out there who are quite well off but don't like to show it.Someone get rid of Brown quickly and effeciently
a centre right think tank has suggested said:
Reform says payments including maternity pay, child benefit, the winter fuel allowance and TV licences for the elderly could be scrapped.
Zod said:
In principle, I agree with the idea, but the threshold needs to be high. It feels wrong that I get child benefit for my kids at my level of earnings, but perhaps I should just see it as a tiny reduction in my marginal rate.
How high, and what are your earnings in relationship to your proposed threshold....?tim2100 said:
Trouble is it is defining 'middle class' as those earning £15k per adult & £5k per child.
So a couple earning £17.5k each with one child are defined as middle class!
Indeed, that's clearly b*llocks. But it makes a nice headline for the under-class labour voters who love to hear 'other people' getting raped over taxes/benefits so they can continue sponging.So a couple earning £17.5k each with one child are defined as middle class!
ive an idea instead of paying for pensioners tv licence out of taxes work out the total amount this costs and deduct straight from bbc overfkingflated budget.
instead of paying winter fuel allownace out of tax do something about the enourmous monopolised profits energy firms make.
never understood though why i should pay for well off kids - by this i mean above 50k a yearish.
kingflated budget.instead of paying winter fuel allownace out of tax do something about the enourmous monopolised profits energy firms make.
never understood though why i should pay for well off kids - by this i mean above 50k a yearish.
Spiritual_Beggar said:
If a family are doing ok financially, then why should the state pay them to have a kid?
Why not take that thought process all the way - why should the state pay *anyone* to have a kid? Oh, and as others have stated, the likely income cut-off point for child benefits is stupidly low. The wife and I bring in around 55K/pa, but by the time we've paid out all the costs incurred living in Greater London with a 2 year old, we're certainly not left with so much disposable income such that losing child benefit wouldn't be noticeable...
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