That's it, nuke the lot of 'em and be done with it

[hornetrider]

wkers.

http://news.bbc.co.uk/1/hi/uk/8341659.stm

Cowardly fking wkers.

[funkyrobot]

I did wonder how long it would take for a 'turncoat' to appear and do something like this.

Very very sad indeed.

[Eric Mc]

Been reading "An Ordinary Soldier" by Doug Beattie MC and he keeps saying that discipline within the Afghan Army and Police is dire. They are barely under control half the time and are terrible when out on patrol as you never know for sure whether

a) they will carry out orders

b) turn on you

Well, it looks like b) has finally happened.

What a terrible mess we are in out there.

[odyssey2200]

sounds entirely reasonable to me.

This will never end.
These people do not have the will or mental capacity to negotiate a peace.
All they understand is what (they aretold) their little book says and anyone who disagrees, or has more than them must be killed. (cos the little book says so)

Withdraw and let them get on with it.

[Eric Mc]

odyssey2200 said:

sounds entirely reasonable to me.

This will never end.
These people do not have the will or mental capacity to negotiate a peace.
All they understand is what (they aretold) their little book says and anyone who disagrees, or has more than them must be killed. (cos the little book says so)

Withdraw and let them get on with it.

I actually think their "little book" has very little to do with this.

They are a fiercely independent people. They resent foreign intereference in their affairs, They don't even like the idea of central government from Kabul by their own people. They are tribal by nature and dio not want or understand Western style democracy. Therefore, trying to enforce such a system on them is a total waste of time.

The game is over. No one has been defeated as there was nothing to win in the first place. Time to blow the final whistle and leave the pitch.

Edited by Eric Mc on Wednesday 4th November 08:33

[funkyrobot]

Eric Mc said:

Been reading "An Ordinary Soldier" by Doug Beattie MC and he keeps saying that discipline within the Afghan Army and Police is dire. They are barely under control half the time and are terrible when out on patrol as you never know for sure whether

a) they will carry out orders

b) turn on you

Well, it looks like b) has finally happened.

What a terrible mess we are in out there.

I am currently re-reading 'Sniper One' by Sgt Dan Mills and he talks about how you couldn't really trust the Iraqi police. They also had Iraqi workers in their compound and they soon 'left the ship' when the poop really hit the fan.

I think that the the hardest thing to deal with would be treating Taliban soldiers who are injured, which the British forces have done. Must be an odd feeling knowing that someone who was trying to kill you a few hours ago is now in your medical tent being patched up!

[Eric Mc]

funkyrobot said:

Eric Mc said:

Been reading "An Ordinary Soldier" by Doug Beattie MC and he keeps saying that discipline within the Afghan Army and Police is dire. They are barely under control half the time and are terrible when out on patrol as you never know for sure whether

a) they will carry out orders

b) turn on you

Well, it looks like b) has finally happened.

What a terrible mess we are in out there.

I am currently re-reading 'Sniper One' by Sgt Dan Mills and he talks about how you couldn't really trust the Iraqi police. They also had Iraqi workers in their compound and they soon 'left the ship' when the poop really hit the fan.

I think that the the hardest thing to deal with would be treating Taliban soldiers who are injured, which the British forces have done. Must be an odd feeling knowing that someone who was trying to kill you a few hours ago is now in your medical tent being patched up!

That has always been a noble tradition of the Army - not that the Army has always behaved nobely in every conflict. But generally, the British medics will patch up the enemy if they have the opportunity. It happened in WW2 and the Falklands too.

[loltolhurst]

what an utter waste of 5 brave chaps lives. sad its almost poppy day and we havent worked out that war is st and pointless yet.

[Fittster]

Hopefully next year we might have some politicians willing to see a change. I'm thinking of people like Rory Stewart, who have a lot of experience of both Afghanistan and Iraq and want to withdraw ASAP.

[hornetrider]

There's basically no coherent strategy and no clearly achievable goal. Why oh why we haven't learned the lessons of history and gone in there anyway is completely beyond me.

We need to get out, get out now and however little we like it - we need to engage with the Taliban somehow (and the radical muslim community in general) in the vain hope they'll stop wanting to bomb the st out of us.

[nonuts]

Does anyone know what the solution is for these areas of the world where they like bashing the fk out of each other. Leaving well alone doesn't seem to work. Invading doesn't seem to work.

I'm guessing education is the key, however that'll never be practical.

[JagLover]

I think we need to think what are strategy is supposed to be. At the start we supported one side (the Northern Alliance) with air strikes and special forces. It was effective at driving back the Taliban and incurred the minimum of casualties.

But now we seem to be trying to build some sort of western democracy there?.

We need a clear idea of what we want (no safe haven for Terrorists) and how we are going to achieve it.

[Asterix]

This made me extremely angry.

My view has been, for a long time, to build a 50ft wall round Afghanistan and simply let those inside get on with it. Sorry, you've had the chances thrown at you by the bucket load and it has simply been thrown back in our faces.

I feel sorry for the average person over there but I don't see them standing together to make a difference.

I think another report recently said that the money spent would have allowed us to have a far better internal security services as most threats actually come from inside the UK - the July bombings are an example.

[chris watton]

JagLover said:

I think we need to think what are strategy is supposed to be. At the start we supported one side (the Northern Alliance) with air strikes and special forces. It was effective at driving back the Taliban and incurred the minimum of casualties.

But now we seem to be trying to build some sort of western democracy there?.

We need a clear idea of what we want (no safe haven for Terrorists) and how we are going to achieve it.

This is what always amazes me – why are ‘we’ trying to impose a Western style democracy (which, in Europe at least, isn’t doing all that well anyway..) onto the people of Afghanistan?

Their culture and way of life is not our culture and way of life, and this isn’t going to change anytime soon – if anything, it will make things worse as there is evidentially no clear goal and the indigenous population will be brought up to despise ‘us’ for trying to install an alien style of culture to them!

[Marf]

Asterix said:

My view has been, for a long time, to build a 50ft wall round Afghanistan and simply let those inside get on with it. Sorry, you've had the chances thrown at you by the bucket load and it has simply been thrown back in our faces.

But then how would we extract their natural resources bring democracy to them?

[hornetrider]

Marf said:

Asterix said:

My view has been, for a long time, to build a 50ft wall round Afghanistan and simply let those inside get on with it. Sorry, you've had the chances thrown at you by the bucket load and it has simply been thrown back in our faces.

But then how would we extract their natural resources bring democracy to them?

But, the only natural resource they have is opium.

.....oh!

[Asterix]

Marf said:

Asterix said:

My view has been, for a long time, to build a 50ft wall round Afghanistan and simply let those inside get on with it. Sorry, you've had the chances thrown at you by the bucket load and it has simply been thrown back in our faces.

But then how would we extract their natural resources bring democracy to them?

Indeed - shame they don't want it - well, not the version our dear leaders would like to impart. Bear in mind, we have a very pale imitation of democracy in the UK anyway.

[clanger]

Absolutely shocking news - if Uncle Sam and his chums hadn't taken their eye off the ball with Iraq, there just might have been a chance of change for the better, but they let them regroup. I can't see a remote chance of any sort of lasting peace here now. But if history is the measure there really was never any prospect of it in the first place.

[Marf]

hornetrider said:

Marf said:

Asterix said:

My view has been, for a long time, to build a 50ft wall round Afghanistan and simply let those inside get on with it. Sorry, you've had the chances thrown at you by the bucket load and it has simply been thrown back in our faces.

But then how would we extract their natural resources bring democracy to them?

But, the only natural resource they have is opium.

.....oh!

No, its not. They have massive natural gas reserves and there is currently a pipeline planned to run through the country, backed by the ADB.

IMO its no coincedence Karsi is president given his past involvement in Unocal.

[jamoor]

I am curious to know why British Troops are in Afghanistan today anyway, what do they do on a day to day basis?