Can there really be a Lab-Lib stitch-up?
Discussion
Just been out picking up a new car and listened to Any Questions on R4 on the way back.
Faulkner and Ben Bradshaw (he was on the news) going on about how Labour and the Lib Dems have more in common than the Conservatives and the Lib Dems etc.
I'm no political expert but it seems obvious that the Tories and Lib Dems disagree on a lot, but the media are portraying it as if, if Clegg goes to Winky and they form a coalition that it's a done deal and we're stuck with a "progressive alliance".
Now, I see it very simply, a hung parliament has been on the cards for ages, nobody voted for a coalition of any sort, and it seems plain wrong that the two parties who came out of the election the worst off can attempt to "trump" the one which came out the best off.
If our "constitution" would allow this, perhaps it also needs to be reformed?
Faulkner and Ben Bradshaw (he was on the news) going on about how Labour and the Lib Dems have more in common than the Conservatives and the Lib Dems etc.
I'm no political expert but it seems obvious that the Tories and Lib Dems disagree on a lot, but the media are portraying it as if, if Clegg goes to Winky and they form a coalition that it's a done deal and we're stuck with a "progressive alliance".
Now, I see it very simply, a hung parliament has been on the cards for ages, nobody voted for a coalition of any sort, and it seems plain wrong that the two parties who came out of the election the worst off can attempt to "trump" the one which came out the best off.
If our "constitution" would allow this, perhaps it also needs to be reformed?
paddyhasneeds said:
Just been out picking up a new car and listened to Any Questions on R4 on the way back.
Faulkner and Ben Bradshaw (he was on the news) going on about how Labour and the Lib Dems have more in common than the Conservatives and the Lib Dems etc.
I'm no political expert but it seems obvious that the Tories and Lib Dems disagree on a lot, but the media are portraying it as if, if Clegg goes to Winky and they form a coalition that it's a done deal and we're stuck with a "progressive alliance".
Now, I see it very simply, a hung parliament has been on the cards for ages, nobody voted for a coalition of any sort, and it seems plain wrong that the two parties who came out of the election the worst off can attempt to "trump" the one which came out the best off.
If our "constitution" would allow this, perhaps it also needs to be reformed?
I must admit to thinking Clegg would align with Labour providing Winky resigned....maybe the aledged 'row' this afternoon was about that?Faulkner and Ben Bradshaw (he was on the news) going on about how Labour and the Lib Dems have more in common than the Conservatives and the Lib Dems etc.
I'm no political expert but it seems obvious that the Tories and Lib Dems disagree on a lot, but the media are portraying it as if, if Clegg goes to Winky and they form a coalition that it's a done deal and we're stuck with a "progressive alliance".
Now, I see it very simply, a hung parliament has been on the cards for ages, nobody voted for a coalition of any sort, and it seems plain wrong that the two parties who came out of the election the worst off can attempt to "trump" the one which came out the best off.
If our "constitution" would allow this, perhaps it also needs to be reformed?
As for reform......that's what we all want and they all promise. So it'll probably stay the same
The real Apache said:
As for reform......that's what we all want and they all promise. So it'll probably stay the same
I'm not thinking of voting reform, I genuinely don't know if I have a view on that, simply that any constitution that lets all the losers band together and claim a majority seems broken.No.
A coalition of lib/lab will not have a majority and will need additional support of other parties. If a coalition is forged it will last only a few month. As part of the deal will be PR and many labour MPs will vote against it and the government will fall as a result.
LDs will be blamed as prolonging a discreditted labour party and leader and will be taken apart at the resulting general election (along with labour). Clegg also can't force Brown to resign and the labour party elect another unelected Prime Minister. Not only would the delay be disatrous in a very uncertain economic time but unthinkable to force another unelected leader on this country.
Clegg knows the only possible sustainable deal he can do is with CMD even if the current resident of no10 is too blinded by power to see it.
A coalition of lib/lab will not have a majority and will need additional support of other parties. If a coalition is forged it will last only a few month. As part of the deal will be PR and many labour MPs will vote against it and the government will fall as a result.
LDs will be blamed as prolonging a discreditted labour party and leader and will be taken apart at the resulting general election (along with labour). Clegg also can't force Brown to resign and the labour party elect another unelected Prime Minister. Not only would the delay be disatrous in a very uncertain economic time but unthinkable to force another unelected leader on this country.
Clegg knows the only possible sustainable deal he can do is with CMD even if the current resident of no10 is too blinded by power to see it.
people say about this coalition giving rise to a new election in a few months, but if it is Lib Lab, you need to be aware of the scum that is the labour cabinet / senior echeclons, and realise they will promise and do ANYHING to further thir own causes, they will never act in the National Interest. As far as I know only the PM can cal an election. If Winky f
knegget or ANY labour scummer (Harman, Balls, Millipeded) get PM slot, they will never call an election for years and years.
knegget or ANY labour scummer (Harman, Balls, Millipeded) get PM slot, they will never call an election for years and years. My neighbours are lib demmers at a regional level and I spoke with them this morining about the possible coalition. They said that PR and Europe will be an absolute requirement of any coalition and that having the balane of power will allow Clegg a big stick to require adoption of these policies.
I pointed out that they came third in the election, even on PR, they'd be 3rd, so why should conservatives or anyone allow them to force stuff on them.....morally they have little braganing power.
They went very quiet, I think they realised I may have a point !
This the irony, it seems any coalition will result in a Parliament no one group of voters wants or voted for.....
Stupid situation brought about by stuid electorate.
I pointed out that they came third in the election, even on PR, they'd be 3rd, so why should conservatives or anyone allow them to force stuff on them.....morally they have little braganing power.
They went very quiet, I think they realised I may have a point !
This the irony, it seems any coalition will result in a Parliament no one group of voters wants or voted for.....
Stupid situation brought about by stuid electorate.
s3fella said:
people say about this coalition giving rise to a new election in a few months, but if it is Lib Lab, you need to be aware of the scum that is the labour cabinet / senior echeclons, and realise they will promise and do ANYHING to further thir own causes, they will never act in the National Interest. As far as I know only the PM can cal an election. If Winky fknegget or ANY labour scummer (Harman, Balls, Millipeded) get PM slot, they will never call an election for years and years.
losing a vote of no confidence will trigger an election so no it is not just up to the PM. Without a commons majority losing a vote of no confidence is merely a matter of time. A lib/lab minority government will be very unstable and dangerous in these times. IMF anyone?knegget or ANY labour scummer (Harman, Balls, Millipeded) get PM slot, they will never call an election for years and years. The thing that I find most beautiful about this situation, is that the crap is hitting the fan, Brown is accountable, and he's powerless to do anything about it.
So many have faced this problem under his tenure, both as chancellor and PM, as a direct result of his actions. So many have suffered at his hands, to their eternal detiment. Now he's manoeuvred himself into the exact same situation. It's delicious.
It'll all work out in the end.
The Queen can't overtly manoeuvre. Rest assured, she has more strings to pull, than all the rest put together.
When the tension is finally removed, we'll all be able to move on, and work ourselves out of the hole. Many don't think they can at the moment. It's not true. We've always been able to. It's just we've had the belief in controlling our own destiny battered out of us.
The meek shall inherit the earth. Brown's mistake was the belief that he could take credit for handing the earth to the meek. Not even the Queen would take credit for that. She is, after all, the most sympathetic, and capable.
So many have faced this problem under his tenure, both as chancellor and PM, as a direct result of his actions. So many have suffered at his hands, to their eternal detiment. Now he's manoeuvred himself into the exact same situation. It's delicious.
It'll all work out in the end.
The Queen can't overtly manoeuvre. Rest assured, she has more strings to pull, than all the rest put together.
When the tension is finally removed, we'll all be able to move on, and work ourselves out of the hole. Many don't think they can at the moment. It's not true. We've always been able to. It's just we've had the belief in controlling our own destiny battered out of us.
The meek shall inherit the earth. Brown's mistake was the belief that he could take credit for handing the earth to the meek. Not even the Queen would take credit for that. She is, after all, the most sympathetic, and capable.
Edited by dilbert on Saturday 8th May 15:32
dilbert said:
The thing that I find most beautiful about this situation, is that the crap is hitting the fan, Brown is accountable, and he's powerless to do anything about it.
So many have faced this problem under his tenure, both as chancellor and PM, as a direct result of his actions. So many have suffered at his hands, to their eternal detiment. Now he's manoeuvred himself into the exact same situation. It's delicious.
It'll all work out in the end.
The Queen can't overtly manoeuvre. Rest assured, she has more strings to pull, than all the rest put together.
When the tension is finally removed, we'll all be able to move on, and work ourselves out of the hole. Many don't think they can at the moment. It's not true. We've always been able to. It's just we've had the belief in controlling our own destiny battered out of us.
The meek shall inherit the earth. Brown's mistake was the belief that he could take credit for handing the earth to the meek. Not even the Queen would take credit for that. She is, after all, the most sympathetic, and capable.
So many have faced this problem under his tenure, both as chancellor and PM, as a direct result of his actions. So many have suffered at his hands, to their eternal detiment. Now he's manoeuvred himself into the exact same situation. It's delicious.
It'll all work out in the end.
The Queen can't overtly manoeuvre. Rest assured, she has more strings to pull, than all the rest put together.
When the tension is finally removed, we'll all be able to move on, and work ourselves out of the hole. Many don't think they can at the moment. It's not true. We've always been able to. It's just we've had the belief in controlling our own destiny battered out of us.
The meek shall inherit the earth. Brown's mistake was the belief that he could take credit for handing the earth to the meek. Not even the Queen would take credit for that. She is, after all, the most sympathetic, and capable.
Edited by dilbert on Saturday 8th May 15:32
s3fella said:
If Winky fknegget or ANY labour scummer (Harman, Balls, Millipeded) get PM slot, they will never call an election for years and years.
But they will not be able to pass one bill in the whole term. The infighting will be amazing to watch, the two parties will colapse in on themselves and Labour will be banished for a generation. Beautiful isn't it.knegget or ANY labour scummer (Harman, Balls, Millipeded) get PM slot, they will never call an election for years and years. But they will stll line their pockets for 5 years. Like I say, they dont give two hoots about the god of the Nation, just lining their own pockets and being in power. And of course it will be everyone elses fault that they cannot pass a Bill...
You forget that these guys have no scrupples. And if they all just keep on the Gravy Train, it will be a pxss easy living for them.
Anyone just heard Tebbit on Sky!! ? Brilliant. He said Clegg had 77% vote against him, so he should be "put in a locked cupborad and let the Big Boys get on with it!"
You forget that these guys have no scrupples. And if they all just keep on the Gravy Train, it will be a pxss easy living for them.
Anyone just heard Tebbit on Sky!! ? Brilliant. He said Clegg had 77% vote against him, so he should be "put in a locked cupborad and let the Big Boys get on with it!"
paddyhasneeds said:
As an aside, anyone watching that student grant chap on Sky News being torn apart by Kay Burley? I don't like her but bloody hell this is funny.
"Thousands and thousands of people are protesting" "But there's just a couple of hundred of you with a banner and a megaphone"
The lentil muncher was totally shredded beyond belief, car crash telly at it's finest. "Thousands and thousands of people are protesting" "But there's just a couple of hundred of you with a banner and a megaphone"
then, just when it couldn't get any better, a bright yellow WWII DUKW drove past behind him doing about 5mpg!
Jasandjules said:
If Brown tries to cling to power I suspect there may be riots.
I did/do wonder if one option for Cameron would be to simply leave Brown to it and let him dig his and Labours own grave?I don't know enough of the differences and similarities between the Tories and the Lib Dems to know how much chance any sort of agreement, let alone a coalition has of working.
s3fella said:
But they will stll line their pockets for 5 years. Like I say, they dont give two hoots about the god of the Nation, just lining their own pockets and being in power. And of course it will be everyone elses fault that they cannot pass a Bill...
You forget that these guys have no scrupples. And if they all just keep on the Gravy Train, it will be a pxss easy living for them.
Anyone just heard Tebbit on Sky!! ? Brilliant. He said Clegg had 77% vote against him, so he should be "put in a locked cupborad and let the Big Boys get on with it!"
They wouldn't last 5 months let alone years.You forget that these guys have no scrupples. And if they all just keep on the Gravy Train, it will be a pxss easy living for them.
Anyone just heard Tebbit on Sky!! ? Brilliant. He said Clegg had 77% vote against him, so he should be "put in a locked cupborad and let the Big Boys get on with it!"
The Tories, with the help of less than 10 others, will stop any bill Lib / Lab tried to put though, resulting in a VONC and another election.
When the Public see how Labour and the limp dems have put themselves before the national interest the tories will get a majority.
Bring it on.
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