'Losing' £500,000.

[rfisher]

By way of hypothetical end of Year fun during the festive season.

Let's say that you had £500,000 savings squirreled away in a variety of bank accounts and an ISA.

Let's say that you decided that, for whatever reason, you wanted to slowly withdraw your money as cash in £10,000 portions, to dispose of in any way you considered fit.

Maybe you fancied a bit of C&H. Maybe you wanted to slip a bit to the kids or grandkids. Maybe you just fancied blowing a few k at the Casino.

How long would it be before some nosy barsteward poked their official little fingers in you face and asked where the money was going?

It's your hard earned after all.

And if you were given £50,000 in cash by such a relative, how or where could you put it to avoid any undue interest (sic) from such nosy barstewards?

Bear in mind that this is completely hypothetical.

I'm just interested in exploring the legal and not so legal uses of physical currency as well as their limits, before we all start getting paid in crypto currencies.

[trickywoo]

Nobody will ask where it’s going.

Gifts by bank transfer will also be ok. If you die within 7 years of gifting the tax man will be interested for inheritance tax.

£50k cash would probably raise questions if you walked into a bank with it without any explanation. Similarly you can’t just give an estate agent or car dealer £50k in cash.

If you wanted to be under the radar with £50k easiest thing would be antiques / collectibles but you may generate interest for capital gains if you weren’t careful.

[T5R+]

£50K distributed into your numerous accounts over a few weeks will not raise an eyebrow. Keep it below £10K and it should not raise any "issues", £5K is even better.

Of course if you seldom deposit or withdraw such amounts, it may cause questions. Your response - "just sold my car".

With £500K, I would have to call in some favours and it would take longer so my fee is 10%.

[14-7]

I would say it depends on the amounts being flung around and what is normal for your account(s).

For instance, my bank didn't bat an eyelid when a few hundred thousand appeared then moved around between accounts then disappeared within a few days.

The other halfs bank froze her account when £50k went in and £10k went out within a day. Apparently it activated their fraud warning but they didn't even bother to ring her about it, she had to ring to find out why her card had stopped working.

[kurt535]

go abroad for a year and become tax exile??

[rfisher]

So how about moving cash into mobile physical assets such as diamonds, watches and gold?

Easier to distribute to friends and family.

Likely to appreciate over time as well.

Can be converted back into money at any time if required.

[red_slr]

You seem to think there would be some issue with gifting money, there isn't any issue unless you die within 7 years.

[PurpleMoonlight]

I won't go into the reasons why, but 10 years ago I withdrew £1500 - £2000 in cash every two weeks for a year.

My building society never asked why. In fact it became a pleasant experience with idle chit chat every time.

[wibble cb]

T5R+ said:

£50K distributed into your numerous accounts over a few weeks will not raise an eyebrow. Keep it below £10K and it should not raise any "issues", £5K is even better.

Of course if you seldom deposit or withdraw such amounts, it may cause questions. Your response - "just sold my car".

With £500K, I would have to call in some favours and it would take longer so my fee is 10%.

Any acct activity that adds up to 10k or above(whether 1 transfer or multiples ) over a 24hr period get reported automatically, of course its a different matter actually being investigated.

[alscar]

“ Get reported automatically “ - to whom ?

[anonymous-user]

As others have said, unless you die within 7 years, the tax man doesn't care what you spend, only what you earn.

[BoRED S2upid]

If your withdrawing large regular sums in cash from the same bank the staff may report you to the authorities for your own good but that’s all I can think of nobody will care.

[towser44]

PurpleMoonlight said:

I won't go into the reasons why, but 10 years ago I withdrew £1500 - £2000 in cash every two weeks for a year.

My building society never asked why. In fact it became a pleasant experience with idle chit chat every time.

Ah, that's not to say they didn't file a report though, building societies and banks don't make a habit of telling the customer they've completed a Money Laundering Reporting Form and pinged it off to head office to investigate, otherwise they've 'tipped off' which is a criminal offence. Anything you may have said in the idle chit-chat that could give any clues will have been included on any reports. Of course, on the other hand you may have been served by someone who just didn't think twice and never thought of querying the transactions.

I used to work in Anti-Money Laundering a few years ago for a Building Society and we received numerous reports every week which we investigated further and then potentially made the relevant authorities aware. Ours was a very manual process, I would expect the major players generate reports automatically when certain limits, transaction numbers are triggered.

Given the volume of reports however, whether they authorities take any action is up for debate, unless the amounts are large I suspect the vast majority go without any action being taken because they don't have the resources.

[Sheepshanks]

wibble cb said:

Any acct activity that adds up to 10k or above(whether 1 transfer or multiples ) over a 24hr period get reported automatically, of course its a different matter actually being investigated.

I'm minded to think that's nonsense - there would be so many "they" would be swamped.

What does happen is if you deposit an unusual amount vs your normal activity (and around £10K seems to be the trigger) you may get a call from the bank suggesting they could offer investment advice.

[Ted2]

Since the introduction of Connect it's more to do with making sure you've paid all your taxes on your monies rather than AML these days, although they're intertwined.

[rfisher]

Although I understand the need for AML reporting by banks, it is one of the aspects of State control of my money that I find personally annoying.

Also, having to worry about the next 7 years if you gift money. Why not 5? Why not 0?

If all my assets were in the form of 'stuff' then it would be far more difficult for the sticky fingered nosy barstewards to interfere with what I do with them.

So the Rolex my relation has in her wardrobe was given to her when and by whom?

Oh yes, I gave it to her 7 years ago yesterday, thanks for asking.

[hairyben]

50k? You can't change £500 for holiday spend without somewhat gestapo-esque interrogation ime

[BanzaiMan]

Inkyfingers said:

As others have said, unless you die within 7 years, the tax man doesn't care what you spend, only what you earn.

With one caveat

http://www.telegraph.co.uk/finance/personalfinance...

[Sheepshanks]

rfisher said:

Although I understand the need for AML reporting by banks, it is one of the aspects of State control of my money that I find personally annoying.

Also, having to worry about the next 7 years if you gift money. Why not 5? Why not 0?

If all my assets were in the form of 'stuff' then it would be far more difficult for the sticky fingered nosy barstewards to interfere with what I do with them.

So the Rolex my relation has in her wardrobe was given to her when and by whom?

Oh yes, I gave it to her 7 years ago yesterday, thanks for asking.

Perhaps I'm missing something but unless you're talking massive sums, I wonder how on earth they'd know anyway. How would the executors know unless the deceased left a record of gifts?

[CubanPete]

About 15 years ago a close friend was working abroad (very legit - he was working as an ambassador in the British embassy in Washington!) and he had just bought a house which was being refurbished for when he came back. I did a lot of liaising with builders and plumbers, he transferred the money to me and I paid them too. Several occasions of high four figures.

My bank was interested... But only to sell me their £50 a month platinum credit card!