Mortgage issues
Discussion
Good evening ph.
I am in the process of applying for a mortgage for a new build property.
We went to a mortgage broker well known and possibly affiliated with a house builders.
We passed credit scoring and affordability problem free.
Since this point; Natwest have declined us and so has hsbc.
The issue is; they are point blankly refusing to give me OR the broker any reason why. I've complained to Natwest and received their final decision notice confirming they will not tell us why or what the reason is- HSBC have come back with the exact same response; not offering a mortgage and won't tell us why despite passing initial checks!
We've sold our previous home in advance of the move and have over 35% equity for the new home and now potentially were f
ked.
Been to Equifax and no problems were in the top x% of the country way over average and have next to zero outgoings.
How are they able to withhold a reason for offering a mortgage citing that "something has come to light" (theyre words to the broker!!!) and not tell us??
They surely must tell us to enable us to defend/rectify this??
Any help?
I am in the process of applying for a mortgage for a new build property.
We went to a mortgage broker well known and possibly affiliated with a house builders.
We passed credit scoring and affordability problem free.
Since this point; Natwest have declined us and so has hsbc.
The issue is; they are point blankly refusing to give me OR the broker any reason why. I've complained to Natwest and received their final decision notice confirming they will not tell us why or what the reason is- HSBC have come back with the exact same response; not offering a mortgage and won't tell us why despite passing initial checks!
We've sold our previous home in advance of the move and have over 35% equity for the new home and now potentially were f
ked. Been to Equifax and no problems were in the top x% of the country way over average and have next to zero outgoings.
How are they able to withhold a reason for offering a mortgage citing that "something has come to light" (theyre words to the broker!!!) and not tell us??
They surely must tell us to enable us to defend/rectify this??
Any help?
Advice / question from wife who is ex-underwriter for a different high street bank;
Have you got a valuation? Has the process with the bank got that far? Some builders and brokers are not "registered" with the banks, and they don't recognise the builders valuations, or their brokers.
Equally, she is very surprised they give no explanation - that is almost unheard of. The blanket response would usually be "doesn't meet lending policy" at the very least.
Any other reason for flat "no" response would be based on findings from their internal fraud teams flagging serious financial issues (not credit rating related). Not suggesting this in your case.
Edit; for correction
Have you got a valuation? Has the process with the bank got that far? Some builders and brokers are not "registered" with the banks, and they don't recognise the builders valuations, or their brokers.
Equally, she is very surprised they give no explanation - that is almost unheard of. The blanket response would usually be "doesn't meet lending policy" at the very least.
Any other reason for flat "no" response would be based on findings from their internal fraud teams flagging serious financial issues (not credit rating related). Not suggesting this in your case.
Edit; for correction
Edited by JonChalk on Thursday 2nd August 20:23
JonChalk said:
Advice / question from wife who is ex-broker for a different high street bank;
Have you got a valuation? Has the process with the bank got that far? Some builders and brokers are not "registered" with the banks, and they don't recognise the builders valuations, or their brokers.
Equally, she is very surprised they give no explanation - that is almost unheard of. The blanket response would usually be "doesn't meet lending policy" at the very least.
Any other reason for flat "no" response would be based on findings from their internal fraud teams flagging serious financial issues (not credit rating related). Not suggesting this in your case.
No valuation from the bank (but other properties are selling like wildfire here) 317,500 4 bed semi house in the south east.Have you got a valuation? Has the process with the bank got that far? Some builders and brokers are not "registered" with the banks, and they don't recognise the builders valuations, or their brokers.
Equally, she is very surprised they give no explanation - that is almost unheard of. The blanket response would usually be "doesn't meet lending policy" at the very least.
Any other reason for flat "no" response would be based on findings from their internal fraud teams flagging serious financial issues (not credit rating related). Not suggesting this in your case.
Application isn't even making valuation stage!!
Rtype said:
No valuation from the bank (but other properties are selling like wildfire here) 317,500 4 bed semi house in the south east.
Application isn't even making valuation stage!!
It'll either be something in the credit search (try Experian and CreditCall) - not all of them pick up the same thing - those are the other two the high street banks use.Application isn't even making valuation stage!!
...or, they've just seen something in your employment status (self-employed with little evidence of income is a common one) that's flicked a switch in the system.
Try another broker - if yours has made a data entry cock-up, it'll screw it up, and they probably won't tell you.
..Or go direct to the banks yourself to see if same thing happens....
JonChalk said:
Equally, she is very surprised they give no explanation - that is almost unheard of. The blanket response would usually be "doesn't meet lending policy" at the very least.
In fairness "doesn't meet lending policy" isn't really an explanation. I got something similar from HSBC (after having banked with First Direct for 20+ years). It was incredibly annoying. I eventually found out that if you have BTLs, even if they are all paid off, HSBC will take a worst case scenario and assume that (a) they are all empty at the same time and (b) You will be paying the fixed costs (Council Tax, Water rates etc) out of your net pay. Effing bonkers.OP - have you tried an independent broker? If time is of the essence then it's money well spent. Mine got me a good offer (2.3% offset tracker) within about 3 days.
HSBC is renown for strict lending criteria. Not sure about the other.
We have just had a mortgage approved today, valuation survey was yesterday, this was with the Halifax via a very efficient broker.
The broker was recommended by a friend who had lived with the guy whilst contracting away.
We needed a fast turnaround on (5 weeks to sort - have 2 weeks remaining for completion) and I dragged my heels initially to save committing money to the application (issues with property). This guy recommended Halifax due to need for fast turn around, and my occupation (lT Contractor). Application cost us £299 to submit (whether failed or not).
Happy to recommend if you wanted details. Luckily we got the rate agreed upon application so spared todays rate rise.
5 year fix 2.13% 20% Depsit. full repayment with £1499 product fee. Not the cheapest probably, but given our circumstances and five weeks to turn around whilst not selling our current residence meant we were happy with the outcome.
We have just had a mortgage approved today, valuation survey was yesterday, this was with the Halifax via a very efficient broker.
The broker was recommended by a friend who had lived with the guy whilst contracting away.
We needed a fast turnaround on (5 weeks to sort - have 2 weeks remaining for completion) and I dragged my heels initially to save committing money to the application (issues with property). This guy recommended Halifax due to need for fast turn around, and my occupation (lT Contractor). Application cost us £299 to submit (whether failed or not).
Happy to recommend if you wanted details. Luckily we got the rate agreed upon application so spared todays rate rise.
5 year fix 2.13% 20% Depsit. full repayment with £1499 product fee. Not the cheapest probably, but given our circumstances and five weeks to turn around whilst not selling our current residence meant we were happy with the outcome.
I had a client in a similar situation who was declined for the following reason which I understand is happening quite often now:
Online gambling
Bank statements detailing payments to bookies can instantly stop an application in its tracks even when the borrower is an otherwise perfect candidate.
Online gambling
Bank statements detailing payments to bookies can instantly stop an application in its tracks even when the borrower is an otherwise perfect candidate.
Countdown said:
In fairness "doesn't meet lending policy" isn't really an explanation. I got something similar from HSBC (after having banked with First Direct for 20+ years). It was incredibly annoying. I eventually found out that if you have BTLs, even if they are all paid off, HSBC will take a worst case scenario and assume that (a) they are all empty at the same time and (b) You will be paying the fixed costs (Council Tax, Water rates etc) out of your net pay. Effing bonkers.
OP - have you tried an independent broker? If time is of the essence then it's money well spent. Mine got me a good offer (2.3% offset tracker) within about 3 days.
It’s not really bonkers. They got very badly burned ten years ago and don’t want the same to happen again. They want the risk now to sit with the borrowers, as it rightly should if you want to borrow at secured rates. There is quite a high correlation between rental voids, they are not independent variables.OP - have you tried an independent broker? If time is of the essence then it's money well spent. Mine got me a good offer (2.3% offset tracker) within about 3 days.
For lower LTV they will still lend pretty freely. I’ve just borrowed quite a lot from them with most at under 1.4%, and they were happy to lend interest only.
OP, how does affordability look for you, and have you any defaults, arrangements to pay or late markers on any of your files?
vindaloo79 said:
What is your credit score on Noddle (free to signup) mine is 635, doesn't sound as good as 999 :-/
The number is pretty irrelevent. You could have a 999 score becasue you have had zero credit in the past - which may put off some lenders.The important thing about credit reports is the debt to income ratio, payment history, lack of ccj's etc
James_B said:
Countdown said:
In fairness "doesn't meet lending policy" isn't really an explanation. I got something similar from HSBC (after having banked with First Direct for 20+ years). It was incredibly annoying. I eventually found out that if you have BTLs, even if they are all paid off, HSBC will take a worst case scenario and assume that (a) they are all empty at the same time and (b) You will be paying the fixed costs (Council Tax, Water rates etc) out of your net pay. Effing bonkers.
OP - have you tried an independent broker? If time is of the essence then it's money well spent. Mine got me a good offer (2.3% offset tracker) within about 3 days.
It’s not really bonkers. They got very badly burned ten years ago and don’t want the same to happen again. They want the risk now to sit with the borrowers, as it rightly should if you want to borrow at secured rates. There is quite a high correlation between rental voids, they are not independent variables.OP - have you tried an independent broker? If time is of the essence then it's money well spent. Mine got me a good offer (2.3% offset tracker) within about 3 days.
The law of unintended outcomes being what it is the Offset Tracker worked out better for me in the end as I managed to borrow all the money from family.
Credit "score" means nothing to a lender.
The declines could be due to financial association with someone with adverse credit, not being on the electoral roll, gambling transactions, pay day loans, Limited company director drawings exceeding the companys net profits.............you coul unknowingly have a CIFAS marker against you.......plus dozens of other things.
As someone else said, it could be that the broker is misinterperting your circumstances and entering your info incorrectly.
As other have said, try another broker or try yourself elsewhere.
In my experience, every lender will give a reason, if they don't your broker should be contacting their BDM at that lender to find out why........if he's not doing that......ask why!
The declines could be due to financial association with someone with adverse credit, not being on the electoral roll, gambling transactions, pay day loans, Limited company director drawings exceeding the companys net profits.............you coul unknowingly have a CIFAS marker against you.......plus dozens of other things.
As someone else said, it could be that the broker is misinterperting your circumstances and entering your info incorrectly.
As other have said, try another broker or try yourself elsewhere.
In my experience, every lender will give a reason, if they don't your broker should be contacting their BDM at that lender to find out why........if he's not doing that......ask why!
Sounds like it could be due to fraud rules, of which there are many many things that could have set it off.
Have you or your partner made any credit applications in the past year or so that might have different and conflicting information?
Are either of you self-emp?
Have you had a residential mortgage previously that you've ended up renting out without permission, or vice Versa have you had a BTL mortgage you've moved into?
If you really want to know, I'd send a DSAR (Data subject access request) to the banks, which will ask them to provide all information they hold on you.
In addition you can ask what fraud systems they share information with and send the same requests to those companies.
(I believe NatWest use a system called SIRA, and both use a organisation called CIFAS)
Fraud investigators can get it wrong sometimes so best to find out if you have any leg to stand on
Have you or your partner made any credit applications in the past year or so that might have different and conflicting information?
Are either of you self-emp?
Have you had a residential mortgage previously that you've ended up renting out without permission, or vice Versa have you had a BTL mortgage you've moved into?
If you really want to know, I'd send a DSAR (Data subject access request) to the banks, which will ask them to provide all information they hold on you.
In addition you can ask what fraud systems they share information with and send the same requests to those companies.
(I believe NatWest use a system called SIRA, and both use a organisation called CIFAS)
Fraud investigators can get it wrong sometimes so best to find out if you have any leg to stand on
For further information all - we will be at approximately 66 LTV and have a hefty deposit from profits based on sale proceeds (already received and in the bank)
Also outgoings ; 2 x phones approx £30 each pcm, childcare, £217 pcm, loan £206 pcm. that is it....
No adverse credit here (to my knowledge - never ever had a problem before and everything i approach seems to back this up - never missed a payment since aged 16!!)
On electoral roll at time of applications
No gambling transactions, no Payday loans
PAYE employee (both of us)
Might have to seriously consider looking elsewhere but my problem remains, what do i declare I have been declined for!
No credit applications for over 24 months prior to mortgage.
both PAYE and provided contracts to lenders.
Had residential mortgage (property sold in July) main residence, never let.
Might have to do the DSAR!!
Chris.
Also outgoings ; 2 x phones approx £30 each pcm, childcare, £217 pcm, loan £206 pcm. that is it....
wisbech said:
What obligation is on them to give you a reason? Presume it is just a courtesy thing?
Wisbech: I have to say I have been declined by a lender to any other lenders I approach - they say "Why?" I say - they refuse to give a reason - as other posters above have said they could have said: Doesn't fit criteria / affordability / loan to value etc. The issue is how can you rectify whatever tiny gremlin there may be about you, which the lenders are using to judge and decline you, with which you cannot defend or attempt to fix yourself?Sarnie said:
Credit "score" means nothing to a lender.
The declines could be due to financial association with someone with adverse credit, not being on the electoral roll, gambling transactions, pay day loans, Limited company director drawings exceeding the companys net profits.............you coul unknowingly have a CIFAS marker against you.......plus dozens of other things.
As someone else said, it could be that the broker is misinterperting your circumstances and entering your info incorrectly.
As other have said, try another broker or try yourself elsewhere.
In my experience, every lender will give a reason, if they don't your broker should be contacting their BDM at that lender to find out why........if he's not doing that......ask why!
Thank you for your valued comments - The declines could be due to financial association with someone with adverse credit, not being on the electoral roll, gambling transactions, pay day loans, Limited company director drawings exceeding the companys net profits.............you coul unknowingly have a CIFAS marker against you.......plus dozens of other things.
As someone else said, it could be that the broker is misinterperting your circumstances and entering your info incorrectly.
As other have said, try another broker or try yourself elsewhere.
In my experience, every lender will give a reason, if they don't your broker should be contacting their BDM at that lender to find out why........if he's not doing that......ask why!
No adverse credit here (to my knowledge - never ever had a problem before and everything i approach seems to back this up - never missed a payment since aged 16!!)
On electoral roll at time of applications
No gambling transactions, no Payday loans
PAYE employee (both of us)
Might have to seriously consider looking elsewhere but my problem remains, what do i declare I have been declined for!
Greshamst said:
Sounds like it could be due to fraud rules, of which there are many many things that could have set it off.
Have you or your partner made any credit applications in the past year or so that might have different and conflicting information?
Are either of you self-emp?
Have you had a residential mortgage previously that you've ended up renting out without permission, or vice Versa have you had a BTL mortgage you've moved into?
If you really want to know, I'd send a DSAR (Data subject access request) to the banks, which will ask them to provide all information they hold on you.
In addition you can ask what fraud systems they share information with and send the same requests to those companies.
(I believe NatWest use a system called SIRA, and both use a organisation called CIFAS)
Fraud investigators can get it wrong sometimes so best to find out if you have any leg to stand on
Fraud - Yes sounds like it could be that to me but that would stun me!! And I would be curious as to what it is - Crispy squeaky clean here - documentation of everything - everything above board.Have you or your partner made any credit applications in the past year or so that might have different and conflicting information?
Are either of you self-emp?
Have you had a residential mortgage previously that you've ended up renting out without permission, or vice Versa have you had a BTL mortgage you've moved into?
If you really want to know, I'd send a DSAR (Data subject access request) to the banks, which will ask them to provide all information they hold on you.
In addition you can ask what fraud systems they share information with and send the same requests to those companies.
(I believe NatWest use a system called SIRA, and both use a organisation called CIFAS)
Fraud investigators can get it wrong sometimes so best to find out if you have any leg to stand on
No credit applications for over 24 months prior to mortgage.
both PAYE and provided contracts to lenders.
Had residential mortgage (property sold in July) main residence, never let.
Might have to do the DSAR!!
Chris.
Edited by Rtype on Friday 3rd August 12:24
Many years ago when I sold mortgages for C&G, the only time we weren't allowed to advise the applicant as to why they had been declined was for fraud reasons.
The credit search result would specifically state to not tell the applicant.
(This was around 10 years ago, so policy/criteria may well have changed)
Have you checked all the information that the broker has given to the lender for accuracy?
The credit search result would specifically state to not tell the applicant.
(This was around 10 years ago, so policy/criteria may well have changed)
Have you checked all the information that the broker has given to the lender for accuracy?
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