House decision dilemma
Discussion
Hi,
Started a new account as got a bit of dilemma around property and don't see eye to eye with my partner.
Background - I'm midway through a property purchase on a nice house in a small hamlet outside of a small village in the home counties area. Good schools, nice looking house, good views, about an hour to work. Mortgage is hefty (£400k) and that is a bit of worry as financially it is top end and requires us to both work full time to pay for it and live (well my wife will go up to 4 days). We've got a couple of young kids that are at the right age to move areas. One of the reasons we went for the house was because I'm now able to work from home so saving both time and cost.
Last week we visited my father in law who lives 260 miles away. My partner already owns a 50% share of the family home since the mother died (a small farm in West Wales about 6 miles from the main town). He is getting old and is struggling to keep the place going. He recently had an issue where he was basically bed ridden for 3 weeks on his own.
He has offered the house and small farm to us for free as long as we build him a proper timber log cabin style property on the land (permission already in place). He has lived in the house for 50 years and wishes to see out his days there. My partner is an only child and he has no family support over there but does have a network of friends.
We have £250k equity so could happily build the log cabin and remodel the house to something we would like and be mortgage free.
I can work remotely on my London wage over there (my boss who is also a friend has said that will be fine as has the CEO of the company). The local schools in the area are outstanding (better on paper than the ones on the house we are in the process of buying). My partner would have to give up their job and such is the role they would need to wait for an opportunity to arise in the local hospital. My partner could work bank shifts to keep their hand in though.
To me it is a no brainer - move there, no mortgage, invest the equity in BTLs, a holiday business and a nice future for the kids. Keep the small farm ticking over to generate enough money to pay the house bills. Lovely area, great coast, money available for interesting holidays and extended breaks with the kids. Opportunity to start a business without living costs. It feels like winning the lottery to me but I wasn't bought up there. The house we are buying means we'll be paying a hefty mortgage until i'm 68.
My other half can't make up their mind:
- feels like they are going backwards
- worried about kids having to learn welsh
- worried about future opportortunites for the kids
- feels like they have moved away, built their own life so why should they go back
- doesn't want to give up ther job - it's independence (i admire this)
- hates the look of the house - 1960s bungalow with bad layout (it is ugly - but we can remodel with our cash or knock it down - father in law said do what you like).
- holds onto childhood/adultscent memories where it was felt parents didn't support the move away and independecne decisions. Feels "controled".
On the other hand my partner isn't happy not having money for holidays and enjoyment of life. Often remarks how easy friends and such like get it with their hand outs from parents (we've had none till now). My partner would prefer to just have the money from house and spend it over where we live. I have a bit more empathy and can see my Father in laws predicament and can see how it could nicely work for all of us.
What would you do? Thoughts?
Thanks,
Started a new account as got a bit of dilemma around property and don't see eye to eye with my partner.
Background - I'm midway through a property purchase on a nice house in a small hamlet outside of a small village in the home counties area. Good schools, nice looking house, good views, about an hour to work. Mortgage is hefty (£400k) and that is a bit of worry as financially it is top end and requires us to both work full time to pay for it and live (well my wife will go up to 4 days). We've got a couple of young kids that are at the right age to move areas. One of the reasons we went for the house was because I'm now able to work from home so saving both time and cost.
Last week we visited my father in law who lives 260 miles away. My partner already owns a 50% share of the family home since the mother died (a small farm in West Wales about 6 miles from the main town). He is getting old and is struggling to keep the place going. He recently had an issue where he was basically bed ridden for 3 weeks on his own.
He has offered the house and small farm to us for free as long as we build him a proper timber log cabin style property on the land (permission already in place). He has lived in the house for 50 years and wishes to see out his days there. My partner is an only child and he has no family support over there but does have a network of friends.
We have £250k equity so could happily build the log cabin and remodel the house to something we would like and be mortgage free.
I can work remotely on my London wage over there (my boss who is also a friend has said that will be fine as has the CEO of the company). The local schools in the area are outstanding (better on paper than the ones on the house we are in the process of buying). My partner would have to give up their job and such is the role they would need to wait for an opportunity to arise in the local hospital. My partner could work bank shifts to keep their hand in though.
To me it is a no brainer - move there, no mortgage, invest the equity in BTLs, a holiday business and a nice future for the kids. Keep the small farm ticking over to generate enough money to pay the house bills. Lovely area, great coast, money available for interesting holidays and extended breaks with the kids. Opportunity to start a business without living costs. It feels like winning the lottery to me but I wasn't bought up there. The house we are buying means we'll be paying a hefty mortgage until i'm 68.
My other half can't make up their mind:
- feels like they are going backwards
- worried about kids having to learn welsh
- worried about future opportortunites for the kids
- feels like they have moved away, built their own life so why should they go back
- doesn't want to give up ther job - it's independence (i admire this)
- hates the look of the house - 1960s bungalow with bad layout (it is ugly - but we can remodel with our cash or knock it down - father in law said do what you like).
- holds onto childhood/adultscent memories where it was felt parents didn't support the move away and independecne decisions. Feels "controled".
On the other hand my partner isn't happy not having money for holidays and enjoyment of life. Often remarks how easy friends and such like get it with their hand outs from parents (we've had none till now). My partner would prefer to just have the money from house and spend it over where we live. I have a bit more empathy and can see my Father in laws predicament and can see how it could nicely work for all of us.
What would you do? Thoughts?
Thanks,
Sounds like an amazing offer...
however - gifts are not always financially free, so you would need to factor in how that 50% comes to you and what taxes might be payable at some stage
- your partner giving up her job is a big deal, how likely is another job?
- will she become live in carer for her father?
- will planning permission be granted for him to have a cabin to live in
not sure it is 100% straight forward?
however - gifts are not always financially free, so you would need to factor in how that 50% comes to you and what taxes might be payable at some stage
- your partner giving up her job is a big deal, how likely is another job?
- will she become live in carer for her father?
- will planning permission be granted for him to have a cabin to live in
not sure it is 100% straight forward?
Not quite the ending I was expecting... I thought you were going to be the reluctant one.
Looking from the outside (as even you are to some extent) it does sound like a fabulous idea despite some challenges. In your shoes I'd be equally for it.
I think it needs you to better understand the most important reasons for your wife feeling reluctant. I know people who have grown up in small villages and left promising themselves never to return... too much history and a desire for change or perhaps even not wanting to be perceived to have "failed" and return.
Or does she not want to be responsible for looking after her father/primary carer? She would be giving up her job, friends/social life etc so arguably a bigger change as you will have the job as an anchor of sorts.
If you don't do it, who will look after FiL? Also not a particularly nice topic but perhaps his life expectancy and any existing health issues needs to be considered...
Edited to add... these are the bigger issues imho:
- feels like they are going backwards
- feels like they have moved away, built their own life so why should they go back
- doesn't want to give up ther job - it's independence (i admire this)
- holds onto childhood/adultscent memories where it was felt parents didn't support the move away and independecne decisions. Feels "controled".
Looking from the outside (as even you are to some extent) it does sound like a fabulous idea despite some challenges. In your shoes I'd be equally for it.
I think it needs you to better understand the most important reasons for your wife feeling reluctant. I know people who have grown up in small villages and left promising themselves never to return... too much history and a desire for change or perhaps even not wanting to be perceived to have "failed" and return.
Or does she not want to be responsible for looking after her father/primary carer? She would be giving up her job, friends/social life etc so arguably a bigger change as you will have the job as an anchor of sorts.
If you don't do it, who will look after FiL? Also not a particularly nice topic but perhaps his life expectancy and any existing health issues needs to be considered...
Edited to add... these are the bigger issues imho:
- feels like they are going backwards
- feels like they have moved away, built their own life so why should they go back
- doesn't want to give up ther job - it's independence (i admire this)
- holds onto childhood/adultscent memories where it was felt parents didn't support the move away and independecne decisions. Feels "controled".
Just to hopefully help you out with the learning Welsh issue. In almost all of Wales you can pick to send your kids to a Welsh or English school (or sometimes there's a 50/50 option. I believe the English medium schools are getting a little more serious about teaching Welsh as a second language, but only broadly in a similar way to most schools teach French as a second language - i.e. to a pretty useless level and to no great detriment to overall education. I went to a Welsh medium school (i.e. all subjects taught through Welsh inc A level, plus having to do Welsh and Welsh Lit GCSEs as well as English and English Lit - both as 'first' languages) and believe it did me much more good than harm, despite having lived outside of Wales since 18. As I understand it, research shows clearly that a second language is good for general brain development and intelligence, and doesn't displace capability or vocab in the first language. I felt slightly hindered once or twice at uni as I didn't know a few physics and maths terms in English, but that's the only detriment I recall. Being a fluent Welsh speaker earned me a few cushy summer jobs at the council etc, plus is still a handy party piece when dealing with Welsh clients, so as I said it's done me by far more good than harm. As 'incomers' you will be much better accepted by the locals if you are embracing the culture by having your kids learn Welsh. That said, in my experience, the tales about locals in the pub switching from English to Welsh when an outsider walks in are nonsense. The Welsh are no less welcoming than rural English folk. In practice you should just pick the school which has the best teaching reputation, irrespective of its language.
It is worth seriously considering is just how isolated West Wales can be. You are several hours away from even a provincial airport, a mainline railway or a proper city, which could be a real pain day to day. But if you don't need/want to travel too often then it sounds a great opportunity to me. If it helps your partner's mindset, I think there's a world of difference between someone who never left and someone who returned to raise their kids/have a better life having lived another life elsewhere.
All the best with the decision.
It is worth seriously considering is just how isolated West Wales can be. You are several hours away from even a provincial airport, a mainline railway or a proper city, which could be a real pain day to day. But if you don't need/want to travel too often then it sounds a great opportunity to me. If it helps your partner's mindset, I think there's a world of difference between someone who never left and someone who returned to raise their kids/have a better life having lived another life elsewhere.
All the best with the decision.
Thank you. Yes I think now it is written it seems a psychological issue with my wife. She says she would do it "just for financial reasons" which I don't like as I'd like some excitement about the next chapter in our life. I fully see it isn't really a new chapter to her but I had thought with the different lifestyle, house remodel and thought of less financial pressure we could lead it would feel new.
The isolation thing is okay since we never go out for dinner or socialise really, but it is still a little worry to me too. I might not want to work in the same job so would assume it will be hard to find something else interesting remotely, but with post covid work from home opportunities maybe I can. I can accept I might have to do something different, embrace it even as working an office is not what i really enjoy, I'm far more practical than that. I do see it as escapism from a life I'm bored of living over here.
My wife is a fluent welsh speaking but she wasn't from a home that spoke it as first language and has now lost some confidence. Her Dad although born in the county was from English parents. Her immediate family all spoke Welsh at home but only when she visited they changed to English which made her feel an outcast from her family. I can say the odd word. I have found the people who vists my FiL to be friendly but they are all of the older generation. It would be nice to know some people in their late 30s/early 40s - I would plan to join a cycle club and classic car club to try and make friends.
Edit to add - thought I had replied to earlier posters -
There is permission already for the lodge. At the moment there are two static caravans both registered wit the council used for rental. At least 1 of them will go (both ideally) for FiLs place.
I need to look into taxes more. The house isn't worth a great deal for inheritance reasons (c£500k). It would need to be legally sorted as I wouldn't feel comfortable investing money in the property if I didn't at least part own.
RE: wife being carer for father - no that wouldn't be the plan. He is mobile and healthy at the moment but the recent scare of not being able to change his clothes for 3 weeks due to an issue with his back has made him worry for the future. We would probably buy in care and split it between us and a paid for carer. A career and independence is super important to my wife.
The isolation thing is okay since we never go out for dinner or socialise really, but it is still a little worry to me too. I might not want to work in the same job so would assume it will be hard to find something else interesting remotely, but with post covid work from home opportunities maybe I can. I can accept I might have to do something different, embrace it even as working an office is not what i really enjoy, I'm far more practical than that. I do see it as escapism from a life I'm bored of living over here.
My wife is a fluent welsh speaking but she wasn't from a home that spoke it as first language and has now lost some confidence. Her Dad although born in the county was from English parents. Her immediate family all spoke Welsh at home but only when she visited they changed to English which made her feel an outcast from her family. I can say the odd word. I have found the people who vists my FiL to be friendly but they are all of the older generation. It would be nice to know some people in their late 30s/early 40s - I would plan to join a cycle club and classic car club to try and make friends.
Edit to add - thought I had replied to earlier posters -
There is permission already for the lodge. At the moment there are two static caravans both registered wit the council used for rental. At least 1 of them will go (both ideally) for FiLs place.
I need to look into taxes more. The house isn't worth a great deal for inheritance reasons (c£500k). It would need to be legally sorted as I wouldn't feel comfortable investing money in the property if I didn't at least part own.
RE: wife being carer for father - no that wouldn't be the plan. He is mobile and healthy at the moment but the recent scare of not being able to change his clothes for 3 weeks due to an issue with his back has made him worry for the future. We would probably buy in care and split it between us and a paid for carer. A career and independence is super important to my wife.
Edited by DialEmma on Thursday 27th August 19:09
When we moved to the rural west of Ireland, the kids picked up Gaelic in no time at all. To me, though, the words looked like someone had just tipped a scrabble box on the floor. I swear the words had a different spelling for each day.
Your kids will have no trouble with Welsh.
I think the other issues will have to be solved between yourselves but it does sound like a marvellous opportunity.
Your kids will have no trouble with Welsh.
I think the other issues will have to be solved between yourselves but it does sound like a marvellous opportunity.
Don't think I would. As said above gifting that amount is not straightforward. There could be tax due on his death.
What if he worsens and needs to go into a care home. Who will pay-you presumably?? Could you be forced to seeing as he gave away such an asset? I don't know.
Will he still have a view about how you choose to run his farm? Other family stuff that can cause problems.
What if he worsens and needs to go into a care home. Who will pay-you presumably?? Could you be forced to seeing as he gave away such an asset? I don't know.
Will he still have a view about how you choose to run his farm? Other family stuff that can cause problems.
I was bought up in Cardiff and we have good friends who have family near Haverfordwest on a farm.
Cardiff is a great city and not 'that' far from West Wales, certainly doable for a day trip. Swansea is pretty close as well.
I love living rurally and we are bringing our kids up in a semi rural location ( Isle of Wight). Our friends would love to move to West Wales and already spend much time over there. As you know, it is a beautiful part of the UK and I don't think you would miss the home counties. I think I would move too, if only there was some work over there for my skillset.
I don't think learning Welsh would put me off ( I only learnt it until I was 11, so most of the language is a distant memory). Speaking a second language is incredibly beneficial for learning more languages especially if the local community are speaking too. Speaking another language almost becomes second nature rather than an embarrassing chore! ( Like my French language skills....)
Reading between the lines, is your wife worried that you would not be able to financially move back to the home counties if it all doesn't work??
Cardiff is a great city and not 'that' far from West Wales, certainly doable for a day trip. Swansea is pretty close as well.
I love living rurally and we are bringing our kids up in a semi rural location ( Isle of Wight). Our friends would love to move to West Wales and already spend much time over there. As you know, it is a beautiful part of the UK and I don't think you would miss the home counties. I think I would move too, if only there was some work over there for my skillset.
I don't think learning Welsh would put me off ( I only learnt it until I was 11, so most of the language is a distant memory). Speaking a second language is incredibly beneficial for learning more languages especially if the local community are speaking too. Speaking another language almost becomes second nature rather than an embarrassing chore! ( Like my French language skills....)
Reading between the lines, is your wife worried that you would not be able to financially move back to the home counties if it all doesn't work??
Just on the rural thing; we moved 6yrs ago with work to East coast of Ireland and live in a beautiful home about 2km from a village and 17km from the town (supermarkets etc).
We love it here and has been a great place for the lockdown BUT kids are now 13 and 10 and they want to get on bikes and ride to friends houses etc and due to distance / fast country roads etc this is just not possible. Most families are large and spend time with their families/cousins etc and whilst we worked hard to become part of the community it is still not the same. As a result we are looking to go back to Cardiff area and are dramatically increasing the mortgage whilst decreasing square footage but looking to rebuild quality of life which I have learnt is far more important.
Only our experience but think about where you will be in a few years...
We love it here and has been a great place for the lockdown BUT kids are now 13 and 10 and they want to get on bikes and ride to friends houses etc and due to distance / fast country roads etc this is just not possible. Most families are large and spend time with their families/cousins etc and whilst we worked hard to become part of the community it is still not the same. As a result we are looking to go back to Cardiff area and are dramatically increasing the mortgage whilst decreasing square footage but looking to rebuild quality of life which I have learnt is far more important.
Only our experience but think about where you will be in a few years...
Where are you living now, you could do no neither for a while? ie don't commit to the new house and mortgage to 68 and don't move instantly to Wales.
Stay put where you are and perhaps plan to do some long weekends up there when he's not well, have you been up there as a family regularly before now?
What brought on the current move you're planning, you/the misses/joint?
She's mentioned being controlled, is she controlling too would you say?
Just throwing random stuff out there to ponder............
Stay put where you are and perhaps plan to do some long weekends up there when he's not well, have you been up there as a family regularly before now?
What brought on the current move you're planning, you/the misses/joint?
She's mentioned being controlled, is she controlling too would you say?
Just throwing random stuff out there to ponder............
Also are you saying you are buying somewhere fro 650K (400K mortgage and 250 Equity?)
You could look locally to your father in law, but a nice house with no/a very small mortgage and then decide on the work to the farm. So you are independent/out of direct control but local enough to support him?
You could look locally to your father in law, but a nice house with no/a very small mortgage and then decide on the work to the farm. So you are independent/out of direct control but local enough to support him?
Where in west wales are you talking about? If it’s south west then there’s very little welsh spoken here anyway. The Further north you go the more likely you are to come across welsh as a first language.
If you can work remotely and live to a better standard in wales it’d be a no brainer for me.
If you can work remotely and live to a better standard in wales it’d be a no brainer for me.
difficult. just some random thoughts with no ill intent or aiming at you as such. 
Your wife clearly doesnt want to go there.
I also read into it that perhaps she does not want to assist or be around her Father and is not outright saying that.
The farm/ownership is half your wifes not yours. half her father.
If both of you are not in agreement about moving then I would not do it.
Your wife clearly doesnt want to go there.
I also read into it that perhaps she does not want to assist or be around her Father and is not outright saying that.
The farm/ownership is half your wifes not yours. half her father.
If both of you are not in agreement about moving then I would not do it.
Mortgage free at 68 or mortgage free..... much earlier...... with potential other incomes......
Wales isnt that bad. There are some nice bits.
Your new home sounds like a milestone you will carry until long after you would have wanted to retire.
Gift horses come infrequently. Don’t look back and go ‘omg I regret that’.
Wales isnt that bad. There are some nice bits.
Your new home sounds like a milestone you will carry until long after you would have wanted to retire.
Gift horses come infrequently. Don’t look back and go ‘omg I regret that’.
Just for balance..
The tax implications would be very tricky. Could be seen as disposing if assets to avoid care cost?
Your wife clearly doesn’t want to go backwards to living the life her father chooses, as opposed to the one she has made.
You know you’ll become his carers and or be stumping up for care.
Might be different if your wife is a local, but west Wales has always looked pretty anti-English when I’ve been there.
I think you’ve got a lot of talking to do with your wife! Don’t envy you.
The tax implications would be very tricky. Could be seen as disposing if assets to avoid care cost?
Your wife clearly doesn’t want to go backwards to living the life her father chooses, as opposed to the one she has made.
You know you’ll become his carers and or be stumping up for care.
Might be different if your wife is a local, but west Wales has always looked pretty anti-English when I’ve been there.
I think you’ve got a lot of talking to do with your wife! Don’t envy you.
Gassing Station | Finance | Top of Page | What's New | My Stuff