Elderly parents - best option to avoid property funding care
Discussion
I need to have this conversation with my parents but need to get my head round it.They're mid 70's and not likely to need care for several years but we need to think about it now.
They own a property outright worth circa £350k and have savings but not significant, approx £20k. Both on solid but not massive public sector pensions.
How do my brother and I avoid the house being sucked into funding potential care fees, either in a home or in supported accommodation? Should I be suggesting they hand the property over to us sooner rather than later?
They own a property outright worth circa £350k and have savings but not significant, approx £20k. Both on solid but not massive public sector pensions.
How do my brother and I avoid the house being sucked into funding potential care fees, either in a home or in supported accommodation? Should I be suggesting they hand the property over to us sooner rather than later?
Venisonpie said:
I need to have this conversation with my parents but need to get my head round it.They're mid 70's and not likely to need care for several years but we need to think about it now.
They own a property outright worth circa £350k and have savings but not significant, approx £20k. Both on solid but not massive public sector pensions.
How do my brother and I avoid the house being sucked into funding potential care fees, either in a home or in supported accommodation? Should I be suggesting they hand the property over to us sooner rather than later?
I think that could be a fun conversation They own a property outright worth circa £350k and have savings but not significant, approx £20k. Both on solid but not massive public sector pensions.
How do my brother and I avoid the house being sucked into funding potential care fees, either in a home or in supported accommodation? Should I be suggesting they hand the property over to us sooner rather than later?
How about -' You've lived your life now - bro and me want the money in your house and then we won't lose out paying fees when we chuck you in a council run home.'
Alternatively, you could both consider that your parents deserve to live the remainder of their lives in comfort and secure in the knowledge that if their health needs require extra help - that there house money is there to provide them with the best available.
If your parents really have made a decision to NOT use their capital to fund care later in life then the Best thing both of you can do is move close to them if you dont already. We are 400 yards from my mum and dad. You are a couple of minutes away in an emergency. Its easy to get shopping for them and drop it off. My dad has around 1/4 acre garden so it can be mowed with our ride on and I can do the strimming in 10 minutes - he can still do the rest at 82. If you need to move them to hospital its easy - pic them up and drop them off before work. Dr is 2 miles dow the road as is local shop with pretty much everything. My dad is struggling with the housework as mum has just had another cancer op and is to tight to pay himself so I have just offered to pay a local girl to come and clean for a few hours each week because I would rather not do that in my mimited spare time.
Ziplobb said:
If your parents really have made a decision to NOT use their capital to fund care later in life then the Best thing both of you can do is move close to them if you dont already. We are 400 yards from my mum and dad. You are a couple of minutes away in an emergency. Its easy to get shopping for them and drop it off. My dad has around 1/4 acre garden so it can be mowed with our ride on and I can do the strimming in 10 minutes - he can still do the rest at 82. If you need to move them to hospital its easy - pic them up and drop them off before work. Dr is 2 miles dow the road as is local shop with pretty much everything. My dad is struggling with the housework as mum has just had another cancer op and is to tight to pay himself so I have just offered to pay a local girl to come and clean for a few hours each week because I would rather not do that in my mimited spare time.
Or get them to move closer to you - maybe downsize if you are worrying about money. I had the option of them doing that years ago. They didn't in the end. Big mistake for me. As their only son. Spent three years going up and down the motorway - 2hrs each way, trying to "help" as they both succumbed to cancer. Full time job and a couple of young kids. Nearly killed ME.In my experience, when they are still active they may be amenable to this - can socialise, make new friends etc. When they get older/ill, they won't want to move away from their house/friends.
They saved and paid for their home, so they should benefit from its value in their dotage if it means them getting to live in a better care home.
As others have said, why should we/society pay for their care so you get the inheritance? (I know folk will claim "paid our taxes, its our rights" etc., but the laws that are in place dictate our rights, and care home costs are means tested)
As others have said, why should we/society pay for their care so you get the inheritance? (I know folk will claim "paid our taxes, its our rights" etc., but the laws that are in place dictate our rights, and care home costs are means tested)
Usual story though isn't it.
Some folk save all their lives, are frugal, work hard try to improve life for their offspring but their money is spent on healthcare and taken from them in taxes. Others live on benefits all their lives, blow everything on fancy holidays, fags, drink, tat stuff then get their final years paid for having enjoyed themselves on the hard work of others.
Watched it happen to previous in laws....
My own parents stayed at home until their final days, my sister ended up looking after them as she never left home. (I was a few hundred mile away with other issues).
Some folk save all their lives, are frugal, work hard try to improve life for their offspring but their money is spent on healthcare and taken from them in taxes. Others live on benefits all their lives, blow everything on fancy holidays, fags, drink, tat stuff then get their final years paid for having enjoyed themselves on the hard work of others.
Watched it happen to previous in laws....
My own parents stayed at home until their final days, my sister ended up looking after them as she never left home. (I was a few hundred mile away with other issues).
It's tricky and quickly boils down to : Why should the person that saved have to pay when the person that wasted everything gets it all for free?
Care fees in old age have become a new type of inheritance tax - rather than the government taxing purely on death, they now take it (into the economy) at £4k per month for the few years before you die.......
Care fees in old age have become a new type of inheritance tax - rather than the government taxing purely on death, they now take it (into the economy) at £4k per month for the few years before you die.......
Halitosis said:
They saved and paid for their home, so they should benefit from its value in their dotage if it means them getting to live in a better care home.
As others have said, why should we/society pay for their care so you get the inheritance? (I know folk will claim "paid our taxes, its our rights" etc., but the laws that are in place dictate our rights, and care home costs are means tested)
£350K at £1K a week each for care home fees is going to last around three years and four months.As others have said, why should we/society pay for their care so you get the inheritance? (I know folk will claim "paid our taxes, its our rights" etc., but the laws that are in place dictate our rights, and care home costs are means tested)
On the other hand, somebody who decided not to work and just live off benefits is going to be given it for free.
You can really see why for a lot of people there is literally no point ever working.
Joey Deacon said:
£350K at £1K a week each for care home fees is going to last around three years and four months.
On the other hand, somebody who decided not to work and just live off benefits is going to be given it for free.
You can really see why for a lot of people there is literally no point ever working.
It isn't rocket science, as I said earlier it is choice. You chose to have a nice house - you could equally just give your kids extra money each month, same with car, holiday etc. Or for example private vs NHS. Same in later years, blow all your money if you want, just don't expect a choice of care. I haven't heard there is anything wrong with state provided care, but if you want freedom to choose where you are, the type of environment, activities on offer, people around you etc then like anything else it has a premium.On the other hand, somebody who decided not to work and just live off benefits is going to be given it for free.
You can really see why for a lot of people there is literally no point ever working.
If care given to everyone was the same you can bet a large chunk of people would want to pay for a better service, just as you do with anything else.
Joey Deacon said:
Halitosis said:
They saved and paid for their home, so they should benefit from its value in their dotage if it means them getting to live in a better care home.
As others have said, why should we/society pay for their care so you get the inheritance? (I know folk will claim "paid our taxes, its our rights" etc., but the laws that are in place dictate our rights, and care home costs are means tested)
£350K at £1K a week each for care home fees is going to last around three years and four months.As others have said, why should we/society pay for their care so you get the inheritance? (I know folk will claim "paid our taxes, its our rights" etc., but the laws that are in place dictate our rights, and care home costs are means tested)
On the other hand, somebody who decided not to work and just live off benefits is going to be given it for free.
You can really see why for a lot of people there is literally no point ever working.
Jasey_ said:
Quite often they will be in the same care home and the self funders will be paying more for the same care than the council are paying for the non self funders.
You are better of working but making sure you have f
k all left by the time you come to needing care (Or have millions).
And hope you don't have kids who care more about their inheritance than your welfare.....You are better of working but making sure you have f
k all left by the time you come to needing care (Or have millions).Venisonpie said:
I need to have this conversation with my parents but need to get my head round it.They're mid 70's and not likely to need care for several years but we need to think about it now.
They own a property outright worth circa £350k and have savings but not significant, approx £20k. Both on solid but not massive public sector pensions.
How do my brother and I avoid the house being sucked into funding potential care fees, either in a home or in supported accommodation? Should I be suggesting they hand the property over to us sooner rather than later?
Why should I have to pay for your parents care once their assets have been deliberately transferred to you ?They own a property outright worth circa £350k and have savings but not significant, approx £20k. Both on solid but not massive public sector pensions.
How do my brother and I avoid the house being sucked into funding potential care fees, either in a home or in supported accommodation? Should I be suggesting they hand the property over to us sooner rather than later?
You need a Protective Property Trust.
By default, if parent A passes away then their share of the house ownership is transferred to parent B, which then allows the government to sell their house to fund their elderly care. With a protective property trust parent A's share of the property is transferred to the children, meaning the house is no longer fully owned by parent B, so can't be included in financial assessments when determining valuation of assets.
It's designed to ensure children from previous relationships get their inheritance, but works for this purpose too.
By default, if parent A passes away then their share of the house ownership is transferred to parent B, which then allows the government to sell their house to fund their elderly care. With a protective property trust parent A's share of the property is transferred to the children, meaning the house is no longer fully owned by parent B, so can't be included in financial assessments when determining valuation of assets.
It's designed to ensure children from previous relationships get their inheritance, but works for this purpose too.
Venisonpie said:
I need to have this conversation with my parents but need to get my head round it.They're mid 70's and not likely to need care for several years but we need to think about it now.
They own a property outright worth circa £350k and have savings but not significant, approx £20k. Both on solid but not massive public sector pensions.
How do my brother and I avoid the house being sucked into funding potential care fees, either in a home or in supported accommodation? Should I be suggesting they hand the property over to us sooner rather than later?
Having seen an elderly relative who didn't have their own home live on state-supported care in her final years; trust me - your parents want to be funding the best possible care they can, if they need it.They own a property outright worth circa £350k and have savings but not significant, approx £20k. Both on solid but not massive public sector pensions.
How do my brother and I avoid the house being sucked into funding potential care fees, either in a home or in supported accommodation? Should I be suggesting they hand the property over to us sooner rather than later?
However, I'm sure you're trying to take control of the assets so that you can "top up" that care with the money that you'll benefit from........right?
Muzzer79 said:
Having seen an elderly relative who didn't have their own home live on state-supported care in her final years; trust me - your parents want to be funding the best possible care they can, if they need it.
As someone said above, generally they're the same places. There aren't many areas that can support exclusively privately funded care homes - and those that do have eye-watering costs.My mum became almost paraplegic and was in a very good, but small, place but the owner sold up as they just couldn't make it pay. Next place she was in was almost exclusively council funded - of 25 residents only her, and a bloke who'd been a dentist, where paying for themselves. Everyone else was council funded and they were paying £300/wk less (and this was a few years ago now). Many had owned their own homes but had moved them on to family members. Mum was pretty right-wing and was adamant that it was right she should pay, but it wore thin even with her after a while.
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