Finding information to settle an estate
Discussion
Hi All,
Just a few days ago, my partner and I were devastated to have a visit from the police, notifying us that her son (my stepson) had taken his life.
We will soon be faced with having to sort out his financial affairs. Obviously, we will have to wait until we receive a death certificate - which will probably be in the next week or so, but we are unsure what to do after that.
Like many young people, he made all his financial transactions on his phone; the police still hold the belongings that were on him at the time, but even if we had the phone, we have no way of getting into it, as we don't know the phone number.
He left his laptop and one of his email accounts open at home and we have been able to find that he had accounts with the Nationwide (amongst others), but we think it very likely, that he had other bank accounts too. How can we find out, what accounts he had and close them down ?
We have found that he purchased some cryptocurrency from an organisation called 'Simplex' - which seems to be based in Israel; he also made purchases from a company called DEGIRO - though in neither case do we know what he purchased or the value of the transaction. We simply don't know if it is even worth even trying to find out what these might have amounted to.
We know that his car was insured and that he paid for it on a monthly basis - but how can we cancel that insurance, when we don't even know who it is with ?
My better half and I, have 'old-fashioned' (paper) bank statements and paperwork for all bills paid and financial transactions; but how does one go about finding any financial information, when the holder did everything online - using multiple email addresses and bank accounts of which we have no knowledge ?
Any advice/guidance would be much appreciated - 'thank you'.
Just a few days ago, my partner and I were devastated to have a visit from the police, notifying us that her son (my stepson) had taken his life.
We will soon be faced with having to sort out his financial affairs. Obviously, we will have to wait until we receive a death certificate - which will probably be in the next week or so, but we are unsure what to do after that.
Like many young people, he made all his financial transactions on his phone; the police still hold the belongings that were on him at the time, but even if we had the phone, we have no way of getting into it, as we don't know the phone number.
He left his laptop and one of his email accounts open at home and we have been able to find that he had accounts with the Nationwide (amongst others), but we think it very likely, that he had other bank accounts too. How can we find out, what accounts he had and close them down ?
We have found that he purchased some cryptocurrency from an organisation called 'Simplex' - which seems to be based in Israel; he also made purchases from a company called DEGIRO - though in neither case do we know what he purchased or the value of the transaction. We simply don't know if it is even worth even trying to find out what these might have amounted to.
We know that his car was insured and that he paid for it on a monthly basis - but how can we cancel that insurance, when we don't even know who it is with ?
My better half and I, have 'old-fashioned' (paper) bank statements and paperwork for all bills paid and financial transactions; but how does one go about finding any financial information, when the holder did everything online - using multiple email addresses and bank accounts of which we have no knowledge ?
Any advice/guidance would be much appreciated - 'thank you'.
Vasco said:
Surely, he couldn't survive with absolutely no paperwork? All in a drawer/box somewhere?
We cannot find any paperwork - apart from the V5C registration document for his car.I gather that 'the modern way', is to do everything online - with regard to his Nationwide account, an email states that his monthly statement is available for download, but the email only shows the last few digits of the account number and in any case, we don't know the password to access the account.
Even with a death certificate, if we approach any financial institution, how do they know that we aren't fraudsters trying to empty an account ?
joshleb said:
Do you have access to his mobile? Apps on there could be an indication of other accounts he's got.
The Police currently hold his mobile, but we'd have to guess the correct code, just to open it.His laptop shows that he had a program called 'Kleopatra' installed; a Google search tells me that :
'Kleopatra is a certificate manager and GUI for GnuPG. The software stores your OpenPGP certificates and keys. It is available for Windows and Linux. In association with the KMail email client, you can also take advantages of the cryptographical features for your communication via email.'
I'm not even sure what this ^^^ means, but it would appear, that whatever he had, was kept very securely.
He also had installed on his laptop, an 'Atomic Wallet ' - 'for managing Bitcoin, Ethereum and Litecoin etc'.
Also installed, is 'Electrum' - which is described as being a 'Bitcoin wallet'.
Our primary concern, isn't so much trying to get his assets, but ensuring that no automatic payments are made - which could be from bank accounts that we aren't yet aware of.
As an older person, I only have experience of going into a high-street bank or building society; I wouldn't recognise cryptocurrency if I saw it
.So sorry to hear about your step-son.
Most banks will have bereavement teams very used to dealing with this sort of situation and, once you can access a primary bank account, a lot of other things will become clear.
It would be worth speaking to his employer who, again, should be helpful in confirming which bank account he was paid into, whether he had separate accounts for expenses/bonuses etc
Finally - and sorry to have to bring this up - prepare yourself and prepare your partner for finding things that he might never have wanted you to know.
Most banks will have bereavement teams very used to dealing with this sort of situation and, once you can access a primary bank account, a lot of other things will become clear.
It would be worth speaking to his employer who, again, should be helpful in confirming which bank account he was paid into, whether he had separate accounts for expenses/bonuses etc
Finally - and sorry to have to bring this up - prepare yourself and prepare your partner for finding things that he might never have wanted you to know.
This is terrible news, I'm sorry for your loss.
I would just ring the companies you have identified and tell them the situation - there will be procedures in place for this and they can advise of the next steps accordingly.
It is likely you will need to provide copies of the death certificate when it is available - get plenty of copies at the point of receiving it as it will be easier than trying to get additional ones later.
I would just ring the companies you have identified and tell them the situation - there will be procedures in place for this and they can advise of the next steps accordingly.
It is likely you will need to provide copies of the death certificate when it is available - get plenty of copies at the point of receiving it as it will be easier than trying to get additional ones later.
ClaphamGT3 said:
So sorry to hear about your step-son.
It would be worth speaking to his employer who, again, should be helpful in confirming which bank account he was paid into, whether he had separate accounts for expenses/bonuses etc
We've been in touch with his employers - they won't give us any information 'because of GDPR' regulations, but they will provide this to the Police.It would be worth speaking to his employer who, again, should be helpful in confirming which bank account he was paid into, whether he had separate accounts for expenses/bonuses etc
ClaphamGT3 said:
So sorry to hear about your step-son.
Finally - and sorry to have to bring this up - prepare yourself and prepare your partner for finding things that he might never have wanted you to know.
Wise words indeed.Finally - and sorry to have to bring this up - prepare yourself and prepare your partner for finding things that he might never have wanted you to know.
Once you have a death certificate, someone will have to take out a Grant of Probate (if a will left) or Letters of Administration (if no will). I assume it will be the latter. You will probably need this for some organisations (banks etc) unless he only had minimal funds. Only then can you finalise matters - but you need to ensure that you have included all his assets. It sounds like you may need to seek the help of a solicitor.
Vasco said:
Once you have a death certificate, someone will have to take out a Grant of Probate (if a will left) or Letters of Administration (if no will). I assume it will be the latter. You will probably need this for some organisations (banks etc) unless he only had minimal funds. Only then can you finalise matters - but you need to ensure that you have included all his assets. It sounds like you may need to seek the help of a solicitor.
+1The Crypto side of things is beyond my understanding and will need a legal person with experience in such things.
Vasco said:
Once you have a death certificate, someone will have to take out a Grant of Probate (if a will left) or Letters of Administration (if no will). I assume it will be the latter. You will probably need this for some organisations (banks etc) unless he only had minimal funds. Only then can you finalise matters - but you need to ensure that you have included all his assets. It sounds like you may need to seek the help of a solicitor.
This is the wrong way round you need all the information about his finances before you apply for probate, if probate is required! Probate maybe required for institutions to release the funds not tell you about them. Most banks will release fairly significant sums without probate, often up £10000 or more. NS&I are a nightmare and always seem to want probate.As someone else said above the information from his bank will help you unravel the finances. As the administrator/next of kin of the estate the bank will release this information to you. GDPR is not applicable. I found the Breavement teams with most businesses very helpful and understanding.
It’s a horrible time and hard work when you are dealing with all the emotional fall out as well.
Mr Dendrite said:
Vasco said:
Once you have a death certificate, someone will have to take out a Grant of Probate (if a will left) or Letters of Administration (if no will). I assume it will be the latter. You will probably need this for some organisations (banks etc) unless he only had minimal funds. Only then can you finalise matters - but you need to ensure that you have included all his assets. It sounds like you may need to seek the help of a solicitor.
This is the wrong way round you need all the information about his finances before you apply for probate, if probate is required! Probate maybe required for institutions to release the funds not tell you about them. Most banks will release fairly significant sums without probate, often up £10000 or more. NS&I are a nightmare and always seem to want probate.As someone else said above the information from his bank will help you unravel the finances. As the administrator/next of kin of the estate the bank will release this information to you. GDPR is not applicable. I found the Breavement teams with most businesses very helpful and understanding.
It’s a horrible time and hard work when you are dealing with all the emotional fall out as well.
Yes, all assets etc need to be identified before a Probate/Letters can be obtained.
Vasco said:
Mr Dendrite said:
Vasco said:
Once you have a death certificate, someone will have to take out a Grant of Probate (if a will left) or Letters of Administration (if no will). I assume it will be the latter. You will probably need this for some organisations (banks etc) unless he only had minimal funds. Only then can you finalise matters - but you need to ensure that you have included all his assets. It sounds like you may need to seek the help of a solicitor.
This is the wrong way round you need all the information about his finances before you apply for probate, if probate is required! Probate maybe required for institutions to release the funds not tell you about them. Most banks will release fairly significant sums without probate, often up £10000 or more. NS&I are a nightmare and always seem to want probate.As someone else said above the information from his bank will help you unravel the finances. As the administrator/next of kin of the estate the bank will release this information to you. GDPR is not applicable. I found the Breavement teams with most businesses very helpful and understanding.
It’s a horrible time and hard work when you are dealing with all the emotional fall out as well.
Yes, all assets etc need to be identified before a Probate/Letters can be obtained.
very sorry for your loss
you can search for some lost accounts here - https://www.mylostaccount.org.uk/
can select all banks on their list and will get email back for each so perhaps set up an email just for that
you can search for some lost accounts here - https://www.mylostaccount.org.uk/
can select all banks on their list and will get email back for each so perhaps set up an email just for that
I was at a solicitor on Monday with regard to probate. They mentioned a service for, as I recall, £150, which trawls though financial organisations and flags up the ones with which the deceased had any dealings. The result would be a simple 'yes' or 'no', so a 'yes' would then require a letter with more info to each relevant financial organisation as a follow up, to request account details etc.
I'm guessing that this would only cover accounts, insurances etc. covered by the Financial Services Authority and not cryptocurrency though.
I'm guessing that this would only cover accounts, insurances etc. covered by the Financial Services Authority and not cryptocurrency though.
Edited by GliderRider on Saturday 30th October 03:08
Sorry for your loss.
Police will only give the phone back after the coroners report, as with anything else he had on him.
I’ve dealt with the same situation last year, if the police have his wallet or you know where it is the easiest way is to look for his bank cards to see banking, you can call any banks you may know of now and freeze accounts from money being released but money can still be paid in.
You should be able to obtain a preliminary death certificate in the mean time to prove his passing.
Use the government ‘tell us once site’ it’s helpful with certain information and notifying relevant sources.
When you find out which banks he was with it will be up to you to go through his statements n contact other relevant companies.
Regarding Crypto I’m not sure much can be done unless you can log in so that could be gone forever.
Some phone shops can still get into a locked phone, they aren’t supposed to but if provided with proof of circumstances they just might. It’s illegal but I didn’t care at the time n still don’t I’m that situation.
Most importantly, take time out to process his passing because emotions will run high and it can get frustrating doing all these things.
Police will only give the phone back after the coroners report, as with anything else he had on him.
I’ve dealt with the same situation last year, if the police have his wallet or you know where it is the easiest way is to look for his bank cards to see banking, you can call any banks you may know of now and freeze accounts from money being released but money can still be paid in.
You should be able to obtain a preliminary death certificate in the mean time to prove his passing.
Use the government ‘tell us once site’ it’s helpful with certain information and notifying relevant sources.
When you find out which banks he was with it will be up to you to go through his statements n contact other relevant companies.
Regarding Crypto I’m not sure much can be done unless you can log in so that could be gone forever.
Some phone shops can still get into a locked phone, they aren’t supposed to but if provided with proof of circumstances they just might. It’s illegal but I didn’t care at the time n still don’t I’m that situation.
Most importantly, take time out to process his passing because emotions will run high and it can get frustrating doing all these things.
One thing I'll add on the crypto front is that they give you a set of key words when you setup your virtual wallet, so if your phone is lost or you need to get back into it then you use those key words. They ask you to print these out and store them safely, so they might be somewhere on a sheet of paper or in a notes section on a phone. If you know who the wallet was with (again should be an application on the phone or computer) then that could be a potential means of accessing that.
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