Pension performance

[Puggit]

Just received my update from the pension company. Performance in 2022 can only be described as 'disappointing'. Loss of 10% during the year, despite a 5% increase in investment.

I can't really remember a year where there's been any noticeable increase. Obviously Covid didn't help for 2020/2021...


It's a well known firm that many have gripes with. Is this fairly standard across the board, or should I look elsewhere?

[Puzzles]

It's been a difficult year, which provider and which funds are you in?

I'm with Standard Life in one of their lifestyle funds and I've not been too impressed.

[Chris Type R]

Equities have improved since the beginning of the year (which might be excluded from the report), but 2022 was poor in my experience. I'd probably be down now, except for me buying in 2020/21/22.

[Puggit]

Puzzles said:

It's been a difficult year, which provider and which funds are you in?

I'm with Standard Life in one of their lifestyle funds and I've not been too impressed.

St James Place, mix of investments with the majority being equity spread across NA (40%), APAC, EU and fixed interest.

[simon800]

Puggit said:

St James Place…….

Say no more

Edit;

Puggit said:

I can't really remember a year where there's been any noticeable increase. Obviously Covid didn't help for 2020/2021...

This should be very concerning, global equities had great years in 2020 and 2021, returning + 12% and + 20% respectively.

If you saw no noticeable increase across these two years I'd be investigating as a matter of urgency.

Edited by simon800 on Friday 3rd February 12:56

[Puzzles]

simon800 said:

Puggit said:

St James Place…….

Say no more

yeah thats not going to help

[dingg]

Puggit said:

Just received my update from the pension company. Performance in 2022 can only be described as 'disappointing'. Loss of 10% during the year, despite a 5% increase in investment.

I can't really remember a year where there's been any noticeable increase. Obviously Covid didn't help for 2020/2021...


It's a well known firm that many have gripes with. Is this fairly standard across the board, or should I look elsewhere?

I reckon most will be probably about the same over 2022. You are not alone.

Sjp aren't the best for product or fees though. You may improve performance with another sipp provider

[Puggit]

dingg said:

I reckon most will be probably about the same over 2022. You are not alone.

Sjp aren't the best for product or fees though. You may improve performance with another sipp provider

Been on the cards for a while to move away. Just caught on that each time they shuffle your investments they reset the clock on the exit fees. Need to find out where we're at with that and take it from there.

[soupdragon1]

I'm end of January to end of January for annual statements and overall performance is up a little, which surprised me a bit, as it was tracking down around 2% ish earlier in the year. Effectively, I've gained the equivalent value of a monthly contribution in overall annual gain. Legal and general have earned their fee this year, so I've got to doff my hat to them.

[FlyingPanda]

soupdragon1 said:

I'm end of January to end of January for annual statements and overall performance is up a little, which surprised me a bit, as it was tracking down around 2% ish earlier in the year. Effectively, I've gained the equivalent value of a monthly contribution in overall annual gain. Legal and general have earned their fee this year, so I've got to doff my hat to them.

You've done well there. Over the same period I am down -3.97%. Over 10 years I'm up at about 75% overall so I guess that's fairly average?

[-Cappo-]

Puzzles said:

simon800 said:

Puggit said:

St James Place…….

Say no more

yeah thats not going to help

I was chatting casually to a friend recently who said he'd got some money invested, wasn't sure about performance and then told me it was with SJP. I had a kinda "whoah, watch out then" moment, but other than high fees, what are the other known negatives with them? I believe they make it difficult to withdraw funds, amongst other things?

This is all assuming we're allowed to have this discussion here! I'd just like to help him not get burnt.

[Mr Pointy]

-Cappo- said:

I was chatting casually to a friend recently who said he'd got some money invested, wasn't sure about performance and then told me it was with SJP. I had a kinda "whoah, watch out then" moment, but other than high fees, what are the other known negatives with them? I believe they make it difficult to withdraw funds, amongst other things?

This is all assuming we're allowed to have this discussion here! I'd just like to help him not get burnt.

Try these threads for a start:
https://www.pistonheads.com/gassing/topic.asp?h=0&...
https://www.pistonheads.com/gassing/topic.asp?h=0&...
https://www.pistonheads.com/gassing/topic.asp?h=0&...
https://www.pistonheads.com/gassing/topic.asp?h=0&...

[simon800]

FlyingPanda said:

You've done well there. Over the same period I am down -3.97%. Over 10 years I'm up at about 75% overall so I guess that's fairly average?

I'd say it depends how it's been invested - global equities have returned 182% in 10 years. So if it's 100% equities the relative performance is quite poor.

[simon800]

-Cappo- said:

I was chatting casually to a friend recently who said he'd got some money invested, wasn't sure about performance and then told me it was with SJP. I had a kinda "whoah, watch out then" moment, but other than high fees, what are the other known negatives with them? I believe they make it difficult to withdraw funds, amongst other things?

This is all assuming we're allowed to have this discussion here! I'd just like to help him not get burnt.

It's the extortionate fees combined with really poor investment performance.

For example their global equity fund when I last looked had underperformed global equities by 4.7% p/annum.

From the thread the poster above linked to an example of the impact of this was that on a £100k investment with SJP in their global equity fund versus a low cost global equity index tracker extrapolated over 2 decades the SJP investment led to a return net of fees of £365k whilst the low cost global equity index tracker was £866k.

The consistently woeful performance of their funds and fees combined would cost someone £0.5mn if the underperformance/fees continued over that period.

[Blackpuddin]

Puzzles said:

I'm with Standard Life in one of their lifestyle funds and I've not been too impressed.

Same here, I've just had the SL statement on my quite measly five-figure pension fund. Its value has dropped by 10 percent in a year
What's intriguing me though is the list of costs and charges on the back. These add up to over £750 and include £213 for the fund management charge, £37 for fund transaction costs, and £5.11 for 'additional expenses' (a coffee and sandwich maybe?).
The other £500 comes from 'SIPP charges' at £200 and 'advice charges' at £300. This last one I find particularly fascinating as I haven't spoken to anyone there for the last three years at least. What could this refer to?

[xeny]

simon800 said:

The consistently woeful performance of their funds and fees combined would cost someone £0.5mn if the underperformance/fees continued over that period.

That's an average of £25,000 a year. I find people who can't find the time to at least look at what they can do to reduce investment fees deeply frustrating as the potential financial benefit for each hour it takes is hard to beat in pretty much any occupation.

[craig1912]

Puggit said:

St James Place,.

That’s probably your answer, a combination of average performing funds and high fees. Everyone has suffered to an extent but I’ve just checked mine and am pleasantly surprised (Royal London with low fees).

[GT3Manthey]

craig1912 said:

That’s probably your answer, a combination of average performing funds and high fees. Everyone has suffered to an extent but I’ve just checked mine and am pleasantly surprised (Royal London with low fees).

What’s your % performance this year if I may ask ?

[Phooey]

Need to be careful with fees. I was with Standard Life on their 'Wrap' platform. So I was paying IFA, SL (Wrap), transaction fees, fund costs, etc. Possibly approx 3% all in.


Now Vanguard - 0.37% all in.

[craig1912]

GT3Manthey said:

What’s your % performance this year if I may ask ?

This year around 7%. Last year around -1.5%. Those short term figures are really not that relevant when looking at a retirement of 20-30 years though as they don’t take into account my risk profile and longer term ambitions.
I know you are with SJP and that might be entirely right for you but, in general terms there are better options both in terms of charges and definitely fund performance.