NI Question

[V41LEY]

Looking for help to understand the NI position for my non-resident BIL.
He worked in the UK when a student so obtained a NI number for payroll.
He holds a UK passport but has never worked in the UK since graduating c40 years ago.
Has lived in the US for 30 years, has an American wife and two daughters.
His wife doesn’t hold a UK passport but his daughters qualify for one through him.
Nearing retirement and thinking about his options.
If he and his wife returned to the UK what if any state pension / NHS treatment would they be entitled to ? His wife has health challenges and is on medication in the US that currently costs around £4k a month but is free if prescribed on the NHS. He knows he hasn’t made any contribution in NI payments as a non-dom but as a bone fide UK passport holder looking to return home, could they expect to receive any benefits ? He makes the point that lots of people in the UK who have never worked for whatever reason; mental, physical but receive help from the State.
What’s the thinking ?

[Simpo Two]

V41LEY said:

He makes the point that lots of people in the UK who have never worked for whatever reason; mental, physical but receive help from the State.
What’s the thinking ?

My thinking is that this constitutes health tourism and I take a very dim view of it. The NHS is fked as it is.

Sorry if that's not the answer you wanted. 38 years NI contributions might be a start.

[V41LEY]

Simpo Two said:

My thinking is that this constitutes health tourism and I take a very dim view of it. The NHS is fked as it is.

Sorry if that's not the answer you wanted. 38 years NI contributions might be a start.

I don’t disagree with your view in any sense but for the sake of understanding the position where would he stand ? He would return with a US pension from his employment at one of the state universities over there but would he be entitled to any UK benefits as a UK citizen ? I’m guessing his wife would have no entitlements.

[guywilko]

I'm a GP

NHS entitlement is based on “ordinary residence”

i.e. if you live in the uk now and intend to do so in future, you are eligible for NhS care.

Forget NI, nothing to do with health entitlement, its just a tax that generates state pension rights.

[eliot]

guywilko said:

I'm a GP

NHS entitlement is based on “ordinary residence”

i.e. if you live in the uk now and intend to do so in future, you are eligible for NhS care.

Forget NI, nothing to do with health entitlement, its just a tax that generates state pension rights.

Quite shocking to hear that.

[guywilko]

Yep, handout Britain. World Health Service.

It's very difficult for my teams to administer, arguments over patients who live in sunny climes for half the year.
A lot of patients retire back to the UK when employer health insurance runs off in USA etc.

We need to scrap the basic concept of the NHS and move to a compulsory self insurance scheme like Australia

[funinhounslow]

anonymous said:

[redacted]

There is an NHS surcharge added to UK settlement visa fees

[V41LEY]

Thanks all. The reality is they would unlikely move back to UK, not least as she is a very proud Texan so it’s just an exercise in the possibilities. He might choose to pay the NI to get a basic UK pension paid but US tax laws are a minefield in themselves.

[Edible Roadkill]

Tell them they should just float across the channel on an inflatable dinghy & they’ll get the lot, home handouts & healthcare, full shooting match thrown at them with welcome arms.

[Countdown]

anonymous said:

[redacted]

The moral issue is that despite not paying tax for however many years he wants to take benefit of the NHS. He could access the health services in the US but he wants to get a freebie. If he does access it then his costs will be funded by ordinarily resident UK taxpayers. In almost every way it's no different to the economic migrants who cross the Channel via dinghy

From the phrasing of the OP's post it's not clear whether he is actually British born in the first place. One of the big visa loopholes is when students move to the Uk from 3rd world countries, get any job they can while their here, try and marry a local, get naturalised, get divorced and then bring a spouse and family over from their birth country.

[Countdown]

guywilko said:

Yep, handout Britain. World Health Service.

It's very difficult for my teams to administer, arguments over patients who live in sunny climes for half the year.
A lot of patients retire back to the UK when employer health insurance runs off in USA etc.

We need to scrap the basic concept of the NHS and move to a compulsory self insurance scheme like Australia

Manchester Royal Infirmary were very quick when they billed my father in law about £20k after his minor heart attack.

ETA This is going back a bit to the 90's so Im not sure if it's still a thing but London hospitals used to have lots of pregannt women turning up from Nigeria and the US when they were close to delivery date. The US especially when there were likely to be complications with the pregnancies that their insurance wouldn't cover.

Edited by Countdown on Sunday 16th July 15:34

[V41LEY]

Countdown said:

From the phrasing of the OP's post it's not clear whether he is actually British born in the first place. One of the big visa loopholes is when students move to the Uk from 3rd world countries, get any job they can while their here, try and marry a local, get naturalised, get divorced and then bring a spouse and family over from their birth country.

Apologies. Born and bred Scouser, lived at home throughout Uni at Liverpool. Graduated; moved to the US and now a research professor at. K-State Kansas.