Dishwasher issue
Discussion
I have a Miele dishwasher which cost about a million quid or something. It has started to make an odd noise immediately when it is turned on, and then later in the cycle. I have reached the tentative conclusion, based on no knowledge whatsoever, that this could possibly be the filling / emptying pump making a noise. It's almost as if something is trapped in the pump. I have checked the easy to access obvious filter in the bottom of the dishwasher and this is clear.
Any ideas what the issue is, what's casuing it, what to check next etc?
Sounds similar to what our Bosch did just before it expired completely.
Water was getting into the base and triggering the anti-flood device, causing the drain pump to run for longer and longer periods until it wouldn't complete a cycle at all.
To check - tilt the machine back at about 45 degrees and see if water comes out of the bottom of it (not when the machine is on, of course). If it does, there's a leak which is allowing water to get to places where water shouldn't be.
Another check - while the noise is being made, try tilting the machine. If the noise stops immediately, it's almost certainly the anti-flood system.
Water was getting into the base and triggering the anti-flood device, causing the drain pump to run for longer and longer periods until it wouldn't complete a cycle at all.
To check - tilt the machine back at about 45 degrees and see if water comes out of the bottom of it (not when the machine is on, of course). If it does, there's a leak which is allowing water to get to places where water shouldn't be.
Another check - while the noise is being made, try tilting the machine. If the noise stops immediately, it's almost certainly the anti-flood system.
Thanks for your thoughts. Tilting the dishwasher is difficult as it is built in uner the units. The sound is only for about 30 seconds at the start of the cycle, and a similar time later (although I have to confess I didn't sit listening to it for an hour and a half so it could have made a noise part way through!). Does that sound familiar?
Rocksteadyeddie said:
Thanks for your thoughts. Tilting the dishwasher is difficult as it is built in uner the units. The sound is only for about 30 seconds at the start of the cycle, and a similar time later (although I have to confess I didn't sit listening to it for an hour and a half so it could have made a noise part way through!). Does that sound familiar?
does sound more like something caught in the pump rather than the water in the base issue above which will be caused by a leak, tipping the machine will not solve that one. No model number as usual on pistonheads! (How do you lot ever get parts for cars?).
good point on most Miele diswashers is that you can clean the pump yourself. Remove all of the filter and on the right hand side of the sump as you look down is a plastic curved moulding ( a bit like the shape of a large snail!) retained by a wire clip stretched over it. Lever the wire clip aside and release the moulding, this will also release a heap of water caught in the air break but dont panic, it may be worth removing all the water in the sump now though so you can see what you are doing. Once removed you should be able to see the pump impellor. Get a torch and have a really close look, it could be anything like a pip or seed or a chip of china but take care as it could be a shard of broken glass so dont just blindly dig your fingers in there. Assuming the machine was still working ok then it cannot be anything too big as that would have stopped the pump altogether.
once clear, re fit the pump cover and test.
Some later models use a different arrangement but the principle is much the same, its usually detailed in the instruction book.
eastlmark said:
does sound more like something caught in the pump rather than the water in the base issue above which will be caused by a leak, tipping the machine will not solve that one.
No model number as usual on pistonheads! (How do you lot ever get parts for cars?).
good point on most Miele diswashers is that you can clean the pump yourself. Remove all of the filter and on the right hand side of the sump as you look down is a plastic curved moulding ( a bit like the shape of a large snail!) retained by a wire clip stretched over it. Lever the wire clip aside and release the moulding, this will also release a heap of water caught in the air break but dont panic, it may be worth removing all the water in the sump now though so you can see what you are doing. Once removed you should be able to see the pump impellor. Get a torch and have a really close look, it could be anything like a pip or seed or a chip of china but take care as it could be a shard of broken glass so dont just blindly dig your fingers in there. Assuming the machine was still working ok then it cannot be anything too big as that would have stopped the pump altogether.
once clear, re fit the pump cover and test.
Some later models use a different arrangement but the principle is much the same, its usually detailed in the instruction book.
That sounds like a plan. Thanks. The model is a Miele G2872 SCVi.No model number as usual on pistonheads! (How do you lot ever get parts for cars?).
good point on most Miele diswashers is that you can clean the pump yourself. Remove all of the filter and on the right hand side of the sump as you look down is a plastic curved moulding ( a bit like the shape of a large snail!) retained by a wire clip stretched over it. Lever the wire clip aside and release the moulding, this will also release a heap of water caught in the air break but dont panic, it may be worth removing all the water in the sump now though so you can see what you are doing. Once removed you should be able to see the pump impellor. Get a torch and have a really close look, it could be anything like a pip or seed or a chip of china but take care as it could be a shard of broken glass so dont just blindly dig your fingers in there. Assuming the machine was still working ok then it cannot be anything too big as that would have stopped the pump altogether.
once clear, re fit the pump cover and test.
Some later models use a different arrangement but the principle is much the same, its usually detailed in the instruction book.
Oh, and what is this "instruction book" of which you speak?
Rocksteadyeddie said:
Oh, and what is this "instruction book" of which you speak?
spoken like a true pistonheader!sounds like you may have a newer version than that I have detailed for so it may be slightly different but same principle. No doubt the wire retaining clip has been replaced by a cheap and nasty plastic thing.
eastlmark said:
spoken like a true pistonheader!
sounds like you may have a newer version than that I have detailed for so it may be slightly different but same principle. No doubt the wire retaining clip has been replaced by a cheap and nasty plastic thing.
sounds like you may have a newer version than that I have detailed for so it may be slightly different but same principle. No doubt the wire retaining clip has been replaced by a cheap and nasty plastic thing.
I'll be snail hunting tonight then!
So I've had the snail apart and cleaned out the bits I can see as well as I can. Turned it back on, and..... no change. On further inspection the noise sounds as if it is coming from the immediate bottom front left (which is behind a metal cover). Would that make sense and if I were to remove said cover what might I find?
eastlmark said:
May well be a fan down there then, TBH would think it is time for profesional help. If you remove that panel though, power off at the mains!
Because I have no life I sat and listened to a good part of teh cycle last night. It definitely is a problem with the pump somewhere. It sounds like something is inside it. Would the "cleaning" I did yesterday have sorted that issue out though?OK understand there are 2 pumps in there, one for the washing that pumps the water through the arms and one for draining. Obviosuly the wash pump is running for long periods while the drain pump only runs in short bursts to enpty the water out after each wash and rinse.
Is the noise continous while the prog is washing? If yes then its a wash pump problem, much harder to access. Pretty sure though you said it was only at the start and end of the cycle. The drain pump does come on right at the start of the cycle as well as the end and several short bursts in between. Are your sure you cleared that pump out? There is sometimes a bit of glass under the impellor thats dificult to see and even harder to get out. Remove the top basket and get your head inside with a torch and have a good look around.
Is the noise continous while the prog is washing? If yes then its a wash pump problem, much harder to access. Pretty sure though you said it was only at the start and end of the cycle. The drain pump does come on right at the start of the cycle as well as the end and several short bursts in between. Are your sure you cleared that pump out? There is sometimes a bit of glass under the impellor thats dificult to see and even harder to get out. Remove the top basket and get your head inside with a torch and have a good look around.
eastlmark said:
OK understand there are 2 pumps in there, one for the washing that pumps the water through the arms and one for draining. Obviosuly the wash pump is running for long periods while the drain pump only runs in short bursts to enpty the water out after each wash and rinse.
Is the noise continous while the prog is washing? If yes then its a wash pump problem, much harder to access. Pretty sure though you said it was only at the start and end of the cycle. The drain pump does come on right at the start of the cycle as well as the end and several short bursts in between. Are your sure you cleared that pump out? There is sometimes a bit of glass under the impellor thats dificult to see and even harder to get out. Remove the top basket and get your head inside with a torch and have a good look around.
It is definately the latter. It's on for maybe 30 seconds at the start and end and briefly and periodically in the middle. Under the snail was a sort of plastic fan shaped bit. It didn't seem as if this bit came out. Does that sound right? Is the noise continous while the prog is washing? If yes then its a wash pump problem, much harder to access. Pretty sure though you said it was only at the start and end of the cycle. The drain pump does come on right at the start of the cycle as well as the end and several short bursts in between. Are your sure you cleared that pump out? There is sometimes a bit of glass under the impellor thats dificult to see and even harder to get out. Remove the top basket and get your head inside with a torch and have a good look around.
Rocksteadyeddie said:
It is definately the latter. It's on for maybe 30 seconds at the start and end and briefly and periodically in the middle. Under the snail was a sort of plastic fan shaped bit. It didn't seem as if this bit came out. Does that sound right?
yes that is the pump impellor. No it doesnt come out so dont force it. but it sounds like there is still something caught in there.eastlmark said:
yes that is the pump impellor. No it doesnt come out so dont force it. but it sounds like there is still something caught in there.
Or the bearing is knackered as I fail to understand how the design of a pump would allow anything 'harmful' to get past a filter. Especially as it's a Miele cos they are 'so' good
dickymint said:
I fail to understand how the design of a pump would allow anything 'harmful' to get past a filter. Especially as it's a Miele
cos they are 'so' good
The user is the normal problem, not cleaing filter enough, not locking it down when re fitting or removing it and letting stuff drop down, especially invisible shards of glass. Some Miele have a flap on the bottom of the cone filter which always breaks off and lets crap through.cos they are 'so' good
All dishwashers have filters yet blocked pumps is the most common call out.
Those drain pumps dont really have bearings as such,its a permenant magnet type with a floating rotor that is actually emeresed in the water its pumping. Cheap as chips to make (not to buy though) and generally reliable.
So I took the snail thing apart but couldn't see / feel anything in there. So i left it in bits and ran it through a filling cycle in the hope of washing the offending item out. I then got all the water out, put it all back together, and hey presto job done. Still haven't found the offending item but it seems as if it is out of the system.
Thanks for all the advice guys
Thanks for all the advice guys
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