Help please with oak carport/double garage size
Discussion
Evening all. Bit of advice please. I'm looking to get a double oak carport built at the end of our drive (in the back garden) and I have a quandary about size. I'm looking at 2 bays but one with a closing door on it and the other open and have been speaking with a local guy who makes them (nice thick oak structure, cedar clad, reclaimed tiles etc).
Initial thoughts were 6m by 6m but it seems 30m square floor area is a tipping point for needing planning so that could mean 6m wide by 5m deep rather than 6m deep. 5m deep doesn't seem enough for me with my E61 B5 being 4.84m long and I want to be able to open the boot for the trickle charger connection after reversing in.
Another quandary is about having a partition wall in the middle so the side with the door is fully enclosed (good to keep the weather out in winter amd dust our in summer) but would of course restrict car door opening width for both bays so wondering if I should have some sort of sliding or removable partition so when wanted the bays can be open to each other inside. Security is not a concern as garage would be at the back of our plot and the house is behind gates anyway.
So 6x5, or go 6x6 with planning. Or maybe 6x5.5 and don't tell anyone in planning as I can't see anyone would flag it as we back onto dense forest and our neighbours each side are set back and wouldn't see it anyway.
Also partition or not or a removeable/sliding one inside between the bays?
Many thanks for any thoughts or advice you may offer based on your own garage sizes.
Jules
Initial thoughts were 6m by 6m but it seems 30m square floor area is a tipping point for needing planning so that could mean 6m wide by 5m deep rather than 6m deep. 5m deep doesn't seem enough for me with my E61 B5 being 4.84m long and I want to be able to open the boot for the trickle charger connection after reversing in.
Another quandary is about having a partition wall in the middle so the side with the door is fully enclosed (good to keep the weather out in winter amd dust our in summer) but would of course restrict car door opening width for both bays so wondering if I should have some sort of sliding or removable partition so when wanted the bays can be open to each other inside. Security is not a concern as garage would be at the back of our plot and the house is behind gates anyway.
So 6x5, or go 6x6 with planning. Or maybe 6x5.5 and don't tell anyone in planning as I can't see anyone would flag it as we back onto dense forest and our neighbours each side are set back and wouldn't see it anyway.
Also partition or not or a removeable/sliding one inside between the bays?
Many thanks for any thoughts or advice you may offer based on your own garage sizes.
Jules
Julian Thompson said:
I thought 30m was only the building regs threshold.
Hi, oh maybe I'm confusing the two then? I've had a google but dont seem to get definitive into. Building regs would be less of an issue I would have thought as just a case of paying a fee for inspections rather than the potentially longer process and bigger costs of planning.If I can have 6x6 without planning that makes things a lot easier. Interested in thoughts on size usability and also issue of partition wall inside too for any other commenters.
You are indeed conflating Planning regulations with Building Regulations.
For Planning, it is either covered by Permitted Development (PD) or you will need to go through a full planning application. The rules for PD depend a lot on the location (relative to the house and proximity to boundaries) and very specifically the height of the garage. Size is only a factor if more than 50% of your land would be developed.
Once you have determined the building location, Building Regulations only apply if the internal floor space is more than 30m2. If this is the case then the building will need to follow the rules on how the building is constructed AND it will have to be checked and signed off at various stages during construction.
For Planning, it is either covered by Permitted Development (PD) or you will need to go through a full planning application. The rules for PD depend a lot on the location (relative to the house and proximity to boundaries) and very specifically the height of the garage. Size is only a factor if more than 50% of your land would be developed.
Once you have determined the building location, Building Regulations only apply if the internal floor space is more than 30m2. If this is the case then the building will need to follow the rules on how the building is constructed AND it will have to be checked and signed off at various stages during construction.
If I'm understanding your plans correctly, you're actually talking about building a 3m wide single garage and a 3m wide car port, rather than a 6m wide double garage? IMO while 6m is just about wide enough for a double, 3m is not wide enough for a single to be very practical. I'd say a minimum practical size for a single for storing a modern cars would be 3.5x6, with 4x6 being significantly better.
8x6 overall would give you about meter on each side of each car to open doors into, minus the thickness of the walls.
It's pretty unlikely that you'll be able to build either without planning permission, but if the placement is sensible (away from boundaries, not huge compared to the plot, etc) getting planning permission shouldn't be expensive or difficult.
8x6 overall would give you about meter on each side of each car to open doors into, minus the thickness of the walls.
It's pretty unlikely that you'll be able to build either without planning permission, but if the placement is sensible (away from boundaries, not huge compared to the plot, etc) getting planning permission shouldn't be expensive or difficult.
Thanks both, something like this... (quick Google result)
So one structure but with one open bay and one closed.
Looking online again then armed with responses so far looks like it is just building regs needed if over 30m square floor as I should suit all the requirements for permitted development. Plot is pretty big (third of am acre) and the drive goes past the side of the house and the existing outbuilding (from when house was village bakery 100 years ago) and the parking is at the end of the back garden that backs onto forest and structure would be in from the boundary as there is a steep slope down behind the plot down to the treeline.
I need to check now what building regs would want. Appreciate the help so far.
So one structure but with one open bay and one closed.
Looking online again then armed with responses so far looks like it is just building regs needed if over 30m square floor as I should suit all the requirements for permitted development. Plot is pretty big (third of am acre) and the drive goes past the side of the house and the existing outbuilding (from when house was village bakery 100 years ago) and the parking is at the end of the back garden that backs onto forest and structure would be in from the boundary as there is a steep slope down behind the plot down to the treeline.
I need to check now what building regs would want. Appreciate the help so far.
Maximum height of the building is 4m with an apex roof as long as no part of the building is within 2m of any boundary. If closer than 2m then impracticably lower heights (for your purposes) apply.
The height of the building is a factor of the footprint and pitch of the roof, and if using tiles then there are limits how shallow the roof pitch can be.
Best thing is to specify the garage you want then see if it falls within PD & BR, rather than the other way around. Given what you’ve said it sounds unlikely that a planning application would be unsuccessful.
If you’re going to use one of the many suppliers of these things (rather than DIY) then just talk to them, they will be familiar with all the issues and constraints.
The height of the building is a factor of the footprint and pitch of the roof, and if using tiles then there are limits how shallow the roof pitch can be.
Best thing is to specify the garage you want then see if it falls within PD & BR, rather than the other way around. Given what you’ve said it sounds unlikely that a planning application would be unsuccessful.
If you’re going to use one of the many suppliers of these things (rather than DIY) then just talk to them, they will be familiar with all the issues and constraints.
Biggest issues with Building Regulations are fireproofing (particularly if the garage is sited close to a boundary) and structure.
As a post-and-beam structure, you will need Structural Engineer's calculations to prove it will stand up (masonry garages don't usuall need structural calcs. as there's an 'idiot's guide' embodied in the Building Regulations Approved Document, but there's nothing similar for timber frame structures).
The manufacturers will usually supply calcs, built into their costs, but check to make sure.
As a post-and-beam structure, you will need Structural Engineer's calculations to prove it will stand up (masonry garages don't usuall need structural calcs. as there's an 'idiot's guide' embodied in the Building Regulations Approved Document, but there's nothing similar for timber frame structures).
The manufacturers will usually supply calcs, built into their costs, but check to make sure.
I'd say just get the planning and building regs and make it bigger.
I'm just finishing a garage build and I spent ages planning what to build to avoid planning and building control.
Then I decided to stop compromising and just follow the rules and build it bigger. It's a small cost in the scheme of what the whole building will cost.
If you are closing one side in I'd say 7m wide minimum, 8m ideally. and 6m deep minimum.
I'm just finishing a garage build and I spent ages planning what to build to avoid planning and building control.
Then I decided to stop compromising and just follow the rules and build it bigger. It's a small cost in the scheme of what the whole building will cost.
If you are closing one side in I'd say 7m wide minimum, 8m ideally. and 6m deep minimum.
mikemmw said:
I'd say just get the planning and building regs and make it bigger.
I'm just finishing a garage build and I spent ages planning what to build to avoid planning and building control.
Then I decided to stop compromising and just follow the rules and build it bigger. It's a small cost in the scheme of what the whole building will cost.
If you are closing one side in I'd say 7m wide minimum, 8m ideally. and 6m deep minimum.
Thank you. Left a message with the oak guy and awaiting a call back for a chat. Bigger sounding more likely!I'm just finishing a garage build and I spent ages planning what to build to avoid planning and building control.
Then I decided to stop compromising and just follow the rules and build it bigger. It's a small cost in the scheme of what the whole building will cost.
If you are closing one side in I'd say 7m wide minimum, 8m ideally. and 6m deep minimum.
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