Discussion
I am hoping that writing down my issue clarifies it to myself and leads to a solution, but I seem to have an oddness with an EvoHome install.
It is an upgrade to an existing fully working EvoHome setup, previously using HR92 rad valves and a hot water kit. All worked without any issues.
Boiler is heat only, controlled by EvoHome OpenTherm bridge.
Heating loop pump is controlled by an 'wired OR' of demand for the DHW or demand for heat from the EvoHome controller.
All standard stuff so far.
I have added a Honeywell HCC80 UFH controller.
This has an output to run the UFH pump, plus outputs to the zone vales on the UFH manifold.
Again all standard as far as I can see.
The rooms that have been converted to UFH have had the radiator removed along with the HR92 rad valves (which also sensed the room temps) and Each room now has a DT4R wireless thermostat.
Each zone on the UFH controller is bound to the EvoHome controller.
Each wireless thermostat is bound to the EvoHome controller.
So far, so good.
Issue is that even when there is no demand for heat from the EvoHome controller, the UFH controller runs the UFH pump and controlls the UFH zone valves - but of course this is pumping cold water around the UFH loop as there is no boiler demand.
I have 'cheated' and warmed the thermostats (by putting them in the airing cupboard), and as they exceed their setpoint (on the EvoHome controller) they do indeed close the zone valves and once all are at temperature, the pump stops.
So, when the thermostats are below the setpoint, the pump runs EVENTHOUGH the heating is 'off'.
The only way - as a work around - I have been able to get the pump to stop when there is no demand, is to power the UFH controller from the heat demand relay. This isn't right - the UFH controller should stay powered up all the time.
The pump should run only when a) a zone is below the setpoint AND 2) when the heating is 'on'.
Can anyone see what is going on here, or what I have missed?
It is an upgrade to an existing fully working EvoHome setup, previously using HR92 rad valves and a hot water kit. All worked without any issues.
Boiler is heat only, controlled by EvoHome OpenTherm bridge.
Heating loop pump is controlled by an 'wired OR' of demand for the DHW or demand for heat from the EvoHome controller.
All standard stuff so far.
I have added a Honeywell HCC80 UFH controller.
This has an output to run the UFH pump, plus outputs to the zone vales on the UFH manifold.
Again all standard as far as I can see.
The rooms that have been converted to UFH have had the radiator removed along with the HR92 rad valves (which also sensed the room temps) and Each room now has a DT4R wireless thermostat.
Each zone on the UFH controller is bound to the EvoHome controller.
Each wireless thermostat is bound to the EvoHome controller.
So far, so good.
Issue is that even when there is no demand for heat from the EvoHome controller, the UFH controller runs the UFH pump and controlls the UFH zone valves - but of course this is pumping cold water around the UFH loop as there is no boiler demand.
I have 'cheated' and warmed the thermostats (by putting them in the airing cupboard), and as they exceed their setpoint (on the EvoHome controller) they do indeed close the zone valves and once all are at temperature, the pump stops.
So, when the thermostats are below the setpoint, the pump runs EVENTHOUGH the heating is 'off'.
The only way - as a work around - I have been able to get the pump to stop when there is no demand, is to power the UFH controller from the heat demand relay. This isn't right - the UFH controller should stay powered up all the time.
The pump should run only when a) a zone is below the setpoint AND 2) when the heating is 'on'.
Can anyone see what is going on here, or what I have missed?
I dont know the answer. Hall er we did used to have evo home and whilst it had it positives ( the central control panel was nice ) the builder ( who had done several of them ) did find it tricky to set up and the manuals were mind boggling.
I would try their support line as nothing about its set up was simple.
I would try their support line as nothing about its set up was simple.
Simon_GH said:
If I ve understood correctly, the circulation pump is on a permanent rather than switched live circuit?
The heating loop (from the boiler, through the rads, hot water tank and to the UFH manifold) is switched by the EvoHome controller. Its on a BDR91.That correctly come on when there is a call for heat, or a call for HW - which is obviously also a call for het.
In parallel (in logic terms) the boiler is controlled by an EvoHome opentherm bridge.
So the BDR91 turns on the pump, the opentherm turns on the boiler at the same time.
The UFH pump is controlled directly from the UFH controller.
It is this pump that stays on - until the thermostats that control the UFH reach their setpoints.... But it does this regardless of if the EvoHome controller thinks the heating is on.
The UFH controller happily controls the UFH zones - but if the heating is set to off at the EvoHome controller, then it merrily pumps the cold water around for ever.
It is driving me mad.
Jeremy-75qq8 said:
I dont know the answer. Hall er we did used to have evo home and whilst it had it positives ( the central control panel was nice ) the builder ( who had done several of them ) did find it tricky to set up and the manuals were mind boggling.
I would try their support line as nothing about its set up was simple.
That is a very good idea! I am the installer and the homeowner in this case which might complicate things.I would try their support line as nothing about its set up was simple.
I think somewhere in the mists of time, I did sign up as an installer to get some technical data from them.
If no ideas come from this thread I will give that a go.
I have a very similar set up, with 3x HCC80's throughout the house controlling the 3 different UFH manifolds. (no rads though anymore, just 2 towel rails on the old radiotar circuit)
All of mine will only switch the manifold pump on when one of the zones is calling for heat. The pump does continue to run after the call for heat has ended, but only while the actuator closes.
Sounds like you either have a wire or control setting incorrect
All of mine will only switch the manifold pump on when one of the zones is calling for heat. The pump does continue to run after the call for heat has ended, but only while the actuator closes.
Sounds like you either have a wire or control setting incorrect
Are you sure you have the pump wired to the switched live and not the permanent live - pic from one of mine below, you should be using the top pin for the live to the pump 
Otherwise it sounds like you may have messed the binding up somewhere and configured the HCC as a master opoosed to the slave to the Evohome Controller. It would explain why if a room stat is below set point its still calling for heat (turning the pump on) despite the evohome controller having heating set off. Bottom image in this screenshot instead of top
I'd carefully follow all of the rebinding steps - its easy to get the room stats and/or the HCC acting as main controls instead of slaves to the evohome controller. I use T87RF's in each room and its easy to have them act as a main control instead of a simple thermostat/set point adjuster reporting into the evohome controller. - Page 24 of this manual is the one https://www.plumbworld.co.uk/documents/honeywell-h...
Otherwise it sounds like you may have messed the binding up somewhere and configured the HCC as a master opoosed to the slave to the Evohome Controller. It would explain why if a room stat is below set point its still calling for heat (turning the pump on) despite the evohome controller having heating set off. Bottom image in this screenshot instead of top
I'd carefully follow all of the rebinding steps - its easy to get the room stats and/or the HCC acting as main controls instead of slaves to the evohome controller. I use T87RF's in each room and its easy to have them act as a main control instead of a simple thermostat/set point adjuster reporting into the evohome controller. - Page 24 of this manual is the one https://www.plumbworld.co.uk/documents/honeywell-h...
Edited by a7x88 on Thursday 27th November 14:27
a7x88 said:
I have a very similar set up, with 3x HCC80's throughout the house controlling the 3 different UFH manifolds. (no rads though anymore, just 2 towel rails on the old radiotar circuit)
All of mine will only switch the manifold pump on when one of the zones is calling for heat. The pump does continue to run after the call for heat has ended, but only while the actuator closes.
Sounds like you either have a wire or control setting incorrect
Thanks for taking the time to reply. You have obviously been here before with such a setup.All of mine will only switch the manifold pump on when one of the zones is calling for heat. The pump does continue to run after the call for heat has ended, but only while the actuator closes.
Sounds like you either have a wire or control setting incorrect
Your statement above confirms it should work as I am expecting - which is a million percent useful in itself.
With ref to the first image... the pump connection, yes, I can confirm that is correct. I can also verify that by artificially raising the 'room temeratures' for the UFH zones - by moving the thermostats in to the airing cupboard. As the sensors warm, you can see the associated zone valve close and the light on the UFH controller go out. Once all lights are out, the pump then stops (there may well be a bit of run-on as you say).
The system correctly shows the temperatures for the zones on the EvoHome controller.
As mentioned though - this seems completely independent from a call for heat, the heasting can be set to 'off' on the EvoHome controller, and the UFH still seems to be in some weird autonomous mode (but still picking up the temerature readings bound to the EvoHomer controller)!
I was hoping not to have to do a complete reset and rebind everything. Maybe that is actually the next step.
I might draw myself a complete system diagram and tick off the bits that I bind as I go.
Hey... you may well have solved it!
I have rebound the zones on the UFH controller and it now seems to make sense.
I really don't remember doing the 'double bind' procedure before (which is apparently needed on some versions of the HCC80).
I also moved the 230VAC supply for the UFH controller to be powered permanently (as it should) rather than my work around where it was powered off a call for heat zone valve.
I have the heating off at the EvoHome controller, the HCC80 powered up and a zone thermostat outside in the yard (to simulate a cold room) which would in theory cause the UFH zone to be 'on'
... UFH pump has stopped.... as it should.
It sees 'room is cold' but heating is off, so doesn't run.
More tests to run once all the zones cool down.
Will update in the morning.
I have rebound the zones on the UFH controller and it now seems to make sense.
I really don't remember doing the 'double bind' procedure before (which is apparently needed on some versions of the HCC80).
I also moved the 230VAC supply for the UFH controller to be powered permanently (as it should) rather than my work around where it was powered off a call for heat zone valve.
I have the heating off at the EvoHome controller, the HCC80 powered up and a zone thermostat outside in the yard (to simulate a cold room) which would in theory cause the UFH zone to be 'on'
... UFH pump has stopped.... as it should.
It sees 'room is cold' but heating is off, so doesn't run.
More tests to run once all the zones cool down.
Will update in the morning.
Steve Campbell said:
We love the system but it is complicated. Getting new fibre to property on Monday which means I ll need to reset everything in the house with new router etc. the Honeywell rebinding malarkey is the one I m dreading most LOL.
Changing connectivity to the property shouldn't need anything rebinding on EvoHome.The only 'network setting' is the WiFi on the controller.
If you chose to use the deafult SSID given by your provider (if you use their WiFi router), then that will need changing on the EvoHome controller.
If you do it "properly" and chose your own SSID, then all home automation stuff is then wholey independant of change of provider in the future.
So, I would suggest, when you get your new connectivity - since you will have to do this anyway - chose an SSID that you will stick with eg. 'MyHouse' and the job will never need doing again.
Update as promised....
Many thanks to the guys who responded on this. Never ceases to amaze me, the depth of knowledge on PH!
It was indeed a binding problem.
Key points here are 1) Confirming that it should work as I expected - so I wasn't trying to force it to do something that it wasn't supposed to do. 2) Focusing on the binding.
I have to say I probably confused myself with the binding. The temperature sensors were bound properly. The UFH actuators appeared to be bound as they operated the right valves from the right zone on the EvoHome controller.
BUT that binding wasn't fully done.
It is quite complex to setup, but I think EvoHome is still the best out there.
I can now continue with my project... three zones up and running, the next room is in progress and that will simply get added to the manifold and then bound properly!
All of the upstairs is being converted, three done, one in progress, three zones still to do.
Thanks again to those who sorted it.
Many thanks to the guys who responded on this. Never ceases to amaze me, the depth of knowledge on PH!
It was indeed a binding problem.
Key points here are 1) Confirming that it should work as I expected - so I wasn't trying to force it to do something that it wasn't supposed to do. 2) Focusing on the binding.
I have to say I probably confused myself with the binding. The temperature sensors were bound properly. The UFH actuators appeared to be bound as they operated the right valves from the right zone on the EvoHome controller.
BUT that binding wasn't fully done.
It is quite complex to setup, but I think EvoHome is still the best out there.
I can now continue with my project... three zones up and running, the next room is in progress and that will simply get added to the manifold and then bound properly!
All of the upstairs is being converted, three done, one in progress, three zones still to do.
Thanks again to those who sorted it.
The issue with evo home is it only works for a relatively small number of zones so as you need more ( multiple towel rails , larger houses , Heatmiser neo tends to be the one to go for.
I did like the central panel of evo home as it kept things off an app which is useful if for example the place is rented.
I did like the central panel of evo home as it kept things off an app which is useful if for example the place is rented.
Gassing Station | Homes, Gardens and DIY | Top of Page | What's New | My Stuff