Front door not locking
Discussion
I had a new front door and frame fitted at the end of August. Happy with the door, it has worked fine until this weekend.
The door works as expected, the multipoint deadlocks engage and disengage, and the key operates the main deadlock freely when the door is open, but once the door is closed, and the hook/pin deadlocks are engaged (require before you can lock it), the key won't now turn in the lock.
I don't think it's an issue with the strike plate as nothing appears to have moved, and if I slide a piece of paper between the door and plate when closed the main deadlock doesn't touch the paper when I try to operate the lock. It seems like something mechanical is preventing the main deadbolt from operating when the door is closed.
Deadlock hook and pins operate when door is open or closed
Latch operates fine open or closed, and the main deadbolt operate fine when open.
...but when closed, the key won't operate the main deadbolt so it can't engage with the strike plate.
Fortunately, when on the latch you still need the key to open the door from the outside, so the door is mostly secure, and I've raised a service issue with the manufacture/installer, but they're quoting weeks for a service call.
I'm hoping I've missed something obvious. Any thoughts?
The door works as expected, the multipoint deadlocks engage and disengage, and the key operates the main deadlock freely when the door is open, but once the door is closed, and the hook/pin deadlocks are engaged (require before you can lock it), the key won't now turn in the lock.
I don't think it's an issue with the strike plate as nothing appears to have moved, and if I slide a piece of paper between the door and plate when closed the main deadlock doesn't touch the paper when I try to operate the lock. It seems like something mechanical is preventing the main deadbolt from operating when the door is closed.
Deadlock hook and pins operate when door is open or closed
Latch operates fine open or closed, and the main deadbolt operate fine when open.
...but when closed, the key won't operate the main deadbolt so it can't engage with the strike plate.
Fortunately, when on the latch you still need the key to open the door from the outside, so the door is mostly secure, and I've raised a service issue with the manufacture/installer, but they're quoting weeks for a service call.
I'm hoping I've missed something obvious. Any thoughts?
NDA said:
We had some patio doors that wouldn't lock - we got a guy in from the firm that installed them and he adjusted the hinges. Not what I was expecting. 10 minute job with an allen key.
I'm not saying that's your issue at all, but it was with ours.
When they installed it I was most impressed with the level of adjustment they had once the frame was in place, as you said, lots of very fine adjustment with just a small allen key.I'm not saying that's your issue at all, but it was with ours.
I did wonder if the temperature drop has caused it (the last few days are the first time its hit 0℃ since it was installed), but it still feels like a mechanical issue rather than fit.
Danm1les said:
Our front door had a issue with the whole multi point locking system, had to replace nearly all of it, but it was about £250 in parts and an hour of the lock smiths time. Door is as good as new again. I would not thing you need an entirely new door.
Yeah, that's my fear. At least the door is still within warranty period so it shouldn't cost me anything. Did you end up with new keys or were they able to reuse the cylinder? I've only just got spares sent out to friends for emergencies. Probably is the cold - try pulling the door towards you by the handle from outside when locking.
Some doors have adjustable locking roller pins on the door itself. Look closely at the roller pins and you may see a single line on the bolt head. Probably pointing straight up or down. Turn it so it points at the door.
They should be adjusted by season.
Some doors have adjustable locking roller pins on the door itself. Look closely at the roller pins and you may see a single line on the bolt head. Probably pointing straight up or down. Turn it so it points at the door.
They should be adjusted by season.
Does the door have shootbolts that go up and down into the frame top and bottom, check nothing is stopping them going the full distance.
But,
I'd be complaining vigorously if a door fitted in August has something wrong, weeks for help, should be days.
You should have said you can't lock the door at all which makes it insecure, even if it's a lie, they should do something sooner.
We had a problem with a door, the firm quoted weeks like yours, after much complaining the guy who did the measuring in the first place turned up, 5 minutes adjustment and he cured it.
But,
I'd be complaining vigorously if a door fitted in August has something wrong, weeks for help, should be days.
You should have said you can't lock the door at all which makes it insecure, even if it's a lie, they should do something sooner.
We had a problem with a door, the firm quoted weeks like yours, after much complaining the guy who did the measuring in the first place turned up, 5 minutes adjustment and he cured it.
First thing to check for is something fouling the door, some dirt/rubbish that is stopping it from closing fully.
If that's all okay then you can think about adjusting the striker plates. You just need to work out which one(s) aren't getting properly engaged. It's more than likely that something will have moved just enough to stop the door fully closing and therefore being able to engage. It probably wouldn't take much to work out which one and by how much it needs to be adjusted. I think ours needed a bit of adjustment after a few months + the dry spray etc.. blahblahblah but not WD40 - well not the traditional stuff etc.. and graphite in the lock etc..
If that's all okay then you can think about adjusting the striker plates. You just need to work out which one(s) aren't getting properly engaged. It's more than likely that something will have moved just enough to stop the door fully closing and therefore being able to engage. It probably wouldn't take much to work out which one and by how much it needs to be adjusted. I think ours needed a bit of adjustment after a few months + the dry spray etc.. blahblahblah but not WD40 - well not the traditional stuff etc.. and graphite in the lock etc..
GoodDoc said:
once the door is closed, and the hook/pin deadlocks are engaged (require before you can lock it), the key won't now turn in the lock.
It seems like something mechanical is preventing the main deadbolt from operating when the door is closed.
Deadlock hook and pins operate when door is open or closed
I'd suspect at least one of the hook/pin deadbolts is not enjoying the full extent of motion it usually does when the door is closed - probably friction against the keep - so stopping you from turning the key. It seems like something mechanical is preventing the main deadbolt from operating when the door is closed.
Deadlock hook and pins operate when door is open or closed
You could try applying some pressure to the door over the top/bottom deadbolt area before lifting the handle to see if that allows the lock to operate.
LordLoveLength said:
Probably is the cold - try pulling the door towards you by the handle from outside when locking.
Some doors have adjustable locking roller pins on the door itself. Look closely at the roller pins and you may see a single line on the bolt head. Probably pointing straight up or down. Turn it so it points at the door.
They should be adjusted by season.
Tried the 'gentle physical persuasion' method, but it still looks/feels like the main deadbolt isn't operating rather than its getting stuck.Some doors have adjustable locking roller pins on the door itself. Look closely at the roller pins and you may see a single line on the bolt head. Probably pointing straight up or down. Turn it so it points at the door.
They should be adjusted by season.
Forgive my ignorance, but where and what are roller pins? Quick goggle talks about sliding or garage doors.
netherfield said:
Does the door have shootbolts that go up and down into the frame top and bottom, check nothing is stopping them going the full distance.
Good question, I didn't know, but having checked, it doesn't use vertical pins.netherfield said:
I'd be complaining vigorously if a door fitted in August has something wrong, weeks for help, should be days.
You should have said you can't lock the door at all which makes it insecure, even if it's a lie, they should do something sooner.
I've raised a ticket with them (first time I've had to do that with a 'building' company), and did state that I can't lock the door, which is absolutely true. I did leave out that the latch does partially secure the door. They have responded, only with a automated acknowledgement mail, but it does state they triage calls so I'm hoping "front door doesn't lock" gets me a faster response. I'll give them today, then its a call tomorrow morning. You should have said you can't lock the door at all which makes it insecure, even if it's a lie, they should do something sooner.
Are you sure the Handle is fully up when you’re trying to lock? If not something has moved.
Lock the door when it is open so the deadbolt is out. Close it against the frame and mark the frame with a pencil where the dead bolt touches. Then check if the marks line up with where the strike plate is.
Lock the door when it is open so the deadbolt is out. Close it against the frame and mark the frame with a pencil where the dead bolt touches. Then check if the marks line up with where the strike plate is.
Our OAK front door has a multiploint locking and the bottom one wasn't engaging fully - it looks like it is but its not gone fully home. The receiving hole (for want of a better description) was set so when the bolt is in place it physically pulls the door onto the rubber sealing strips more tightly. Great idea until its too stiff. I'd watched them adjust it and they talked me through why, and a 1/8 turn with a hex bit on the receiving hole in our case was enough. I guess it was a cam type arrangement that pushed a metal plate over withint he hole.
Hard to explain and you may have a different setup, but if the door locks when its open, then its going to be something like this.
Hard to explain and you may have a different setup, but if the door locks when its open, then its going to be something like this.
Edited by Gone fishing on Monday 5th January 16:44
simion_levi said:
I'd suspect at least one of the hook/pin deadbolts is not enjoying the full extent of motion it usually does when the door is closed - probably friction against the keep - so stopping you from turning the key.
You could try applying some pressure to the door over the top/bottom deadbolt area before lifting the handle to see if that allows the lock to operate.
Ding Ding Ding. Winner!!!You could try applying some pressure to the door over the top/bottom deadbolt area before lifting the handle to see if that allows the lock to operate.
Did exactly what you suggested, applied pressure over the top hook and pin deadbolts, then when lifting the handle I felt them engage slightly further, at which point the key easily turned in the lock.
That works fine when inside, but I have no leverage when trying to lock from the outside, and given the age of the door I think I'll leave it to the installers rather than start playing with it.
Cheers simion_levi, J6542, eps, LordLoveLength, and Gone fishing,
You were all on the right track. Seems pretty obvious now I know what the issue is.
This is the 'receiver' that is causing the issue. I assume the pozi screws are holding the receiver into the frame, does that mean the hex heads are for adjustment?
You were all on the right track. Seems pretty obvious now I know what the issue is.
This is the 'receiver' that is causing the issue. I assume the pozi screws are holding the receiver into the frame, does that mean the hex heads are for adjustment?
Edited by GoodDoc on Monday 5th January 15:21
netherfield said:
Yes just mark where you started from, so you can always go back again.
I found by adjusting one slightly it pulled the door tighter to the frame where a little draught was coming through.
I found by adjusting one slightly it pulled the door tighter to the frame where a little draught was coming through.
LordLoveLength said:
Those hex heads are indeed the adjustment and handily marked, spin them 1/4 turn and try again. If no good try the other direction.
One 4mm allen key, and a surprisingly small adjustment, and normal service has been resumed.Cheers all! Didn't expect this thread to deliver such a fast fix, I really thought there was an issue with the door's internal mechanism, but in my defence it's a 150 year properly and until recently it had an old fashioned wooden door and frame (which was rotten, which is what caused its replacement) so I had no idea how much adjustment modern doors have, and need. I'm guessing the recent cold snap caused something to move out of place.
I suspect that's one service call saved, but I'm curious how long it takes them to contact me.
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