EV Charger Installation
Discussion
My house is pretty simple electrically so far as I know.
The box below is in the garage and everything goes in and out of that.
The drive is about 2M to the right of the box through either a brick wall or a hole drilled through a door frame.
I was going to get a local electrician out to have a look and give me some options on either getting a wall mounted EV charger installed outside or on getting an EV rated socked installed.
I believe to comply with regs any of those options are likely to require some additional "boxes" but at this point I'm not an electrician.
Is anyone able to tell me anything that I need to consider/keep in mind from the photo below please?
I'm one of those people where I can feel a bit pressured when you've got someone stood in the garage suggesting you must do X, Y and Z so any homework I can do in advance is useful.
The box below is in the garage and everything goes in and out of that.
The drive is about 2M to the right of the box through either a brick wall or a hole drilled through a door frame.
I was going to get a local electrician out to have a look and give me some options on either getting a wall mounted EV charger installed outside or on getting an EV rated socked installed.
I believe to comply with regs any of those options are likely to require some additional "boxes" but at this point I'm not an electrician.
Is anyone able to tell me anything that I need to consider/keep in mind from the photo below please?
I'm one of those people where I can feel a bit pressured when you've got someone stood in the garage suggesting you must do X, Y and Z so any homework I can do in advance is useful.
butchstewie said:
My house is pretty simple electrically so far as I know.
The box below is in the garage and everything goes in and out of that.
The drive is about 2M to the right of the box through either a brick wall or a hole drilled through a door frame.
I was going to get a local electrician out to have a look and give me some options on either getting a wall mounted EV charger installed outside or on getting an EV rated socked installed.
I believe to comply with regs any of those options are likely to require some additional "boxes" but at this point I'm not an electrician.
Is anyone able to tell me anything that I need to consider/keep in mind from the photo below please?
I'm one of those people where I can feel a bit pressured when you've got someone stood in the garage suggesting you must do X, Y and Z so any homework I can do in advance is useful.
That's a plastic board so it essentially means you shouldn't really be adding new circuits into it as it's not up to current regs. It also doesn't have a surge protector on it.The box below is in the garage and everything goes in and out of that.
The drive is about 2M to the right of the box through either a brick wall or a hole drilled through a door frame.
I was going to get a local electrician out to have a look and give me some options on either getting a wall mounted EV charger installed outside or on getting an EV rated socked installed.
I believe to comply with regs any of those options are likely to require some additional "boxes" but at this point I'm not an electrician.
Is anyone able to tell me anything that I need to consider/keep in mind from the photo below please?
I'm one of those people where I can feel a bit pressured when you've got someone stood in the garage suggesting you must do X, Y and Z so any homework I can do in advance is useful.
They'll try and flog you a board change.
Simplest solution is a sub-board underneath it just for the EV charger. This will be up to current regs as will include an SPD as well. This could then feed your outside EV charger.
DorsetSparky said:
That's a plastic board so it essentially means you shouldn't really be adding new circuits into it as it's not up to current regs. It also doesn't have a surge protector on it.
They'll try and flog you a board change.
Simplest solution is a sub-board underneath it just for the EV charger. This will be up to current regs as will include an SPD as well. This could then feed your outside EV charger.
Thank you They'll try and flog you a board change.
Simplest solution is a sub-board underneath it just for the EV charger. This will be up to current regs as will include an SPD as well. This could then feed your outside EV charger.
Is a "board change" something where it's even vaguely possible to have a stab at a ballpark from a photo?
And if I wanted a "simple" 13A EV rated "good quality socket" for occasional use of a 3 pin plug-in "granny charger" at 8A or 10A would the same concerns apply?
This sort of thing not some dodgy Amazon tat.
https://shop.tesla.com/en_gb/product/mobile-connec...
There's clearly a substantial cost to a full EV charger install even without any remediation work so I'm trying to avoid messing any local trades around until I've an idea what direction I think I want to go as any cost needs balancing against just using public charging given my reasonably low mileage.
What rating is the main fuse? I have a vague memory they wanted to check that before installing a charger.
I would get a smart meter installed if you do get a charger and it's worth it even if you don't. I don't charge often at home but just shifting my dishwasher and washing machine to the cheap period I'm at 15 p/kWh.
I would get a smart meter installed if you do get a charger and it's worth it even if you don't. I don't charge often at home but just shifting my dishwasher and washing machine to the cheap period I'm at 15 p/kWh.
Fuse is 100A.
I asked on an electrician forum on Reddit and got answers that range from it's fine (as in not current best practise but given the age of the house it makes sense) and an EV install would just fit a new consumer unit for the charger through to, to paraphrase, "get the DNO out you need a new meter and a new metal consumer unit and all of it replacing".
And people wonder why normal folks struggle with this stuff
I asked on an electrician forum on Reddit and got answers that range from it's fine (as in not current best practise but given the age of the house it makes sense) and an EV install would just fit a new consumer unit for the charger through to, to paraphrase, "get the DNO out you need a new meter and a new metal consumer unit and all of it replacing".
And people wonder why normal folks struggle with this stuff
butchstewie said:
Fuse is 100A.
I asked on an electrician forum on Reddit and got answers that range from it's fine (as in not current best practise but given the age of the house it makes sense) and an EV install would just fit a new consumer unit for the charger through to, to paraphrase, "get the DNO out you need a new meter and a new metal consumer unit and all of it replacing".
And people wonder why normal folks struggle with this stuff
The convenience of a home charger is something to bear in mind.I asked on an electrician forum on Reddit and got answers that range from it's fine (as in not current best practise but given the age of the house it makes sense) and an EV install would just fit a new consumer unit for the charger through to, to paraphrase, "get the DNO out you need a new meter and a new metal consumer unit and all of it replacing".
And people wonder why normal folks struggle with this stuff
Stopping for 20 minutes occasionally on a long trip when you need a pee anyway is one thing. Having to do it every a week because it'll save you £100 over 3 years vs installing a home charger is something else.
I got one installed even though I can charge for free at work. A lot more people in the office have got electric cars since I got mine but my company has also installed more chargers. The most I've ever put in at home is 15kWh.
Won t comment on the electrics because it s not what I know. But . We ve just had an ohme home pro charger fitted, which included a board change and moving all the circuits to PCBO s. There were 6 circuits on the board (garage only, house on a separate board).
£1500 all in. Leicestershire. That including having this fitted as an extra board. No idea what for.
£1500 all in. Leicestershire. That including having this fitted as an extra board. No idea what for.
Edited by eltax91 on Sunday 24th May 08:21
butchstewie said:
Fuse is 100A.
I asked on an electrician forum on Reddit and got answers that range from it's fine (as in not current best practise but given the age of the house it makes sense) and an EV install would just fit a new consumer unit for the charger through to, to paraphrase, "get the DNO out you need a new meter and a new metal consumer unit and all of it replacing".
And people wonder why normal folks struggle with this stuff
To be fair, those suggesting a new meter do have a point, especially if you are getting an EV charger installed and want access to smart meter tariffs.I asked on an electrician forum on Reddit and got answers that range from it's fine (as in not current best practise but given the age of the house it makes sense) and an EV install would just fit a new consumer unit for the charger through to, to paraphrase, "get the DNO out you need a new meter and a new metal consumer unit and all of it replacing".
And people wonder why normal folks struggle with this stuff
The issue you're going to have is one around space as the would also be an isolation switch added. We have ended up with two electrical boxes being needed to accommodate all of the kit where the supply enters the property because we also have a distribution board near the incomer.
LooneyTunes said:
To be fair, those suggesting a new meter do have a point, especially if you are getting an EV charger installed and want access to smart meter tariffs.
The issue you're going to have is one around space as the would also be an isolation switch added. We have ended up with two electrical boxes being needed to accommodate all of the kit where the supply enters the property because we also have a distribution board near the incomer.
Yeah totally get it from the smart meter POV.The issue you're going to have is one around space as the would also be an isolation switch added. We have ended up with two electrical boxes being needed to accommodate all of the kit where the supply enters the property because we also have a distribution board near the incomer.
Thing is even @ 24p kWh and a car that does 60mpg any home charging is half the price.
It's less the cost of the charger it's the absolutely ball ache and hassle of the install and any remedial work needed and when you start asking and people go new meter, new consumer unit, replace the lot etc. suddenly a "simple" thing starts getting silly v "go down the road and plug it in there".
On the garage layout that's a recessed box in the garage internal wall. There's empty plasterboard wall all around it where I assume any new internal boxes could be fitted if needed and if the recess isn't sufficient.
I am minded to get a local trusted electrician to come take a look and see what they think is possible.
butchstewie said:
Fuse is 100A.
I asked on an electrician forum on Reddit and got answers that range from it's fine (as in not current best practise but given the age of the house it makes sense) and an EV install would just fit a new consumer unit for the charger through to, to paraphrase, "get the DNO out you need a new meter and a new metal consumer unit and all of it replacing".
And people wonder why normal folks struggle with this stuff
To help you make the most of EV and smart energy tariffs, you need the meter changing to a smart meter before you do anything. This will enable you to take advantage of EV/smart tariffs. The DNO will do this FoC.I asked on an electrician forum on Reddit and got answers that range from it's fine (as in not current best practise but given the age of the house it makes sense) and an EV install would just fit a new consumer unit for the charger through to, to paraphrase, "get the DNO out you need a new meter and a new metal consumer unit and all of it replacing".
And people wonder why normal folks struggle with this stuff
Thereafter, the install of a proper home charger will include the addition of a separate consumer unit with appropriately rated fuse and type for your installation. Any electrician worth their salt should be capable of this and also have the correct testing equipment to ensure it is signed off correctly.
If you want a fixed fee install without the hassle of ringing round local electricians etc then the energy providers do this and are generally competitive. Budget £1 - 1.5k for an install. If you are near Doncaster, I used a regional company called Snug Energy who were very good.
I can only speak from my experience as a customer, old house, a board that looks like yours. The guy installed another fusebox that controls power to the unit. The cost was about £500 to install, taking about 90 minutes.
You could just have a standard 3 pin plug installed on the wall outside (with weather protection obvs). My neighbour has an EV and a hybrid, and has a proper EV charger for the EV and an external mounted 3 pin plug with a holder/cover for the control unit. It all looks really neat - in fact, I didn't realise it was just a 3 pin charger and assumed he'd had a second charger installed (I didn't look at the wall because I was more interested in his new hybrid car!).
You could just have a standard 3 pin plug installed on the wall outside (with weather protection obvs). My neighbour has an EV and a hybrid, and has a proper EV charger for the EV and an external mounted 3 pin plug with a holder/cover for the control unit. It all looks really neat - in fact, I didn't realise it was just a 3 pin charger and assumed he'd had a second charger installed (I didn't look at the wall because I was more interested in his new hybrid car!).
There are 3 double pole switches in that consumer unit, an incomer and two RCBO, so that could be changed to free up slots?
Plus one is spare already?
You could use a granny lead instead, it's not a binary choice of smart charger vs public charging.
Some electricity retailers will give you a firm price online.
They may change the meter at the same time, and hence fit it all in the existing box.
If you're considering paying out £1k for a charger, then maybe it would be worth asking yourself whether home battery or solar are possibly worth considering in the next few years?
Plus one is spare already?
You could use a granny lead instead, it's not a binary choice of smart charger vs public charging.
Some electricity retailers will give you a firm price online.
They may change the meter at the same time, and hence fit it all in the existing box.
If you're considering paying out £1k for a charger, then maybe it would be worth asking yourself whether home battery or solar are possibly worth considering in the next few years?
I had a box similar(ish) to that shown in eltax91 post above installed next to the outdoor meter cabinet and then a run to the charger itself.
The alternative was that I had to have a complete change of consumer unit box, generally similar to that shown in stewie's photo as didn't have a spare place for the charger feed, and it would have made the supply run to charger more complicated.
DNO insisted on an inspection, found out that though the company fuse said it was 100A, just like OP's photo, the fuse that was actually installed was a 60A, DNO changed it. The label refers not to the fuse installed but the capacity of the fuse holder apparently.
As OP said householders have complicated stuff to navigate.
I wondered about lack of smart meter too, we were already on a smart meter as our old one had a fault and had been replaced. Just to say after installation the kitchen plug in meter display thingy stopped working. No hardship, can now see info on a phone app.
The alternative was that I had to have a complete change of consumer unit box, generally similar to that shown in stewie's photo as didn't have a spare place for the charger feed, and it would have made the supply run to charger more complicated.
DNO insisted on an inspection, found out that though the company fuse said it was 100A, just like OP's photo, the fuse that was actually installed was a 60A, DNO changed it. The label refers not to the fuse installed but the capacity of the fuse holder apparently.
As OP said householders have complicated stuff to navigate.
I wondered about lack of smart meter too, we were already on a smart meter as our old one had a fault and had been replaced. Just to say after installation the kitchen plug in meter display thingy stopped working. No hardship, can now see info on a phone app.
butchstewie said:
Yeah totally get it from the smart meter POV.
Thing is even @ 24p kWh and a car that does 60mpg any home charging is half the price.
It's less the cost of the charger it's the absolutely ball ache and hassle of the install and any remedial work needed and when you start asking and people go new meter, new consumer unit, replace the lot etc. suddenly a "simple" thing starts getting silly v "go down the road and plug it in there".
On the garage layout that's a recessed box in the garage internal wall. There's empty plasterboard wall all around it where I assume any new internal boxes could be fitted if needed and if the recess isn't sufficient.
I am minded to get a local trusted electrician to come take a look and see what they think is possible.
I'm in a similar position re financials. Bear in mind I have an older hybrid without the ability to restrict the charge to eg 80% so I only charge it for 2 hours at a time during the day, meaning I don't think the hassle of getting a smart meter installed so that I'm still not charging overnight to take advantage of the 8p tariff makes it worth the effort. That sentence felt like it's full of double negatives. Basically, I don't charge my car overnight so I would still be charged 28p per kWh. It's not worth the hassle of getting a smart meter installed!Thing is even @ 24p kWh and a car that does 60mpg any home charging is half the price.
It's less the cost of the charger it's the absolutely ball ache and hassle of the install and any remedial work needed and when you start asking and people go new meter, new consumer unit, replace the lot etc. suddenly a "simple" thing starts getting silly v "go down the road and plug it in there".
On the garage layout that's a recessed box in the garage internal wall. There's empty plasterboard wall all around it where I assume any new internal boxes could be fitted if needed and if the recess isn't sufficient.
I am minded to get a local trusted electrician to come take a look and see what they think is possible.
Edited by Hoofy on Sunday 24th May 10:44
The box is rather tight but you don't HAVE to replace the existing CU - it's not up to the latest regs but it's not required to upgrade the CU to meet them. There are a couple of ways you can go: the likely cheaper route is to split the feed out of the meter & install a new all CU just for the EV charger - like the picture above.
The other route is to replace the exsiting CU with a new one & replace the two RCBOs & MCBs with individual combined MCB/RCBOs which will gain you a few module spaces so you could get the EV breaker in as well. This will be expensive because MCB/RCBOs are more expensive & they will want to put surge arrestors in as well so the box will still end up pretty full. The sparky will also have to do a full EICR on the rest of the house wiring if he changes the CU so that can potentially throw up issues which he would have to correct - & charge for.
It looks like the house has had a refitted kitchen & they used up all the spares running radials to the hob, ovens & tumble drier. It might have been more useful to do some diversity calculations, but you are where you are.
If the EV charger is going 2m away through one wall that's probably the simplest part of the job.
The other route is to replace the exsiting CU with a new one & replace the two RCBOs & MCBs with individual combined MCB/RCBOs which will gain you a few module spaces so you could get the EV breaker in as well. This will be expensive because MCB/RCBOs are more expensive & they will want to put surge arrestors in as well so the box will still end up pretty full. The sparky will also have to do a full EICR on the rest of the house wiring if he changes the CU so that can potentially throw up issues which he would have to correct - & charge for.
It looks like the house has had a refitted kitchen & they used up all the spares running radials to the hob, ovens & tumble drier. It might have been more useful to do some diversity calculations, but you are where you are.
If the EV charger is going 2m away through one wall that's probably the simplest part of the job.
Quite interesting what people can tell from a solitary photo.
I also uploaded it to Claude and I'm equally stunned what AI can tell from analysing a photo - it knows more about the history of the house electrics than I do
So it would seem from my understanding that there may actually be MORE work needed to get a "simple" EV rated 3-pin socket installed outside as all the stuff needed for that and possible some more (something called PEN detection keeps coming up) that apparently hard wired chargers have built in but it's still needed if you contact an electrician who is being asked to fit an outdoor 13A rated EV charging socket and sticks to the regs.
I also uploaded it to Claude and I'm equally stunned what AI can tell from analysing a photo - it knows more about the history of the house electrics than I do
So it would seem from my understanding that there may actually be MORE work needed to get a "simple" EV rated 3-pin socket installed outside as all the stuff needed for that and possible some more (something called PEN detection keeps coming up) that apparently hard wired chargers have built in but it's still needed if you contact an electrician who is being asked to fit an outdoor 13A rated EV charging socket and sticks to the regs.
Just going through exactly the same as the OP, new charger being fitted tomorrow/Tuesday running from a new separate EV fuse board that he's also putting in.
He's previously come and checked everything and whilst not upto current regs it's all upto the regs of the time it was installed so no need to condemn it.
One thing I didn't know is that before you have a charger installed you must apply for permission from The National Grid;
Https:/connections.nationalgrid.co.uk/lct-ev-charg...
He's previously come and checked everything and whilst not upto current regs it's all upto the regs of the time it was installed so no need to condemn it.
One thing I didn't know is that before you have a charger installed you must apply for permission from The National Grid;
Https:/connections.nationalgrid.co.uk/lct-ev-charg...
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