Retiring to Italy - things to consider

[ozzuk]

Currently approaching 51, work in IT. Plan to retire 60, main reason not sooner being pension and mortgage. Plan was to move somewhere like West Wales (currently near Swansea), but recent meal in an Italian created light bulb moment - why not retire to Italy (visited, loved it). Partner (not married) is physco-therapist, slightly younger but poor pension so would likely continue working remotely.

Lower cost of living means could retire at 57, start selling stuff at 56 so not far off. Idea would be find something nearish coast, 250-300k budget gets a nice 4 bed villa with pool, vastly different from UK options. Live off a SIP 57-60, and partners income.

Any major red flags or things to consider? Partner is getting her Irish passport so she would be able to work, I wouldn't. Anyone live in Italy and can share thoughts? I toured there years ago, Cinque Terre, Venice, Florence, Rome etc.

We like idea of pool, seaside near, somewhere slightly inland (mountains / trees) so likely more Northern. I'm not someone who lives to work, I can amuse myself quite happily without working.

[the cueball]

Can you speak fluent Italian?

Apart from that, after Brexit, I think it goes something like:

Elective Visa - you can't work on this, get in the UK, need to show passive income etc

Get into Italy and apply for "Permesso di Soggiorno" - residence visa.. within a week or so.

Register at local town hall

Register for health care, Bank account, Codice Fiscale (tax code)

Buy a Fiat 500 or Panda 4x4 (optional)

Enjoy.

[geeks]

the cueball said:

Can you speak fluent Italian?

[elise2000]

Consider the awful weather and terrible life style in Italy compared to Swansea…

You should be able to work if you get residence, and you should be able to get that being married to an Irish citizen I think. This is certainly the case in Croatia, and I believe it’s similar throughout Europe, but do check!

[ozzuk]

elise2000 said:

Consider the awful weather and terrible life style in Italy compared to Swansea

You should be able to work if you get residence, and you should be able to get that being married to an Irish citizen I think. This is certainly the case in Croatia, and I believe it s similar throughout Europe, but do check!

My closest friend is Italian, I can never understand why he lives here and not there! He's registered blind/deaf and say benefits is better here.

Fiat 500 is top on my list as well

I don't speak the language but have a few years to improve if this does look like a good option. Attraction is better property, better weather, lower cost of living. I don't like Spain which seems to be the more cliched/common option.

[RedWhiteMonkey]

Marrying an Irish cititzen will mean bugger all in terms of getting Italian citizenship. Are you willing to bin the current missus off for an Italian replacement?

[Skodillac]

RedWhiteMonkey said:

Marrying an Irish cititzen will mean bugger all in terms of getting Italian citizenship. Are you willing to bin the current missus off for an Italian replacement?

The spouse of an EU passport holder can live with them anywhere in the EU, so long as that EU passport holder is alive. You just have to register. If they predecease you though, then it's cheerio, back to Swansea you go, Bach.

[elise2000]

ozzuk said:

elise2000 said:

Consider the awful weather and terrible life style in Italy compared to Swansea

You should be able to work if you get residence, and you should be able to get that being married to an Irish citizen I think. This is certainly the case in Croatia, and I believe it s similar throughout Europe, but do check!

My closest friend is Italian, I can never understand why he lives here and not there! He's registered blind/deaf and say benefits is better here.

Fiat 500 is top on my list as well

I don't speak the language but have a few years to improve if this does look like a good option. Attraction is better property, better weather, lower cost of living. I don't like Spain which seems to be the more cliched/common option.

The cost of living is variable compared to the UK in Croatia, and also in Italy I believe. Some things (eating, drinking out, local taxes, car tax insurance and mot) are cheaper. Other things are similar (supermarkets mainly). Some things are more expensive (electric). I think Italy is similar, although fuel more pricey.

If you like Italy, but aren’t tied to it, check out Slovenia/croatia/montenegro as well. Generally cheaper property and quieter (yes, massive generalizations I know!)

[elise2000]

RedWhiteMonkey said:

Marrying an Irish cititzen will mean bugger all in terms of getting Italian citizenship. Are you willing to bin the current missus off for an Italian replacement?

It means he can live there with her as she’s European.

In some countries there is a big difference between residence permit and citizenship.

[Mrr T]

Skodillac said:

The spouse of an EU passport holder can live with them anywhere in the EU, so long as that EU passport holder is alive. You just have to register. If they predecease you though, then it's cheerio, back to Swansea you go, Bach.

Partly right partly wrong.

You have the right to live and work in any EU country with your partner. Your partner needs to apply for residency this is normal, you can then do the same. Since your not married you need to prove your in a stable relationship. No idea what that will require.

Once you have had residency for a year, I think, if your partner dies or you separate you do not lose the residency.

[raceboy]

This is the current dream, realistically I think it'll be 10 years before it happens for us due to external issues, that'll make us early 60's.
No plan on working, MrsRace is currently learning Italian and I really should make a start.
Elective Residence Visa requires an income of €31,000 each or €38,000 per couple at the moment, I expect this to rise, but seems achievable.
Not yet been to anywhere in Italy we haven't liked yet, due to visit Naples again in May, which may be a little hectic for retirement but I wouldn't rule anywhere out.
I'm torn between buying somewhere nice, or renting something small, maybe moving about a bit, with only what'll fit in the back of the ubiquitous Fiat 500

[ozzuk]

I do love Croatia but more aligned to Italy at the moment. No plans to marry my partner, but I believe I would qualify for the ERV as no plans to work and can hopefully support myself (pension/savings). Certainly need to look into that part more. Wouldn't rule out marriage but neither of us bothered.

Buying outright will help costs, though I'm not sure yet what running costs are like - equivalent of council tax etc. I do know we both need private health at 2000eur each /year. I do know wine is cheaper

[Skodillac]

Mrr T said:

Skodillac said:

The spouse of an EU passport holder can live with them anywhere in the EU, so long as that EU passport holder is alive. You just have to register. If they predecease you though, then it's cheerio, back to Swansea you go, Bach.

Partly right partly wrong.

You have the right to live and work in any EU country with your partner. Your partner needs to apply for residency this is normal, you can then do the same. Since your not married you need to prove your in a stable relationship. No idea what that will require.

Once you have had residency for a year, I think, if your partner dies or you separate you do not lose the residency.

Yes I missed the OP's "not married" stipulation. That makes it more tricky, but not insurmountable. Perhaps OP might like to consider going down on one knee...

[cts1975]

My step son is half Italian. His family live in southern Italy. The cost of electricity and gas is eye watering.

[Skodillac]

cts1975 said:

My step son is half Italian. His family live in southern Italy. The cost of electricity and gas is eye watering.

Surely a perfect region for solar panels and a heat pump.

[Furbo]

ozzuk said:

Currently approaching 51, work in IT. Plan to retire 60, main reason not sooner being pension and mortgage. Plan was to move somewhere like West Wales (currently near Swansea), but recent meal in an Italian created light bulb moment - why not retire to Italy (visited, loved it). Partner (not married) is physco-therapist, slightly younger but poor pension so would likely continue working remotely.

Lower cost of living means could retire at 57, start selling stuff at 56 so not far off. Idea would be find something nearish coast, 250-300k budget gets a nice 4 bed villa with pool, vastly different from UK options. Live off a SIP 57-60, and partners income.

Any major red flags or things to consider? Partner is getting her Irish passport so she would be able to work, I wouldn't. Anyone live in Italy and can share thoughts? I toured there years ago, Cinque Terre, Venice, Florence, Rome etc.

We like idea of pool, seaside near, somewhere slightly inland (mountains / trees) so likely more Northern. I'm not someone who lives to work, I can amuse myself quite happily without working.

You've looked into the tax incentives for retirees?

It's a while since I checked, but it was 7% of global income pa as tax. You'd need to live in a conurbation of fewer than 20,000 people and it was limited to south of Naples or the islands.

I spend a lot of time over there and speak to friends there every week. My appetite for being subject to their laws and taxes has diminished somewhat. I am currently looking more at deriving income here and spending it there.

Also, as with all these things, the devil in the detail and the 7% tax thing has exceptions. As one of my Italian friends said, "if the government wants you to do it, it probably won't be very good for you.".

[Rob 131 Sport]

Having lived abroad (UAE and Portugal) make sure that you rent somewhere for a minimum of 12 months before purchasing. The reality of living abroad might be a little different to the dream.

[Furbo]

Rob 131 Sport said:

Having lived abroad (UAE and Portugal) make sure that you rent somewhere for a minimum of 12 months before purchasing. The reality of living abroad might be a little different to the dream.

How was it different for you?

[Rob 131 Sport]

Furbo said:

Rob 131 Sport said:

Having lived abroad (UAE and Portugal) make sure that you rent somewhere for a minimum of 12 months before purchasing. The reality of living abroad might be a little different to the dream.

How was it different for you?

For me it was absolutely fine, as I had no intention of being there for a long time. The longest period was the second UAE residence that was 4 years.

However, I know of a lot of people (mainly in Portugal) that had bought property, felt trapped and wanted to return to the UK.

[Furbo]

Rob 131 Sport said:

Furbo said:

Rob 131 Sport said:

Having lived abroad (UAE and Portugal) make sure that you rent somewhere for a minimum of 12 months before purchasing. The reality of living abroad might be a little different to the dream.

How was it different for you?

For me it was absolutely fine, as I had no intention of being there for a long time. The longest period was the second UAE residence that was 4 years.

However, I know of a lot of people (mainly in Portugal) that had bought property, felt trapped and wanted to return to the UK.

I get that.

I look at my Italian friends who live a very basic life compared to us in the UK and think that I would not want to live that way. Hence my previous comments about deriving income here and spending it there.