4th July - what if America hadn't become independant?
Discussion
Today is Independence Day in the US, commemorating declaration of independence from the UK back in 1776.
As this seriously predates the invention of the car, and as both the US and the UK have generated a lot of inovative but often very different motoring related things: how different do we think the motoring world would be if the UK had somehow kept hold of the states?
Would muscle cars have never happened? Would the USA now be RHD? Would apathy in the US have killed off the British car industry even earlier? Would Ford ever have got the production line invented to create cheap cars? Would the UK be able to turn left on red? Would pedants have anything useful to post instead on "UK car industry" threads other than having to point out all the time the Ford and Vauxhall are from the US? Would the boot/trunk, bonnet/hood, wing/fender and all the other weird motoring differences still exist?
Even more importantly would our cars be better? Would we have ultra cheap V8 RWD Focuses as our typical family cars? Would the US be filled with 1.4 litre Rovers?
Ignore the wider issues (slavery, wars, TV) and just think about how this would have changed motoring in the UK and the US. What do we all think?
As this seriously predates the invention of the car, and as both the US and the UK have generated a lot of inovative but often very different motoring related things: how different do we think the motoring world would be if the UK had somehow kept hold of the states?
Would muscle cars have never happened? Would the USA now be RHD? Would apathy in the US have killed off the British car industry even earlier? Would Ford ever have got the production line invented to create cheap cars? Would the UK be able to turn left on red? Would pedants have anything useful to post instead on "UK car industry" threads other than having to point out all the time the Ford and Vauxhall are from the US? Would the boot/trunk, bonnet/hood, wing/fender and all the other weird motoring differences still exist?
Even more importantly would our cars be better? Would we have ultra cheap V8 RWD Focuses as our typical family cars? Would the US be filled with 1.4 litre Rovers?
Ignore the wider issues (slavery, wars, TV) and just think about how this would have changed motoring in the UK and the US. What do we all think?
Britain would be a damn sight poorer, by them gaining independence we gained a lot of their cash by selling them stuff they used to get for free.
Frankly it's the best thing we ever did as it freed us up to expand our empire with the money from the US and the lack of requirement of troops.
Frankly it's the best thing we ever did as it freed us up to expand our empire with the money from the US and the lack of requirement of troops.
Silent1 said:
Britain would be a damn sight poorer, by them gaining independence we gained a lot of their cash by selling them stuff they used to get for free.
Frankly it's the best thing we ever did as it freed us up to expand our empire with the money from the US and the lack of requirement of troops.
How is the Empire doing these days?Frankly it's the best thing we ever did as it freed us up to expand our empire with the money from the US and the lack of requirement of troops.
Bigger or smaller than the USA?
The Canadians didn’t go independent and they seem to have similar car preferences to the US. Mind you if the US hadn’t gone independent they would probably still just be the original 13 states where the terrain and population density is not that much different from Europe so they’d probably still want cars that go round corners.
Another interesting speculation is what if the Harley and the Davidson families had stayed in Scotland.
Another interesting speculation is what if the Harley and the Davidson families had stayed in Scotland.
Caulkhead said:
nascar tracks would have corners.
As for the OP, the ratio of small economical diesels vs big petrol V8s would be similar in both countries as Muscle cars/Trucks/SUVs would never enjoy the same popularity in the US if they had UK levels of fuel taxation.
Mass auto production would not have established itself on this island. Makes better sense to build the factories where there is an abundance of land.
UK roads would be much less congested. If people can move freely between the countries, they would tend to move to where there is more space available.
Steamer said:
Possibly all VW, Audi, BMW and Merc...
...Would we still have won the WW2?
Without independence, its likely that the USA would have remained split in three, with the UK having the east, the French having the middle, and the Spanish/Mexico having the west, broadly speaking. ...Would we still have won the WW2?
The upshot of which is that the Napoleonic War would probably have been fought in America rather than Europe.
America didn't become independent. 13 former British states on the east coast became independent.
If Britain had retained some or all of those 13 states, you would probably now have more than two independent contries in North America - not just the US and Canada - and some of them would probably be native Spanish or French speaking.
If Britain had retained some or all of those 13 states, you would probably now have more than two independent contries in North America - not just the US and Canada - and some of them would probably be native Spanish or French speaking.
Eric Mc said:
America didn't become independent. 13 former British states on the east coast became independent.
If Britain had retained some or all of those 13 states, you would probably now have more than two independent contries in North America - not just the US and Canada - and some of them would probably be native Spanish or French speaking.
I was very careful in the wording of the OP.If Britain had retained some or all of those 13 states, you would probably now have more than two independent contries in North America - not just the US and Canada - and some of them would probably be native Spanish or French speaking.
Captain Muppet said:
Silent1 said:
Britain would be a damn sight poorer, by them gaining independence we gained a lot of their cash by selling them stuff they used to get for free.
Frankly it's the best thing we ever did as it freed us up to expand our empire with the money from the US and the lack of requirement of troops.
How is the Empire doing these days?Frankly it's the best thing we ever did as it freed us up to expand our empire with the money from the US and the lack of requirement of troops.
Bigger or smaller than the USA?
redtwin said:
Caulkhead said:
It's not a corner if five V8 lorries can get round side by side. . . . . . .
Only 2 abreast here...
But you are probably going to come back with something along the lines of.."it's not a race if there are only 13 trucks on the track".
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