Have you ever been involved with a narcissist?
Discussion
I often listen to talky stuff on YouTube while I'm drawing, and recently I've been listening to a lot of stuff about psychology.As you know, YT will suggest other related stuff and that's led me to some talks on narcissism. I was involved with a woman before I met my wife, and as I'm hearing the narcissism trait being described I'm thinking OMG, that's what was going on.
I knew at the time she was a bit 'unstable' but now I realise exactly what was going on, and she was exhibiting classic narc. tendencies- tantrums, not seeing my point of view while expecting me to see hers, and getting really cross when I failed to do something when she thought it should have been obvious what was expected of me.
One time I was really struggling at work and desperately needed to catch up (I was self employed) and I declined her invitation to watch some fireworks with her kids (she was divorced and now I know why). It ended with her slamming the phone down on me and like a classic narc's victim I drove over and went to the show. I don't think I was quite as gullible as to believe it was my fault, but looking back I can't imagine why I let her get away with it.
It all came to an end not long afterwards, fortunately, and amazingly I was quite upset about that. It wasn't until I met my wife that I got over it and realised how lucky I was.
Anybody else suffered at the hands of one of these people?
I knew at the time she was a bit 'unstable' but now I realise exactly what was going on, and she was exhibiting classic narc. tendencies- tantrums, not seeing my point of view while expecting me to see hers, and getting really cross when I failed to do something when she thought it should have been obvious what was expected of me.
One time I was really struggling at work and desperately needed to catch up (I was self employed) and I declined her invitation to watch some fireworks with her kids (she was divorced and now I know why). It ended with her slamming the phone down on me and like a classic narc's victim I drove over and went to the show. I don't think I was quite as gullible as to believe it was my fault, but looking back I can't imagine why I let her get away with it.
It all came to an end not long afterwards, fortunately, and amazingly I was quite upset about that. It wasn't until I met my wife that I got over it and realised how lucky I was.
Anybody else suffered at the hands of one of these people?
singlecoil said:
I often listen to talky stuff on YouTube while I'm drawing, and recently I've been listening to a lot of stuff about psychology.As you know, YT will suggest other related stuff and that's led me to some talks on narcissism. I was involved with a woman before I met my wife, and as I'm hearing the narcissism trait being described I'm thinking OMG, that's what was going on.
I knew at the time she was a bit 'unstable' but now I realise exactly what was going on, and she was exhibiting classic narc. tendencies- tantrums, not seeing my point of view while expecting me to see hers, and getting really cross when I failed to do something when she thought it should have been obvious what was expected of me.
One time I was really struggling at work and desperately needed to catch up (I was self employed) and I declined her invitation to watch some fireworks with her kids (she was divorced and now I know why). It ended with her slamming the phone down on me and like a classic narc's victim I drove over and went to the show. I don't think I was quite as gullible as to believe it was my fault, but looking back I can't imagine why I let her get away with it.
It all came to an end not long afterwards, fortunately, and amazingly I was quite upset about that. It wasn't until I met my wife that I got over it and realised how lucky I was.
Anybody else suffered at the hands of one of these people?
Yep, I was with one once.I knew at the time she was a bit 'unstable' but now I realise exactly what was going on, and she was exhibiting classic narc. tendencies- tantrums, not seeing my point of view while expecting me to see hers, and getting really cross when I failed to do something when she thought it should have been obvious what was expected of me.
One time I was really struggling at work and desperately needed to catch up (I was self employed) and I declined her invitation to watch some fireworks with her kids (she was divorced and now I know why). It ended with her slamming the phone down on me and like a classic narc's victim I drove over and went to the show. I don't think I was quite as gullible as to believe it was my fault, but looking back I can't imagine why I let her get away with it.
It all came to an end not long afterwards, fortunately, and amazingly I was quite upset about that. It wasn't until I met my wife that I got over it and realised how lucky I was.
Anybody else suffered at the hands of one of these people?
A line of hers I'll never forget "I'm a bit like Mary Poppins; practically perfect in every way".
She wasn’t.
Three failed marriages and two failed long-term relationships; in every case the male partner left and in every case it was their fault.
It wasn’t.
She was totally incapable of seeing any POV other than her own.
Miserable as sin now, but the ex's (I've met three of them) couldn't be happier.
I have, yes, and also found myself in situations like you describe. I didn't really put up with it, I just told her that it was unreasonable to ask those things of me and refused to do them and as a result we broke up. At that point I realised that it was self-indulgence and narcissism.
This was after engagement and a fair bit of wedding planning, but at least it didn't go to marriage. I think that being stubborn turned out well for me in hindsight, although it's usually not a good trait
This was after engagement and a fair bit of wedding planning, but at least it didn't go to marriage. I think that being stubborn turned out well for me in hindsight, although it's usually not a good trait
singlecoil said:
I often listen to talky stuff on YouTube while I'm drawing, and recently I've been listening to a lot of stuff about psychology.As you know, YT will suggest other related stuff and that's led me to some talks on narcissism. I was involved with a woman before I met my wife, and as I'm hearing the narcissism trait being described I'm thinking OMG, that's what was going on.
I knew at the time she was a bit 'unstable' but now I realise exactly what was going on, and she was exhibiting classic narc. tendencies- tantrums, not seeing my point of view while expecting me to see hers, and getting really cross when I failed to do something when she thought it should have been obvious what was expected of me.
One time I was really struggling at work and desperately needed to catch up (I was self employed) and I declined her invitation to watch some fireworks with her kids (she was divorced and now I know why). It ended with her slamming the phone down on me and like a classic narc's victim I drove over and went to the show. I don't think I was quite as gullible as to believe it was my fault, but looking back I can't imagine why I let her get away with it.
It all came to an end not long afterwards, fortunately, and amazingly I was quite upset about that. It wasn't until I met my wife that I got over it and realised how lucky I was.
Anybody else suffered at the hands of one of these people?
They can confuse their victims into thinking they were the best thing to happen to them due to how they experience and deal with their empathy. The way in which narcissistic types project and displace a myriad of things only clouds the views of themselves by others further. I knew at the time she was a bit 'unstable' but now I realise exactly what was going on, and she was exhibiting classic narc. tendencies- tantrums, not seeing my point of view while expecting me to see hers, and getting really cross when I failed to do something when she thought it should have been obvious what was expected of me.
One time I was really struggling at work and desperately needed to catch up (I was self employed) and I declined her invitation to watch some fireworks with her kids (she was divorced and now I know why). It ended with her slamming the phone down on me and like a classic narc's victim I drove over and went to the show. I don't think I was quite as gullible as to believe it was my fault, but looking back I can't imagine why I let her get away with it.
It all came to an end not long afterwards, fortunately, and amazingly I was quite upset about that. It wasn't until I met my wife that I got over it and realised how lucky I was.
Anybody else suffered at the hands of one of these people?
Narcissists are adept at turning emotional empathy off and on, all the while their cognitive empathy remains part of their self in the main; only to be projected onto their children. Along other emotions, traits and experiences - they tend to see their offspring as mere existential extensions of themselves, allowing for little to no acknowledgement of their individuality.
Watching closely someone who you may suspect to be a narcissist's interaction and behaviour with their kids is a potential giveaway of their true nature.
NoVetec said:
singlecoil said:
I often listen to talky stuff on YouTube while I'm drawing, and recently I've been listening to a lot of stuff about psychology.As you know, YT will suggest other related stuff and that's led me to some talks on narcissism. I was involved with a woman before I met my wife, and as I'm hearing the narcissism trait being described I'm thinking OMG, that's what was going on.
I knew at the time she was a bit 'unstable' but now I realise exactly what was going on, and she was exhibiting classic narc. tendencies- tantrums, not seeing my point of view while expecting me to see hers, and getting really cross when I failed to do something when she thought it should have been obvious what was expected of me.
One time I was really struggling at work and desperately needed to catch up (I was self employed) and I declined her invitation to watch some fireworks with her kids (she was divorced and now I know why). It ended with her slamming the phone down on me and like a classic narc's victim I drove over and went to the show. I don't think I was quite as gullible as to believe it was my fault, but looking back I can't imagine why I let her get away with it.
It all came to an end not long afterwards, fortunately, and amazingly I was quite upset about that. It wasn't until I met my wife that I got over it and realised how lucky I was.
Anybody else suffered at the hands of one of these people?
They can confuse their victims into thinking they were the best thing to happen to them due to how they experience and deal with their empathy. The way in which narcissistic types project and displace a myriad of things only clouds the views of themselves by others further. I knew at the time she was a bit 'unstable' but now I realise exactly what was going on, and she was exhibiting classic narc. tendencies- tantrums, not seeing my point of view while expecting me to see hers, and getting really cross when I failed to do something when she thought it should have been obvious what was expected of me.
One time I was really struggling at work and desperately needed to catch up (I was self employed) and I declined her invitation to watch some fireworks with her kids (she was divorced and now I know why). It ended with her slamming the phone down on me and like a classic narc's victim I drove over and went to the show. I don't think I was quite as gullible as to believe it was my fault, but looking back I can't imagine why I let her get away with it.
It all came to an end not long afterwards, fortunately, and amazingly I was quite upset about that. It wasn't until I met my wife that I got over it and realised how lucky I was.
Anybody else suffered at the hands of one of these people?
Narcissists are adept at turning emotional empathy off and on, all the while their cognitive empathy remains part of their self in the main; only to be projected onto their children. Along other emotions, traits and experiences - they tend to see their offspring as mere existential extensions of themselves, allowing for little to no acknowledgement of their individuality.
Watching closely someone who you may suspect to be a narcissist's interaction and behaviour with their kids is a potential giveaway of their true nature.
To contribute, I reckon my ex may have been heavily weighed towards the narc-side. However I also believe we are all capable of it. Similar to autism, it's surely a scale rather than a "your it" "your not" set up.
We all as humans feed from (in one way or another) attention. When does the crossover take place? When it becomes unhealthy and destructive?
(I'll happily put my hands up and state it's all a big unknown to me really)
mr_spock said:
May I recommend the "Being told 'I don't love you anymore'" and "Divorcing empty nesters" threads for some prime examples.
My ex displays a lot of traits but was very much more passive-aggressive along the lines of covert narcissism, unlike the very overt narcissist she had an affair and ran off with. (Now there’s a match made in heaven).Worth reading about the sub types as they are fascinating. Covert narcissists are generally much less obvious than their overt counterparts who you may be naturally inclined to avoid before getting too involved with.
DoubleTime said:
It sounds like you know the score when it comes to this subject vtec but I need a few "for examples" to be able to relate to your post please?
To contribute, I reckon my ex may have been heavily weighed towards the narc-side. However I also believe we are all capable of it. Similar to autism, it's surely a scale rather than a "your it" "your not" set up.
We all as humans feed from (in one way or another) attention. When does the crossover take place? When it becomes unhealthy and destructive?
(I'll happily put my hands up and state it's all a big unknown to me really)
I only know what I've read, experienced and extrapolated in certain areas about this and other subjects under this guise. Psychology fascinates me. I'm not a professional, very much wish I did a degree in it at uni. What strikes me is just how much psychologists disagree with each other, it's far from an exact science and perhaps parts of it aren't. With notable exceptions in the field of cognitive psychology and large aspects of developmental psychology.To contribute, I reckon my ex may have been heavily weighed towards the narc-side. However I also believe we are all capable of it. Similar to autism, it's surely a scale rather than a "your it" "your not" set up.
We all as humans feed from (in one way or another) attention. When does the crossover take place? When it becomes unhealthy and destructive?
(I'll happily put my hands up and state it's all a big unknown to me really)
A common example of how narcissistic parents treat their children is often covert and overt, chronic marginalisation.
Due to the fact they see their kids as exclusively (worst case) extensions of themselves, a child's growing independence is threatening to their self, and outright success anywhere in life is an unacceptable blight on their self-esteem. For instance, a child who gets an A grade is told by the parent that they should have got an A*, or that they did terribly in other areas.
Another example of this would be an older child moving out of the family home, as this destroys the co-dependent relationship the narcissist has by implication of their grandiose worldview instilled on their son or daughter. Upon trying to, or actually flying the nest, common narcissistic jealously manifests itself in attempting to guilt-trip the child. "What will I do?" "You shouldn't be leaving me?" "Don't forget you need to take care of me when I get older." Threats of being left out of wills aren't unheard of.
The more covert forms tend to take place when siblings are involved. Playing one off against the other in artificial competitions to see one succeed, just to please the parents self-esteem. Projecting what the narcissist deems their best features onto one child when the other displeases them. Child A does something wrong but for the time being is in the good book, so blame is displaced from Child A onto Child B.
As for similarities with autism in regards to measurement, I'd say narcissism is a scale as opposed to a spectrum. Whether that scale starts at 0 or 1 is up for debate.
With humans being social animals, feeding off attention in various means helps orient ourselves in the world in our formative years. It serves as a form of validation and acknowledgement of our achievements then and later on in life. Otherwise mentally healthy people can and do indulge in narcissistic traits, it seems to be people whose base personality traits include being high in neuroticism being under stress or emotional strain.
I don't believe you can become a narcissist later in life, it's either congenital or more likely something that begins to develop in childhood. So I suppose the crossover would take place here - it would be when associated traits and behaviours go from being occasional to being pathological.
Sam993 said:
singlecoil said:
As you know, YT will suggest other related stuff and that's led me to some talks on narcissism.
LOL, I've been getting loads of similar vids in my recommended too recently. Dr Ramani by any chance?Yes, several times by the same person over a period of about 7 years. I didn't even realise the behaviour had a name until I finally saw a shrink and talked about. I've been hoovered up, put on an unachievable pedestal, gaslit, devalued and then discarded more times than I care to admit. I've come to realise that none of it was real and I never actually meant anything to her. I was just supply to her narcissistic needs. A true narc will suck the life force out of you and spit you out without a second thought. I'd strongly advise against involvement.
singlecoil said:
Sam993 said:
singlecoil said:
As you know, YT will suggest other related stuff and that's led me to some talks on narcissism.
LOL, I've been getting loads of similar vids in my recommended too recently. Dr Ramani by any chance?
That said to your original question, my answer is yes and what she describes is scarily accurate. I wish I knew what to watch out for before it was too late! The scariest out of the narcissistic arsenal was gaslighting, one of the worst situations one could be exposed to without being exposed to physical violence...
Not been involved with one, but did have one as a player who joined a small music group I was a member of. Nightmare to deal with, everything was about her. When she had a minor car accident on the way home from a rehearsal it was apparently our fault because we didn't have a tea break when she asked (because we didn't have time as she had turned up an hour late!). Mad as a box of frogs.
Very hard to deal with if you have one at work where they can undermine a whole team, yet think the sun shines out of their arse.
A lot of managers are scared of any confrontation on behaviour when they know the reaction will be to undermine them by the narcissist contacting higher ups to claim victimisation.
A lot of managers are scared of any confrontation on behaviour when they know the reaction will be to undermine them by the narcissist contacting higher ups to claim victimisation.
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