Saw Someone die today
Discussion
I was out and about today for work and saw someone collapsed on the ground with someone else giving CPR. I pulled over to help (I'm CPR trained but never done real life CPR), before I got out the car the ambulance came flying round the corner, I decided that I wouldn't be much help if the pros were arriving so went on my way.
Had to go the same way 5 minutes later, police were there at that point. Nobody working on the man and paramedic filling forms in, passers by had their hand to their mouth. It was clear from the scene he'd died.
I've never encountered anything like that, I just cannot stop thinking that someone could have been waiting for him to get home and he never will, and that he woke up this morning not realising it was his last day. Thinking now of his wife/partner/cat going to bed without him. It's left me feeling a bit funny, my Dad died a few years back (cancer) but I think this being a stranger and so sudden, it kind of hits differently, I can't stop thinking about his loved ones, the grief they must be feeling.
Thought I'd write it up as it shook me up a little and this may help. It's made me realise too that life really is short, and it can end so suddenly.
Had to go the same way 5 minutes later, police were there at that point. Nobody working on the man and paramedic filling forms in, passers by had their hand to their mouth. It was clear from the scene he'd died.
I've never encountered anything like that, I just cannot stop thinking that someone could have been waiting for him to get home and he never will, and that he woke up this morning not realising it was his last day. Thinking now of his wife/partner/cat going to bed without him. It's left me feeling a bit funny, my Dad died a few years back (cancer) but I think this being a stranger and so sudden, it kind of hits differently, I can't stop thinking about his loved ones, the grief they must be feeling.
Thought I'd write it up as it shook me up a little and this may help. It's made me realise too that life really is short, and it can end so suddenly.
I've spent most of my working life being around death, perhaps dealing with 100's of dead bodies which means I have perhaps become quite blase about it. Add to the fact I was by my dads side as he took his last breath and it makes my outlook on death different to most people.
However those who lose children must suffer a completely different kind of pain and grief, one that the rest of us can't understand, even as parents.
However those who lose children must suffer a completely different kind of pain and grief, one that the rest of us can't understand, even as parents.
You were prepared to do what you could to help. Take comfort from that, even if the ambulance did turn up and your help wasn't needed. I was in a similar position a few years ago (although I have no first aid training), it took a couple of weeks but I was eventually to pack the incident away so it didn't come back unbidden. I have endless respect for emergency services people who deal with this stuff on a daily basis.
Death is a difficult topic to discuss for many. We typically defer the conversation because it's uncomfortable for us, and when we're confronted with death, real, there and in front of us we aren't necessarily prepared for it, so to speak (although one might make the point that no training can prepare us; becoming inured to death marks a definite shift in the fundamental traits of most people). Something of a taboo subject, isn't it? Odd, given that it's as inevitable as the sunrise.
Losing the fear of death is one of the key steps in adopting a different attitude towards it. Not a callous disregard for life, but an acceptance of death as the natural end of life, even if the cause of death is far from natural, or if it comes too early. Sometimes it's the death of someone we know or love that helps to shift our attitude, sometimes it's a near-death experience that changes how you see things. In your case it was a complete stranger who died whilst you had your back turned.
My own attitude to death is moulded by my warped sense of humour and I occasionally talk about sensitive topics in a way which seems blunt, dismissive or otherwise disrespectful. But it is my sense of humour that saves me from becoming miserable, that allows me to carry on doing what I do - which doesn't usually involve dealing with death, I should add. Dad has one piece of advice about death; you should live every day as if it's your last, because one day you'll be right. I am comfortable with my own mortality because I've walked that line a few times, not deliberately either.
Every so often I am visited by what the French call l'appel du vide - the call of the void, the little whisper that says 'go on, drive off this bridge' - it's not a serious thought, not suicidal ideation, but an inquisitive voice that asks 'what would it be like?' It keeps me in touch with what will be the natural end-point to my life. Like everyone, I am doomed to die, and although I don't want it to be today, it could happen, and it could be due to something beyond my control. It is a sad event, make no mistake, but it has to happen at some point, and being caught up in the worry of when it'll happen is like seeing the sun shining but being miserable because the weather forecast says it's going to rain tomorrow.
Dealing with grief is its own subject and it's something that occasionally falls within my remit at work. Many of the people we support have lost friends or family members, and they often did not have adequate grief counselling at the time, nor did they have pre-bereavement counselling - the conversations to help prepare them for such an occasion. Some struggle to understand the concept of death and refuse to accept that they will die at some point. Others struggle to comprehend the hole left in their lives by the loss of someone near and dear to them. These are not exclusive to the people I support. Many people, both with and without learning disabilities, struggle with grief.
When these situations occur, the best thing I can do is sit down with whoever's come to me and have a chat. We talk about how they feel but also about their memories, the things they did with that person. Visiting the grave can help the person, as can making a memorial by buying some flowers - preferably perennials - putting them into a pot, and decorating it as they see fit. That way they have a permanent reminder of the person that they can just go out and sit with. The family and friends of this gentleman will hopefully have access to something similar. As for yourself, if you want to chat about anything at all (or nothing in particular), you're more than welcome to drop me a line.
Witnessing death or another traumatic event can shock you. I was left numb and quiet after my first experience with a profoundly depressing event - that was supporting one of our chaps to see his mother in the local nursing home. I was moved by seeing this poor husk of a woman, sitting by her window and waiting for death, forgotten and ignored by the world around her. It is normal to be shocked. I imagine that the other bystanders are also experiencing it. Again, talking about it can help. Rest assured that you went in and came out with a good heart; you were prepared to try to save the life of a complete stranger. Sometimes, our best isn't enough. Sometimes we really do arrive just a moment too late. It is not an indictment of your character that you just happened to arrive when you did, or that you didn't have an opportunity to perform CPR.
Apologies for the ramble, I must have bored half of the internet with this screed, and again, if you want to chat, I am more than happy to talk.
Losing the fear of death is one of the key steps in adopting a different attitude towards it. Not a callous disregard for life, but an acceptance of death as the natural end of life, even if the cause of death is far from natural, or if it comes too early. Sometimes it's the death of someone we know or love that helps to shift our attitude, sometimes it's a near-death experience that changes how you see things. In your case it was a complete stranger who died whilst you had your back turned.
My own attitude to death is moulded by my warped sense of humour and I occasionally talk about sensitive topics in a way which seems blunt, dismissive or otherwise disrespectful. But it is my sense of humour that saves me from becoming miserable, that allows me to carry on doing what I do - which doesn't usually involve dealing with death, I should add. Dad has one piece of advice about death; you should live every day as if it's your last, because one day you'll be right. I am comfortable with my own mortality because I've walked that line a few times, not deliberately either.
Every so often I am visited by what the French call l'appel du vide - the call of the void, the little whisper that says 'go on, drive off this bridge' - it's not a serious thought, not suicidal ideation, but an inquisitive voice that asks 'what would it be like?' It keeps me in touch with what will be the natural end-point to my life. Like everyone, I am doomed to die, and although I don't want it to be today, it could happen, and it could be due to something beyond my control. It is a sad event, make no mistake, but it has to happen at some point, and being caught up in the worry of when it'll happen is like seeing the sun shining but being miserable because the weather forecast says it's going to rain tomorrow.
Dealing with grief is its own subject and it's something that occasionally falls within my remit at work. Many of the people we support have lost friends or family members, and they often did not have adequate grief counselling at the time, nor did they have pre-bereavement counselling - the conversations to help prepare them for such an occasion. Some struggle to understand the concept of death and refuse to accept that they will die at some point. Others struggle to comprehend the hole left in their lives by the loss of someone near and dear to them. These are not exclusive to the people I support. Many people, both with and without learning disabilities, struggle with grief.
When these situations occur, the best thing I can do is sit down with whoever's come to me and have a chat. We talk about how they feel but also about their memories, the things they did with that person. Visiting the grave can help the person, as can making a memorial by buying some flowers - preferably perennials - putting them into a pot, and decorating it as they see fit. That way they have a permanent reminder of the person that they can just go out and sit with. The family and friends of this gentleman will hopefully have access to something similar. As for yourself, if you want to chat about anything at all (or nothing in particular), you're more than welcome to drop me a line.
Witnessing death or another traumatic event can shock you. I was left numb and quiet after my first experience with a profoundly depressing event - that was supporting one of our chaps to see his mother in the local nursing home. I was moved by seeing this poor husk of a woman, sitting by her window and waiting for death, forgotten and ignored by the world around her. It is normal to be shocked. I imagine that the other bystanders are also experiencing it. Again, talking about it can help. Rest assured that you went in and came out with a good heart; you were prepared to try to save the life of a complete stranger. Sometimes, our best isn't enough. Sometimes we really do arrive just a moment too late. It is not an indictment of your character that you just happened to arrive when you did, or that you didn't have an opportunity to perform CPR.
Apologies for the ramble, I must have bored half of the internet with this screed, and again, if you want to chat, I am more than happy to talk.
I saw a chap die in India once.
Road accident.
He was on a motorbike and truck knocked him off and went over the top of him.
Then the truck took off and left him there.
We were stuck in traffic on the other side of the road.
Was quite shocking and despite being about 10 years ago, I can still see it clearly in my mind.
Sorry for anyone going through loss recently as well.
Road accident.
He was on a motorbike and truck knocked him off and went over the top of him.
Then the truck took off and left him there.
We were stuck in traffic on the other side of the road.
Was quite shocking and despite being about 10 years ago, I can still see it clearly in my mind.
Sorry for anyone going through loss recently as well.
AMC243 said:
heartfelt stuff
Well said. Think you've captured what needs to be said.I, not unlike other adults, have seen dead bodies and have seen someone (nearly) die in front of me. There's an element of PTSD that goes with that. One assumes that PTSD will be flashbacks to mortar fire in some war-torn trench whilst ducking machinegun fire - it's not quite like that. It can manifest itself in something as simple as coming across someone having a seizure. It's naturally a rather traumatic event for people who don't see it regularly, so it's only natural for your brain to start analysing and second-guessing what you've done.
Could you have helped if you'd got there quicker? Maybe. Is that something to worry about? No. I know there are many facets to what you are thinking about as you go to sleep tonight, but look at it this way. The chap who passed away did so with strangers around him doing their best to keep him alive, or make his passing as comfortable as possible. I would think that the families/loved ones involved would be happy with that. Would you rather he passed away at home, and his body was only found a few days later, in rigor mortis and having died wondering when someone would see him next?
I lost a very close family member during mid-2020 (the height of lockdown) and she was found on the floor of her living room, TV still running, a few days after she'd passed. It's a horrible, horrible feeling to think of what she may have gone through in her final moments on terra firma. I just hope she thought it was nap time and didn't bother to wake up again. The chap you dealt with - if nothing else, he departed in the presence of people who wanted nothing but the best for him.
(edit: this is as much a vent for me as it is my thoughts for the OP).
Death is so shocking and yet so inevitable.
Obviously the Only thing difficult is the how and when.
Something I struggle with is that people are shocked by old people dying.
My wife's parents were both nursed in palliative care in thier own home by my wife, who was there at the end when over a few hours they drew their last breath, 5 months apart. She is gradually comung tl terms with it, but maybe I'm a little bit Aspergers. You could see it coming for them over the previous 2 or 3 years. The gradual decline.
My parents are the same age, and I'm not sure what ill feel. Probably guilt, that I don't find it sad. Just inevitable.
Yet, when I hear of someone my age, mid 50s, who dies of cancer or a heart attack, I'm shocked in a purely selfish way. I had a heart attack and a stent fitted last year and a friend of a friend died of cancer a few months later, and it's made me think that I need to get on with enjoying the rest of my life and stop stressing about s
t and trivia.
I am totally unmoved by people who I don't know dying. Life follows a reliability bathtub curve, so it's inevitable that people will die, at any age.
At age 19 I was a passenger in a car that left the road in a tragic accident and hit a pedestrian, who died 4 days later.
I travelled with the driver and the pedestrian to hospital in the same ambulance, and it was clear that he wasn't likely to survive. Blood coming out of his ears, wasn't exactly a great sign. I'd have been amazed if he had survived. Maybe my attitude to death is related to trying to justify to myself the tragic death of a stranger.
The crash was a fluke. A tragic accident.
And yet my attitude to health and safety at work in a factory is probably a little over cautious. Maybe I want to make sure any risk assessments that I do and any methods of working make it statistically impossible to have an accident.
That said I snapped a China plate washing up and had to go to A&e because I couldn't stop the bleeding. (fking blood thinners)
Obviously the Only thing difficult is the how and when.
Something I struggle with is that people are shocked by old people dying.
My wife's parents were both nursed in palliative care in thier own home by my wife, who was there at the end when over a few hours they drew their last breath, 5 months apart. She is gradually comung tl terms with it, but maybe I'm a little bit Aspergers. You could see it coming for them over the previous 2 or 3 years. The gradual decline.
My parents are the same age, and I'm not sure what ill feel. Probably guilt, that I don't find it sad. Just inevitable.
Yet, when I hear of someone my age, mid 50s, who dies of cancer or a heart attack, I'm shocked in a purely selfish way. I had a heart attack and a stent fitted last year and a friend of a friend died of cancer a few months later, and it's made me think that I need to get on with enjoying the rest of my life and stop stressing about s
t and trivia. I am totally unmoved by people who I don't know dying. Life follows a reliability bathtub curve, so it's inevitable that people will die, at any age.
At age 19 I was a passenger in a car that left the road in a tragic accident and hit a pedestrian, who died 4 days later.
I travelled with the driver and the pedestrian to hospital in the same ambulance, and it was clear that he wasn't likely to survive. Blood coming out of his ears, wasn't exactly a great sign. I'd have been amazed if he had survived. Maybe my attitude to death is related to trying to justify to myself the tragic death of a stranger.
The crash was a fluke. A tragic accident.
And yet my attitude to health and safety at work in a factory is probably a little over cautious. Maybe I want to make sure any risk assessments that I do and any methods of working make it statistically impossible to have an accident.
That said I snapped a China plate washing up and had to go to A&e because I couldn't stop the bleeding. (f
king blood thinners) Edited by Pit Pony on Tuesday 20th April 03:45
Years ago I was at the front of a line of stopped traffic on the M1 to allow the air ambulance to land on the carriageway for a guy that had a (presumed) heart attack in the car (passenger)
He was out on the tarmac being resuscitated by highway patrol - it was horrific to see and having a front seat with nowhere to go was frankly awful.
It’s stayed with me. I think about it every now and then and it’s always very sobering.
He was out on the tarmac being resuscitated by highway patrol - it was horrific to see and having a front seat with nowhere to go was frankly awful.
It’s stayed with me. I think about it every now and then and it’s always very sobering.
I've seen a few things like this in my time, always shocking and humbling and make you take stock of your own mortality and puts your minor worries and stresses into perspective.
As this is PH, I witnessed a death at Oulton Park in 1999, I was only 18, standing on Clay Hill and Neil Shanahan crashed his Formula Ford right in front of us, it was sickening, that one really stuck with me as he was the same age as me at the time, one minute he's doing something he loved, the next minute, he's gone.
It's inevitable for us all and I guess most of us wish to drift away peacefully in our sleep at a ripe old age, it's when it's sudden and before someone's time that it becomes shocking.
It's a funny old game isn't it.
As this is PH, I witnessed a death at Oulton Park in 1999, I was only 18, standing on Clay Hill and Neil Shanahan crashed his Formula Ford right in front of us, it was sickening, that one really stuck with me as he was the same age as me at the time, one minute he's doing something he loved, the next minute, he's gone.
It's inevitable for us all and I guess most of us wish to drift away peacefully in our sleep at a ripe old age, it's when it's sudden and before someone's time that it becomes shocking.
It's a funny old game isn't it.
fttm said:
Sounds like you are suffering from shock tbh , which can manifest itself in different ways . Take it easy and try not to dwell on what you saw .
I think that’s about as good as advice as it’s possible to give tbh.Unfortunately I’ve seen a few over my time, (suicides & RTAs). There’s nothing you can do about it now. You did the right thing, you tried your best, which is more than most other people would do, and that makes you a really decent chap. If the family knew, I’m sure they would be greatfull.
Unfortunately when our time has come, that’s that.
Thanks for the responses, I think I was in a bit of shock, I've relaxed now, last night I was shook up. I was more thinking of his loved ones more than I was of the man himself, if that makes sense. I think because I've been there, only a couple of years ago grieving my Dad, and the effect that had on me, and remembering that first night, I can remember clear as day being in the brightly coloured room at the hospital and the doctor saying "massive pulmonary embolism" and then "he didn't make it". This chap may have had no kids, no loved ones, but on my assumption he did, I was thinking of the shock as they got the news.
He looked to be 60-70 so not that old really. It's also interesting to read some of your experiences.
He looked to be 60-70 so not that old really. It's also interesting to read some of your experiences.
It sounds a bit cheesy, but it’s ok to not feel ok and to be upset. As human beings, most of us aren’t actually that well designed to deal with trauma and make no mistake, what you’ve seen is traumatic.
I’ve seen a few people die (my Dad, my Mum and one of my sisters, as well as people I’ve encountered through working as a cop). I ended up with some fairly hefty PTSD a few years back, with the trigger event being a young lad who’d drowned, who we unsuccessfully tried to give CPR to. It sounds callous, but that wasn’t the worst/nastiest job I’ve ever been to, it was just the straw that broke the proverbial camel’s back for me. I’d got to the point of being overloaded and it was that particular job which tipped me over the edge (I’m ok now, all sorted after some specialist treatment).
You will know yourself if it’s affecting you more than it “should”, so if you are struggling to cope, as others have said, speak to your GP, or your other half or a good friend. Just talking about it can help to put it in perspective. I ended up writing down everything that had happened, which was cathartic for me and helped me to process it all, so I get why posting it can be helpful.
The last thing I’d say is good on you for stopping, because there are plenty of people who’d have seen it and just carried on. You might not have been needed, but you did stop with the intention of doing whatever you could to help, which to me, counts for a lot.
I’ve seen a few people die (my Dad, my Mum and one of my sisters, as well as people I’ve encountered through working as a cop). I ended up with some fairly hefty PTSD a few years back, with the trigger event being a young lad who’d drowned, who we unsuccessfully tried to give CPR to. It sounds callous, but that wasn’t the worst/nastiest job I’ve ever been to, it was just the straw that broke the proverbial camel’s back for me. I’d got to the point of being overloaded and it was that particular job which tipped me over the edge (I’m ok now, all sorted after some specialist treatment).
You will know yourself if it’s affecting you more than it “should”, so if you are struggling to cope, as others have said, speak to your GP, or your other half or a good friend. Just talking about it can help to put it in perspective. I ended up writing down everything that had happened, which was cathartic for me and helped me to process it all, so I get why posting it can be helpful.
The last thing I’d say is good on you for stopping, because there are plenty of people who’d have seen it and just carried on. You might not have been needed, but you did stop with the intention of doing whatever you could to help, which to me, counts for a lot.
Badda said:
It’s normal to dwell on it for the first 48-72 hours. If you’re still feeling intrusive thoughts after that, it might be worth speaking to your gp.
The best 'therapy' is talking about it with mates, having a pint and a chin-wag about it. Shown to be better than counselling, so you're on the right lines already, just a pity about the pubs being shut!I remember back in 1998, going to work, thinking how unusual it was not seeing my dad before leaving.. I went to work and thought nothing of it, only to receive a phone call from my mum later that morning. She was in a right state because she hadn't seen dad either.. Mum had to live her life downstairs as a botched hip operation prevented her going upstairs to see if he was ok..
I rushed home from work, went upstairs to his bedroom to find him dead in his bed - I remember the radio being on next to his bed with the cricket match still being transmitted.. The shock was immense, mum in the end was shocked but somehow she knew I think.
He was only 69...
My thoughts, when I think of my dad go out to the doctors and nurses all over this world, who have seen such multiple deaths, had those difficult conversations with family members during Covid-19.. The nurses due to restrictions became almost family to so many who died, and whilst we are all affected with personal loss, our hearts should go out to our wonderful NHS staff - so many will need support and counselling over the coming months and years...
I rushed home from work, went upstairs to his bedroom to find him dead in his bed - I remember the radio being on next to his bed with the cricket match still being transmitted.. The shock was immense, mum in the end was shocked but somehow she knew I think.
He was only 69...
My thoughts, when I think of my dad go out to the doctors and nurses all over this world, who have seen such multiple deaths, had those difficult conversations with family members during Covid-19.. The nurses due to restrictions became almost family to so many who died, and whilst we are all affected with personal loss, our hearts should go out to our wonderful NHS staff - so many will need support and counselling over the coming months and years...
Death for me is a weird one. I deal with it fairly regularly with work. Some are worse than others. Some are expected, others aren’t. I don’t get effected by it. Or at least I don’t think I do?
Talking helps. My squad at work are fanatic. We talk the job through. I know I could phone any of them up now and say I need a chat and they would all listen and help which is nice to know. Like wise I’d be there for them. I do try and not talk about it with my girlfriend though as I don’t want her to know just how bad some of the jobs are I deal with.
Maybe it’s a worry that it doesn’t effect me! Although I did get told by an ex that I’m emotionally dead!
OP although you didn’t get involved with the CPR, you went over to help which is more than most people would. Take some comfort in that.
Talking helps. My squad at work are fanatic. We talk the job through. I know I could phone any of them up now and say I need a chat and they would all listen and help which is nice to know. Like wise I’d be there for them. I do try and not talk about it with my girlfriend though as I don’t want her to know just how bad some of the jobs are I deal with.
Maybe it’s a worry that it doesn’t effect me! Although I did get told by an ex that I’m emotionally dead!
OP although you didn’t get involved with the CPR, you went over to help which is more than most people would. Take some comfort in that.
Sadly, as one gets older, dealing with death becomes more commonplace - leading, of course, to coping with one's own.
I don't find it shocking any more, especially if the individual is over a certain age or had underlying health issues.
What does get depressing is seeing all your old friends, acquaintances and loved family members gradually disappear.
I don't find it shocking any more, especially if the individual is over a certain age or had underlying health issues.
What does get depressing is seeing all your old friends, acquaintances and loved family members gradually disappear.
Eric Mc said:
Sadly, as one gets older, dealing with death becomes more commonplace - leading, of course, to coping with one's own.
I don't find it shocking any more, especially if the individual is over a certain age or had underlying health issues.
What does get depressing is seeing all your old friends, acquaintances and loved family members gradually disappear.
It’s sad indeed but once we fully understand or accept the inevitability of it, it’s perhaps easier?I don't find it shocking any more, especially if the individual is over a certain age or had underlying health issues.
What does get depressing is seeing all your old friends, acquaintances and loved family members gradually disappear.
I wish I had some kind of religion or spirituality that helped make more sense of it. I’ve seen a few people die and held their hand as they passed and still find the idea that something can be alive and then not difficult to grasp tbh, I expect some feeling of an continuing energy between things or a belief in an afterlife or some kind of ongoing interconnection through spirituality or faith helps people hugely.
Then on the other hand perhaps the thought that by some miracle in the universe we (and life in general) exists for a finite window might encourage us to make more use of and appreciate our time here more?
Gassing Station | The Lounge | Top of Page | What's New | My Stuff