Buying second hand things from the EU
Discussion
Since Brexit I've avoided buying and selling stuff with the EU. I've seen some second hand car parts in Romania on ebay which are £1000. I've read a few articles but they were early January when everything was a mess so I want to know the current state of play from anyone has bought something recently. Am I right to expect a £200 bill from the courier when it's delivered? As it's ebay, is there anything stopping the seller declaring the value as £100 and then there is no VAT to pay?
From the perspective of Customs, they're not "second hand".
They're goods being imported into the UK, with a value.
If you wish to evade VAT, you have two options. Ship it underdeclared in value. IF HMRC check the package, then you'll be on the hook for the value they deem it to be worth - and you'll have nothing to counter that.
Or, grab a cheap flight, have a weekend trip to Romania and bring it back in your luggage. You're more likely to get away with this - but the penalty will be higher if caught.
Of course, option two is tricky at the moment.
How much cheaper is the part in Romania compared to UK?
They're goods being imported into the UK, with a value.
If you wish to evade VAT, you have two options. Ship it underdeclared in value. IF HMRC check the package, then you'll be on the hook for the value they deem it to be worth - and you'll have nothing to counter that.
Or, grab a cheap flight, have a weekend trip to Romania and bring it back in your luggage. You're more likely to get away with this - but the penalty will be higher if caught.
Of course, option two is tricky at the moment.
How much cheaper is the part in Romania compared to UK?
Having recently helped out a PHer getting w car part from Germany to Scotland, I can confirm its really not as easy or as cheap as it used to be. 
Quotes for shipping ranged from very high to f
king ridiculous via parcelmonkey and the like. What used to cost <€30 to send via courier was more than €130. Many couriers don't even want to ship stuff to Britain now, so they won't even quote, or they simply won't insure for loss / damage on so many types of goods now.
I don't know if the receiver needed to pay any duty on what I sent on to him last week. Maybe he'll see this thread and may comment himself.
ETA: just checked the tracking on the parcel sent last week, that should have taken 2-3 days. It's only made it as far as Cologne! FFS, UPS!
Quotes for shipping ranged from very high to f
king ridiculous via parcelmonkey and the like. What used to cost <€30 to send via courier was more than €130. Many couriers don't even want to ship stuff to Britain now, so they won't even quote, or they simply won't insure for loss / damage on so many types of goods now. I don't know if the receiver needed to pay any duty on what I sent on to him last week. Maybe he'll see this thread and may comment himself.
ETA: just checked the tracking on the parcel sent last week, that should have taken 2-3 days. It's only made it as far as Cologne! FFS, UPS!
Edited by RC1807 on Monday 26th April 12:06
The cost of postage is £100 so I think the seller has priced my Brexit Bonus into that regarding shipping complexities.
It's a pair of hybrid turbos, they are used though so feels like a bit of a gamble. Not like I can just send them back for £20 like in the good old days of 2020 if I felt the condition was misrepresented.
Similar in the UK is £1500-2500 depending on who's doing them I think but it's built to order and probably will take a while.
Another option is a set made by Mamba, well regarded from what I've seen. They are £1500 but come from Taiwan so I think I'll get taxed on them also?
It's a pair of hybrid turbos, they are used though so feels like a bit of a gamble. Not like I can just send them back for £20 like in the good old days of 2020 if I felt the condition was misrepresented.
Similar in the UK is £1500-2500 depending on who's doing them I think but it's built to order and probably will take a while.
Another option is a set made by Mamba, well regarded from what I've seen. They are £1500 but come from Taiwan so I think I'll get taxed on them also?
Escy said:
Another way around it could be to put the value but mark it as a warranty return or something?
I had an ECU with a similar value that I sent to Iceland as a genuine warranty return, it came back to me with no charges on it. Paid a chunk of tax when I initially bought it.
Risky, depends how nosey your local customs people are but that could get very easily get expensive and potentially legally problematic.I had an ECU with a similar value that I sent to Iceland as a genuine warranty return, it came back to me with no charges on it. Paid a chunk of tax when I initially bought it.
Escy said:
The cost of postage is £100 so I think the seller has priced my Brexit Bonus into that regarding shipping complexities.
It's a pair of hybrid turbos, they are used though so feels like a bit of a gamble. Not like I can just send them back for £20 like in the good old days of 2020 if I felt the condition was misrepresented.
Similar in the UK is £1500-2500 depending on who's doing them I think but it's built to order and probably will take a while.
Another option is a set made by Mamba, well regarded from what I've seen. They are £1500 but come from Taiwan so I think I'll get taxed on them also?
So you can go with a cheap, unverifiable option with virtually no recourse if it's fIt's a pair of hybrid turbos, they are used though so feels like a bit of a gamble. Not like I can just send them back for £20 like in the good old days of 2020 if I felt the condition was misrepresented.
Similar in the UK is £1500-2500 depending on who's doing them I think but it's built to order and probably will take a while.
Another option is a set made by Mamba, well regarded from what I've seen. They are £1500 but come from Taiwan so I think I'll get taxed on them also?
ked. Or, you can get one done to order by a UK firm with the protections that provides, and the tax paid - for very little more in absolute terms.
Finally, a (new?) option, that's the same net price as the refurbed UK ones - but will be liable for VAT and applicable duties.
Sway said:
So you can go with a cheap, unverifiable option with virtually no recourse if it's fked.
Or, you can get one done to order by a UK firm with the protections that provides, and the tax paid - for very little more in absolute terms.
Finally, a (new?) option, that's the same net price as the refurbed UK ones - but will be liable for VAT and applicable duties.
Part of my consideration is time. Could get the used ones by the weekend. To get a set built in the UK, I've been quoted £1250 but I need to provide housings and he (and neither do I) wants to use Chinese housings. He doesn't have any in stock so it's all a bit open ended, don't know how much extra the housings are. Think it would end up well over £2000.ked. Or, you can get one done to order by a UK firm with the protections that provides, and the tax paid - for very little more in absolute terms.
Finally, a (new?) option, that's the same net price as the refurbed UK ones - but will be liable for VAT and applicable duties.
The Mamba option is new but they are built to order so looking at a few weeks plus a likely tax hit. When I buy stuff from China I don't get extra charges but think I will from Taiwan?
Escy said:
Sway said:
So you can go with a cheap, unverifiable option with virtually no recourse if it's fked.
Or, you can get one done to order by a UK firm with the protections that provides, and the tax paid - for very little more in absolute terms.
Finally, a (new?) option, that's the same net price as the refurbed UK ones - but will be liable for VAT and applicable duties.
Part of my consideration is time. Could get the used ones by the weekend. To get a set built in the UK, I've been quoted £1250 but I need to provide housings and he (and neither do I) wants to use Chinese housings. He doesn't have any in stock so it's all a bit open ended, don't know how much extra the housings are. Think it would end up well over £2000.ked. Or, you can get one done to order by a UK firm with the protections that provides, and the tax paid - for very little more in absolute terms.
Finally, a (new?) option, that's the same net price as the refurbed UK ones - but will be liable for VAT and applicable duties.
The Mamba option is new but they are built to order so looking at a few weeks plus a likely tax hit. When I buy stuff from China I don't get extra charges but think I will from Taiwan?
What's being missed in the rush to blame brexit - you now don't pay 'Romanian VAT', but do pay 'British VAT'. In many cases compared to the continent, that's actually a net reduction - and irrespective a benefit for the UK as a whole. Would you rather the taxes you pay be spent here or in Romania?
Time is a factor - you're therefore weighing up time/cost/risk. There's an old saying about time and money.
Escy said:
Part of my consideration is time. Could get the used ones by the weekend...
This is very unlikely under the current circumstances. I would reckon on 2-3 weeks delivery time.A mate of mine posted on FB last week that by the time he'd received some secondhand parts, the costs - transport, customs VAT etc.were nearly as much as he paid for the parts.
Sway said:
What's being missed in the rush to blame brexit - you now don't pay 'Romanian VAT', but do pay 'British VAT'. In many cases compared to the continent, that's actually a net reduction - and irrespective a benefit for the UK as a whole. Would you rather the taxes you pay be spent here or in Romania?
It's a private sale, there is no Romanian VAT being taken off the cost.sunbeam alpine said:
This is very unlikely under the current circumstances. I would reckon on 2-3 weeks delivery time.
A mate of mine posted on FB last week that by the time he'd received some secondhand parts, the costs - transport, customs VAT etc.were nearly as much as he paid for the parts.
Ahh, I thought the couriers had got to grips with it all now.A mate of mine posted on FB last week that by the time he'd received some secondhand parts, the costs - transport, customs VAT etc.were nearly as much as he paid for the parts.
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