Surname Derivations?
Poll: Surname Derivations?
Total Members Polled: 112
Discussion
If I understand it correctly, most UK surnames are derived from a place (eg Boston), a profession (eg Smith) or an ancestor (eg O'Connor), so thought it may be fun to start a poll.
My surname is in the Magna Carta and is derived from a form of tax or debt collector.
How about you?
I wonder whether it's the same for non-British folk?
My surname is in the Magna Carta and is derived from a form of tax or debt collector.
How about you?
I wonder whether it's the same for non-British folk?
Celtic/Gaelic surnames stem from Clan Names - usually prefixed by a Mac/Mc (which means "son of") or O' - which means "from" or "of".
My surname, McLoughlin, simply means "Son of Loughlin". "O'Connor" means ""Of the Connor Clan".
One permutation on this which has dropped out of use, except when speaking in Gaelic, is the prefix "Ní" (pronounced "Nee"", which means , "daughter of". Strictly, a lady named Mary McLoughlin, in Gaelic would write her name Máire NiLochlainn.
This male-female distinction is still used in Iceland. If a chap was called Magnus Magnusson, his daughter might be called Bjork Magnusdottir.
My surname, McLoughlin, simply means "Son of Loughlin". "O'Connor" means ""Of the Connor Clan".
One permutation on this which has dropped out of use, except when speaking in Gaelic, is the prefix "Ní" (pronounced "Nee"", which means , "daughter of". Strictly, a lady named Mary McLoughlin, in Gaelic would write her name Máire NiLochlainn.
This male-female distinction is still used in Iceland. If a chap was called Magnus Magnusson, his daughter might be called Bjork Magnusdottir.
Eric Mc said:
Celtic/Gaelic surnames stem from Clan Names - usually prefixed by a Mac/Mc (which means "son of") or O' - which means "from" or "of".
My surname, McLoughlin, simply means "Son of Loughlin". "O'Connor" means ""Of the Connor Clan".
One permutation on this which has dropped out of use, except when speaking in Gaelic, is the prefix "Ní" (pronounced "Nee"", which means , "daughter of". Strictly, a lady named Mary McLoughlin, in Gaelic would write her name Máire NiLochlainn.
This male-female distinction is still used in Iceland. If a chap was called Magnus Magnusson, his daughter might be called Bjork Magnusdottir.
Interesting. Thanks Eric.My surname, McLoughlin, simply means "Son of Loughlin". "O'Connor" means ""Of the Connor Clan".
One permutation on this which has dropped out of use, except when speaking in Gaelic, is the prefix "Ní" (pronounced "Nee"", which means , "daughter of". Strictly, a lady named Mary McLoughlin, in Gaelic would write her name Máire NiLochlainn.
This male-female distinction is still used in Iceland. If a chap was called Magnus Magnusson, his daughter might be called Bjork Magnusdottir.
Apparently my surname is of Yorkshire origin and originally meant a smart person in a business sense. Unfortunately an abbreviation of my name has now come to mean a business person of dubious repute - think the black market guy in Dads Army.
That said my sis joined the military police back in the 80s and at her passing out Colonel (I think?) Peter Inge who was top man at the time said ah, that's a good Yorkshire name glad to have you.
So probably counts as profession based name - just not in an entirely positive way
That said my sis joined the military police back in the 80s and at her passing out Colonel (I think?) Peter Inge who was top man at the time said ah, that's a good Yorkshire name glad to have you.
So probably counts as profession based name - just not in an entirely positive way
From what I can gather, English "surnames" didn't really exist until the arrival of the Normans.
Of course, "England" itself didn't truly exist until the Normans arrived and more or less brought the whole of what became England under central control. Prior to the Normans, England was really a series of kingdoms ruled by both Saxon and Norse rulers with the country being divided more or less across the middle - Norse/Danes in the north and Saxons in the south.
In the north therefore, there would have been lots of Nordic type surnames such as Anderson, Jonson, Erikson etc. In the south, Saxon dominated areas, surnames were not that commonly used - which could cause confusion. If there were three Johns, for instance, living in reasonable proximity to each other, they might be identified by some personal characteristic, such as their town, their trade or a physical attribute (John of Lancaster, John the Farmer, John the Young etc etc).
The Normans, wanting to carry out detailed censuses of the land they had just taken over, wanted something a bit more definitive so more or less insisted that the Saxon natives start adopting proper surnames so they could be properly identified in parish records etc.
The Normans themselves had surnames of their own, which, being from France, usually had "de" (of) as part of the surname, such as Richard de Clere, or John de Courcey. They also had a prefix "Fitz" which, like "Mc", means "son of", so you get names like Fitzmaurice, Fitzsimons, Fitzroy etc.
Of course, "England" itself didn't truly exist until the Normans arrived and more or less brought the whole of what became England under central control. Prior to the Normans, England was really a series of kingdoms ruled by both Saxon and Norse rulers with the country being divided more or less across the middle - Norse/Danes in the north and Saxons in the south.
In the north therefore, there would have been lots of Nordic type surnames such as Anderson, Jonson, Erikson etc. In the south, Saxon dominated areas, surnames were not that commonly used - which could cause confusion. If there were three Johns, for instance, living in reasonable proximity to each other, they might be identified by some personal characteristic, such as their town, their trade or a physical attribute (John of Lancaster, John the Farmer, John the Young etc etc).
The Normans, wanting to carry out detailed censuses of the land they had just taken over, wanted something a bit more definitive so more or less insisted that the Saxon natives start adopting proper surnames so they could be properly identified in parish records etc.
The Normans themselves had surnames of their own, which, being from France, usually had "de" (of) as part of the surname, such as Richard de Clere, or John de Courcey. They also had a prefix "Fitz" which, like "Mc", means "son of", so you get names like Fitzmaurice, Fitzsimons, Fitzroy etc.
Ours is Kirk from Church - Norse in origin, though we can trace it back to at least the 12th / 13th century in Yorkshire and before that in Derbyshire...
was commonly spelled Kirke, though lost the 'e' in the 18th C - and appears to originally had spellings such as Cyrcke - at least the current spelling is easy over the phone!
was commonly spelled Kirke, though lost the 'e' in the 18th C - and appears to originally had spellings such as Cyrcke - at least the current spelling is easy over the phone!
Eric Mc said:
Celtic/Gaelic surnames stem from Clan Names - usually prefixed by a Mac/Mc (which means "son of") or O' - which means "from" or "of".
My surname, McLoughlin, simply means "Son of Loughlin". "O'Connor" means ""Of the Connor Clan".
One permutation on this which has dropped out of use, except when speaking in Gaelic, is the prefix "Ní" (pronounced "Nee"", which means , "daughter of". Strictly, a lady named Mary McLoughlin, in Gaelic would write her name Máire NiLochlainn.
This male-female distinction is still used in Iceland. If a chap was called Magnus Magnusson, his daughter might be called Bjork Magnusdottir.
AIUI then, in the Arab world bin (like Osama bin Laden) is synonymous with Mac and Al nearer to O' (perhaps more like 'the' than 'of' - Al Jazeera, the peninsula).My surname, McLoughlin, simply means "Son of Loughlin". "O'Connor" means ""Of the Connor Clan".
One permutation on this which has dropped out of use, except when speaking in Gaelic, is the prefix "Ní" (pronounced "Nee"", which means , "daughter of". Strictly, a lady named Mary McLoughlin, in Gaelic would write her name Máire NiLochlainn.
This male-female distinction is still used in Iceland. If a chap was called Magnus Magnusson, his daughter might be called Bjork Magnusdottir.
They have an equivalent to bin for daughter of. It's bint...
Eric Mc said:
Celtic/Gaelic surnames stem from Clan Names - usually prefixed by a Mac/Mc (which means "son of") or O' - which means "from" or "of".
My surname, McLoughlin, simply means "Son of Loughlin". "O'Connor" means ""Of the Connor Clan".
One permutation on this which has dropped out of use, except when speaking in Gaelic, is the prefix "Ní" (pronounced "Nee"", which means , "daughter of". Strictly, a lady named Mary McLoughlin, in Gaelic would write her name Máire NiLochlainn.
This male-female distinction is still used in Iceland. If a chap was called Magnus Magnusson, his daughter might be called Bjork Magnusdottir.
Is that related to the use of 'nee' to denote a maiden name? My surname, McLoughlin, simply means "Son of Loughlin". "O'Connor" means ""Of the Connor Clan".
One permutation on this which has dropped out of use, except when speaking in Gaelic, is the prefix "Ní" (pronounced "Nee"", which means , "daughter of". Strictly, a lady named Mary McLoughlin, in Gaelic would write her name Máire NiLochlainn.
This male-female distinction is still used in Iceland. If a chap was called Magnus Magnusson, his daughter might be called Bjork Magnusdottir.
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