Thames Water's debt collectors think I owe them money- help!
Discussion
Hello all,
I've got a little problem development with everyone's favourite monopoly water company and wondered if anyone had any advice for me (or at least some calming words!) So, my situation: I received a call this evening from a debt collector claiming to act for Thames Water. They claim that the property I occupied two years ago has an unpaid water bill, that they've informed me repeatedly and now have called on the debt people.
This comes as news to me, as I transferred my account to a new property via their online service (I have an email, but it's very generic) on 28th January '08 and terminated my lease agreement with the agency on the first place. I pay by direct debit and have never missed a payment they've asked for. I've since moved again within the region and switched the account details again. I've not any letters or calls from Thames Water to inform me of a debt.
I phoned customer service and they said I had to write them a letter as the debt was too old to deal with over the phone. 5 minutes later I got another call from the collection agency! Now I'm panicked and a bit scared - I've never had a problem with anything like this before and the agency are quite intimidating
. They haven't even told me how much it is, which is worrying in itself.
I've hardly hidden myself from them in the last 2 years - I've been a paying customer with a registered address, as I was before I moved - neither have I received a single letter or phone call from Thames Water to tell me I owe them a penny.
I'm going to send a letter to TW, then instruct my solicitor in the morning to act on my behalf and direct the collection agency to talk to them as I'm already really stressed by the whole thing. So I turn it over to the PH massive: am I doing the right things? Am I being unreasonable in expecting Thames Water to talk to me first before instructing debt collectors?
Thanks in advance,
Matt
I've got a little problem development with everyone's favourite monopoly water company and wondered if anyone had any advice for me (or at least some calming words!) So, my situation: I received a call this evening from a debt collector claiming to act for Thames Water. They claim that the property I occupied two years ago has an unpaid water bill, that they've informed me repeatedly and now have called on the debt people.
This comes as news to me, as I transferred my account to a new property via their online service (I have an email, but it's very generic) on 28th January '08 and terminated my lease agreement with the agency on the first place. I pay by direct debit and have never missed a payment they've asked for. I've since moved again within the region and switched the account details again. I've not any letters or calls from Thames Water to inform me of a debt.
I phoned customer service and they said I had to write them a letter as the debt was too old to deal with over the phone. 5 minutes later I got another call from the collection agency! Now I'm panicked and a bit scared - I've never had a problem with anything like this before and the agency are quite intimidating
. They haven't even told me how much it is, which is worrying in itself.I've hardly hidden myself from them in the last 2 years - I've been a paying customer with a registered address, as I was before I moved - neither have I received a single letter or phone call from Thames Water to tell me I owe them a penny.
I'm going to send a letter to TW, then instruct my solicitor in the morning to act on my behalf and direct the collection agency to talk to them as I'm already really stressed by the whole thing. So I turn it over to the PH massive: am I doing the right things? Am I being unreasonable in expecting Thames Water to talk to me first before instructing debt collectors?
Thanks in advance,
Matt
Distant said:
Sounds a bit iffy to me, surely their first port of call is a (million) letters to you. That and they won't tell you how much you owe, be wary of giving your personal info out to people that phone out of the blue!
Thanks - you're right and that was how I started the conversation with Thames Water. Unfortunately, at first glance it looks like they've messed up their customer data and not done the transfer of address correctly, so they might have been sending letters to the wrong place for 2 years! That said, they've clearly got my phone number as the debt collectors are using it, so they could have called me! Too simple, clearly...f
king water companies!
At my old place they put in a water meter that leaked water into the road for ages before they bothered to fix it.
Anglian water, bless, tried to charge me for the sewerage for all the water that went off down the road. I hinted that I would rather let people use my nuts to play snooker with than pay them £400 for 3 months sewerage.
They apologised, said they would use a leak down allowance and would put a bill for around £80 in the post.
Fast forward 6 months of hearing nothing and now some scouse debt agency is chasing me for £400!
king water companies!At my old place they put in a water meter that leaked water into the road for ages before they bothered to fix it.
Anglian water, bless, tried to charge me for the sewerage for all the water that went off down the road. I hinted that I would rather let people use my nuts to play snooker with than pay them £400 for 3 months sewerage.
They apologised, said they would use a leak down allowance and would put a bill for around £80 in the post.
Fast forward 6 months of hearing nothing and now some scouse debt agency is chasing me for £400!
This is worth a read to explain what your rights are regarding debt collectors:
http://boards.fool.co.uk/Message.asp?mid=9708407
http://boards.fool.co.uk/Message.asp?mid=9708407
Timsta said:
If you are disputing the debt then let the collection agency know that. By law they cannot chase a disputed debt and will have to hand the account back to the water company to resolve the dispute.
Never ever, ever deal with the collectors if the account is in dispute.
What this guy says, I'd be wanting copies of any alleged paperwork pinning the debt on you before I even entertained the thought of paying them. Never ever, ever deal with the collectors if the account is in dispute.
Tell the Debt Collectors (send this by proof of posting or recorded delivery) that any debt is denied and that you have seen no evidence of the same. Until such time as any debt is proven by a court of law any furher communications from the Debt Collection Agency will be deemed harassment and treated as such (save for expressly permitting provision of the Proof of Debt from Thames Water).
Jasandjules said:
Tell the Debt Collectors (send this by proof of posting or recorded delivery) that any debt is denied and that you have seen no evidence of the same. Until such time as any debt is proven by a court of law any further communications from the Debt Collection Agency will be deemed harassment and treated as such (save for expressly permitting provision of the Proof of Debt from Thames Water).
Really important to get this in as early as possible. It removes the knucklehead head approach and ensures that you are only dealing with the water company.Simond001 said:
Jasandjules said:
Tell the Debt Collectors (send this by proof of posting or recorded delivery) that any debt is denied and that you have seen no evidence of the same. Until such time as any debt is proven by a court of law any further communications from the Debt Collection Agency will be deemed harassment and treated as such (save for expressly permitting provision of the Proof of Debt from Thames Water).
Really important to get this in as early as possible. It removes the knucklehead head approach and ensures that you are only dealing with the water company.cymtriks said:
As above plus if it continues start billing them for your time. Tell them that you will do this and keep a diary of every minute you spend on this. It's probably taken several hours already with phone calls, reading letters, going through your records, etc. What does your job normally charge for a consultant? You could probably already charge them for hundreds of pounds.
I quite like that idea... The answer to the question is £385/ hr ex. VAT. I have written down everything to date as I'm naturally cautious with these things. Am hoping that it won't go too far - don't really need any extra work right now!On the bailiffs; am I right in thinking that they need to have served papers before they can come round? So far the DCA are so dim witted that they haven't got my current address, so hopefully the letter will reach TW and be actioned before it comes to that. Will be on my toes.
M
mrdelmonti said:
Just a word of warning, if they turn up at your house DO NOT let them in, so far as I know once you let them in willingly they are perfectly fine to enter your house at any other point in the future to collect. Although this might only apply to court ordered bailiffs.
Yep, only court bailiffs.Rule 1 of debt collecting - "a debt collector has no legal standing". So tell him/her to leave. That should be the end of it. Comments about harrassment stand - tape phone calls if you can.
Bailiffs are appointed after the debt has been to the county court and they have a CCJ and you've refused to pay within a certain period (28 days?) - you would be fully aware if this had happened!
If Thames Water have messed up, complain to them. When you have exhausted their complaints procedure, complain to the body that oversees them - OFWAT.
Don't talk to the debt collector but to Thames Water - why talk to the monkey when you need to speak to the organ grinder? No, scrub that - WRITE, don't talk, get an audit trail on this. Methinks Thames Water are taking a chance on you just paying (after all, the debt collector gets commission, as does their company, so Thames Water don't get it all back anyway
), but if you're sure you're not responsible for this alleged debt then complain etc as above 
.
Bailiffs are appointed after the debt has been to the county court and they have a CCJ and you've refused to pay within a certain period (28 days?) - you would be fully aware if this had happened!
If Thames Water have messed up, complain to them. When you have exhausted their complaints procedure, complain to the body that oversees them - OFWAT.
Don't talk to the debt collector but to Thames Water - why talk to the monkey when you need to speak to the organ grinder? No, scrub that - WRITE, don't talk, get an audit trail on this. Methinks Thames Water are taking a chance on you just paying (after all, the debt collector gets commission, as does their company, so Thames Water don't get it all back anyway
), but if you're sure you're not responsible for this alleged debt then complain etc as above .Simond001 said:
Jasandjules said:
Tell the Debt Collectors (send this by proof of posting or recorded delivery) that any debt is denied and that you have seen no evidence of the same. Until such time as any debt is proven by a court of law any further communications from the Debt Collection Agency will be deemed harassment and treated as such (save for expressly permitting provision of the Proof of Debt from Thames Water).
Really important to get this in as early as possible. It removes the knucklehead head approach and ensures that you are only dealing with the water company.Sun Dance Kid said:
Interesting article, thank you.As to whether the debt is real: I think not, however since they've told me nothing about it, I can't establish its authenticity, which is frustrating in the extreme!
So, after half an hour on the phone, I finally got through to someone at Thames Water who could actually see what was going on and make some sort of informed decision!
As I thought, the debt is completely unjustified - it's supposed to cover a bill for April 2009 - March 2010, i.e. nearly a year and a half since I moved out. They even had the move recorded on my account actions, although for some reason they hadn't removed my first place from the file and had tried to bill it. They seemed apologetic and willing to correct their mistake (they even admitted a mistake!). I wait with baited breath to see if it's going to be that easy...
As I thought, the debt is completely unjustified - it's supposed to cover a bill for April 2009 - March 2010, i.e. nearly a year and a half since I moved out. They even had the move recorded on my account actions, although for some reason they hadn't removed my first place from the file and had tried to bill it. They seemed apologetic and willing to correct their mistake (they even admitted a mistake!). I wait with baited breath to see if it's going to be that easy...
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