A Moral Dilemma - Fight or Flight?

[Pagey]

Good evening PH'ers
I'm interested to hear your general opinion on the Dilemma below:


Situation is this: I have an 11 year old nephew (my sisters child) I am, and always have been the Dad he has never had. He spends a lot of his time with me - Holidays, weekends etc, I deal with all of his schooling etc etc.

Since Christmas he has had quite a few problems with bullying at school, he has been kicked punched etcand on one occasion hit with a cricket bat - cue me hitting the roof and letting rip at the Headmaster. The school have been pretty good about keeping myself and his mum in the picture with the events and on one occasion we even had a say in the punishment

Fast forward to today - I get a call at work from the school (they couldn't get hold of his mum) Junior has been the victim of bullying in the Playground again but it has gone up another level he had a slight disagreement with another boy in his year over a ball a group of lads in the year above have the encouraged the other lad to beat him up and have obliged in tripping Junior up and bundling him to the floor and stuck the boot in and then encouraged the younger lad to do the same
He has been kicked and puched on the floor by three or four boys - this was eventually spotted by a teacher and stopped.
The Headmaster was unavailable when I got to the school so I had words with the Deputy who assures me that 'it will be dealt with' We shall see!

Junior is in a bit of a state - bruising around his eye, a couple of red marks on his back, school uniform ripped etc. Naturally he is quite upset!
It wasn't easy for me seeing him in that state, and I had an unbelievable urge to hunt the little barstewards down as they left school and kic the living ste out of them. Which I cant clearly do!


Now he didn't want to go to his mums house tonight he wants to stay at mine which is not a problem for me. Sitting playing on the Wii with him and he asks me if I will teach him to fight!!!!



He thinks if he fight back they might leave him alone


I can easily teach him to defend himself, sit someone firmly on their arse, or hurt someone. My dilemma is:

Would it be irresponsible of me to teach him to 'fight'

[chrisxr2]

erm no. Survival of the fittest, as long as he then doent become a bully beacsue he knows he can handle himself.

[eldar]

First, who does the lad think his parents actually are? Odd question, maybe, but is the 'real' dad in the background somewhere?

Second, why is he being bullied?

Third, are the school actually taking this seriously?

[Shaolin]

Bullies don't understand a good talking to, they understand "don't bully this one it will hurt".

[timlongs]

After watching people who got this badly bullied in school, they sort of eventually dig themselves into a hole and alienate themselves from everyone. Its quite sad to see.

I wouldn't suggest teaching him to fight, but he needs to be able to stick up for himself.

[Cara van Man]

a well placed knock to one of the bullies to put him on his arse may be just the ticket.......

[Sheets Tabuer]

Obviously you have things to sort out with the school but I believe you should sent the lad to learn boxing, not only will it boost his confidence but he'll be able to put every one of them on their arse in 6 months.

He'll get all the chicks too

I had a lad at school who used to always try it on with me, it soon stopped when I put him on his arse and he actually became quite a good friend after.

[Alfanatic]

Yeah, teach him to fight. Give him the opportunity and confidence to defend himself. If he then starts bullying others, deal with that problem when it becomes one.

[al1991]

I would do. It doesn't sound as though the school are helping tbh.

[gsfrontera]

I hate bullies! I can safely say I have never bullied anyone in my life, nor have I ever been bullied for that matter.

Tell your nephew to pick out the biggest, loudest "ringleader" from the group, and smash them one right in the fukin face. The rest will either leg it, or stand back in amazement. I guarantee none of them will help their mate.

[dirty boy]

Sheets Tabuer said:

Obviously you have things to sort out with the school but I believe you should sent the lad to learn boxing, not only will it boost his confidence but he'll be able to put every one of them on their arse in 6 months.

He'll get all the chicks too

I had a lad at school who used to always try it on with me, it soon stopped when I put him on his arse and he actually became quite a good friend after.

Send him to boxing or a decent martial art.

I had an altercation with a bully once, I stood my ground and thought i'd done the right thing (scrapping in the school hallway between lessons)

Sadly he waited for me after school, and as I got off the bus he threatened me with a knife.

I know it's not easy, but he needs confidence in his ability to fend them off if required, but ignoring it and not lowering himself to their level will ensure they'll get bored of him not biting and move on.

A good boxing club or martial art will do wonders. He'll know within himself he could sit them on their arses if required, it'll be more a confidence issue than a physical one.

[shirt]

nothing wrong with it at all, so long as you also teach him the morality regarding the use of violence and that it should be a last resort etc.

also teach him to be sneaky. difuse he situation then get a punch in on the sly

[Jasandjules]

How old are the bullies? If over 10, can the police become involved?

As for teaching him to fight, I don't see a problem with it. Teach him that a swift flat strike to the adams apple will drop someone hard and fast...............

[james_tigerwoods]

I was bullied at school (racism and the like) and it only stopped when I showed I could stand up for myself - there comes a point where you think that saying something will make it worse then, for me anyway, I snapped and fought back. The problems stopped almost overnight.

This isn't an ideal scenario really as these days, bullying has to be "dealt with by the school" which, in this case, doesn't seem to be working - standing up to them is one thing, but he might be afraid of getting a shoeing anyway (which is a reasonable fear) - and the ringleader might fight back twice as hard (I've seen it happen).

There could be a confidence thing here that might need some work - perhaps he needs something to give him that extra boost to help him stand up to them and be sure that they won't give him more grief. Perhaps some martial art training (NOT with a view to using those lessons to sort the bullies out, but as a way of confidence building and discipline) or an equivalent alternative.

What hasn't been said - I'm not sure of the position to take here - is that if this is the second time it's happened and the school are not acting, could this be considered a criminal matter worth of being reported to the police?

However it is dealt with, it ought to be dealt with quickly otherwise there will be lasting ramifications.

[craste]

When I was about 8 I used to end up at home crying everynight due to an older boy picking on me and beating me up. Then one day when my mom had gone outside to tell him off (again) I somehow found the courage and went outside and jumped on the lad and pummelled his face in.

My mother picked me up off him (she couldn't believe it was me) and then when I went back in doors I was shaking like a leaf due to the adrenalin.

Anyway after that the lad who I beat up would knock on my door each night asking if I would come out to play - he wanted to be my friend then.

So my advice is to teach him how to smack the cruel bd as hard as he can on the end of his nose so his eyes water and then keep hitting him until he begs him to stop.

That will teach the .

[Swilly]

Give him the skills to fight and the brain to decide when to use them.

[essexplumber]

gsfrontera said:

I hate bullies! I can safely say I have never bullied anyone in my life, nor have I ever been bullied for that matter.

Tell your nephew to pick out the biggest, loudest "ringleader" from the group, and smash them one right in the fukin face. The rest will either leg it, or stand back in amazement. I guarantee none of them will help their mate.

This. I was bullied in secondary school (greasy hair, spots, st clothes, poor parents etc). If I could go back the above is exactly what I would do. I have found though that the bullies are most likely to turn out to be jobless scag heads.

[Manks]

Pagey said:

Good evening PH'ers
I'm interested to hear your general opinion on the Dilemma below:


Situation is this: I have an 11 year old nephew (my sisters child) I am, and always have been the Dad he has never had. He spends a lot of his time with me - Holidays, weekends etc, I deal with all of his schooling etc etc.

Since Christmas he has had quite a few problems with bullying at school, he has been kicked punched etcand on one occasion hit with a cricket bat - cue me hitting the roof and letting rip at the Headmaster. The school have been pretty good about keeping myself and his mum in the picture with the events and on one occasion we even had a say in the punishment

Fast forward to today - I get a call at work from the school (they couldn't get hold of his mum) Junior has been the victim of bullying in the Playground again but it has gone up another level he had a slight disagreement with another boy in his year over a ball a group of lads in the year above have the encouraged the other lad to beat him up and have obliged in tripping Junior up and bundling him to the floor and stuck the boot in and then encouraged the younger lad to do the same
He has been kicked and puched on the floor by three or four boys - this was eventually spotted by a teacher and stopped.
The Headmaster was unavailable when I got to the school so I had words with the Deputy who assures me that 'it will be dealt with' We shall see!

Junior is in a bit of a state - bruising around his eye, a couple of red marks on his back, school uniform ripped etc. Naturally he is quite upset!
It wasn't easy for me seeing him in that state, and I had an unbelievable urge to hunt the little barstewards down as they left school and kic the living ste out of them. Which I cant clearly do!


Now he didn't want to go to his mums house tonight he wants to stay at mine which is not a problem for me. Sitting playing on the Wii with him and he asks me if I will teach him to fight!!!!



He thinks if he fight back they might leave him alone


I can easily teach him to defend himself, sit someone firmly on their arse, or hurt someone. My dilemma is:

Would it be irresponsible of me to teach him to 'fight'

First off get aggressive with the school, they should have sorted this out.

But it sounds like there is SOMETHING about Junior that makes him a target for bullies and he will probably meet people elsewhere to whom he looks like prey. Getting him involved with one of the martial arts would be a good idea. It will teach him to take care of himself physically but give him the confidence not to need to and the self control to do only what is necessary.

Manks

[anonymous-user]

essexplumber said:

gsfrontera said:

I hate bullies! I can safely say I have never bullied anyone in my life, nor have I ever been bullied for that matter.

Tell your nephew to pick out the biggest, loudest "ringleader" from the group, and smash them one right in the fukin face. The rest will either leg it, or stand back in amazement. I guarantee none of them will help their mate.

This. I was bullied in secondary school (greasy hair, spots, st clothes, poor parents etc). If I could go back the above is exactly what I would do. I have found though that the bullies are most likely to turn out to be jobless scag heads.

Agreed. I was bullied at school by a gang for many many months. One evening I got one of them (the loudmouth) on his own and went mental and kicked the ste out of him (just the pent up anger of months of bullying). I was never bullied again. Typical bully will keep on doing it until they realise they might get hurt!

[MarkwG]

Personally, I'd clear it with your sister first - she's ultimately responsible, all the while he's below adult age: driving a wedge between them could cause more problems than it solves.