Convincing someone that they need help

[Smallend]

Does anyone have any advice or experience in convincing someone that they have a problem that they cannot deal with by themselves?

Consider that the person concerned has been through some extremely traumatic experiences in earlier life:

- PTSD - had therapy, but they thought it was useless and as far as they are concerned they went on to manage it themselves
- destructive relationships
- eating disorder
- at least one other very sensitive and traumatic experience

They are pushing back against the people who love them now, and they are convinced that any therapy will be useless as they will just be typecast, or 'put into a category'.

Any discussions about needing help are seen as being controlled and they are stubbornly stating that no-one else will understand them and that they are capable of dealing with this alone.

Recently, they have pushed away from the 'constants' in their life and have thrown themselves into inappropriate activities on-line. Lots of things are at stake, including children.

I think it is relevant to mention that the person concerned is female.

I would REALLY appreciate any ideas, advice, places to seek help etc. etc.
Thanks

[loltolhurst]

take them on hol for 2 weeks away from the interweb and have a few beers and discuss?

[sday12]

http://www.mind.org.uk/

Start with GP, but provision is pretty much a postcode lottery.

[Jasandjules]

Part of my advice will depend upon your relationship with them.

However at the outset I will say it is difficult to help someone who doesn't want to help themselves and doesn't admit there is a problem.

I am guessing from what you have put that they are depressed. Properly depressed, not just feeling a touch under the weather.

[Smallend]

Jasandjules said:

Part of my advice will depend upon your relationship with them.

However at the outset I will say it is difficult to help someone who doesn't want to help themselves and doesn't admit there is a problem.

I am guessing from what you have put that they are depressed. Properly depressed, not just feeling a touch under the weather.

Our relationship is a 'legal' one. Hence I have a vested interest to get this sorted for us ALL to move forward.

I agree on the depression, but also it is making things harder due to this manifesting as an addiction.

[Steve-O56]

I'm in exactly the same predicament with my other half, she's gone through several traumatic expreiences, eating disorders and is now suffering with post natal depression and severe mood swings. The only way I can describe it is like being in the house with two women, but only seeing one at a time.
Needless to say i'll be watching this thread closely

[omgus]

You can't force help on someone, as much as you would wish to.
The OH's best friend was in similar position, I know enough of her childhood and early life to know that it makes me angry and that it would cause anyone to have a few issues, she desperately needed help to deal with it but wouldn't recognise it. The issues had led to a drug addiction from and early age as it was the only way she could cope. Until she admitted she needed help she would lash out at anybody who mentioned it. Eventually there came a point just before everything fell to bits where she admitted that things had got out of hand and that the needed help. Nearly a year on and she is 7 months clean and in a much better position.

For 13 years no one managed to convince her she needed help, eventually it was her dog getting sick that tipped her over the edge. You can not convince anybody they need help until they are ready to accept it. All you can do is be there when they ask.

I hope that helps.

[Smallend]

Steve-O56 said:

I'm in exactly the same predicament with my other half, she's gone through several traumatic expreiences, eating disorders and is now suffering with post natal depression and severe mood swings. The only way I can describe it is like being in the house with two women, but only seeing one at a time.
Needless to say i'll be watching this thread closely

Steve - My thoughts are with you.

I've used the 'Jekyll and Hyde' analogy with a couple of friends. It is the hardest thing I have ever experienced.

[Jasandjules]

Smallend said:

Our relationship is a 'legal' one. Hence I have a vested interest to get this sorted for us ALL to move forward.

I agree on the depression, but also it is making things harder due to this manifesting as an addiction.

Ok, I understand.

Let me say from the outset that I have more experience of depression with loved ones than I wished I had. I also am, the more experience I have, less convinced that conventional medicine really can help in the main. I don't personally believe that tablets are the answer to such matters, they simply mask the symptoms (at best).

Also, it may help if she can accept that many, many people suffer from this kind of mental health problem and that it is not "looked down" on anymore, people are know more knowledgeable etc. In fact I think I read somewhere that 1 in 4 people suffer from mental health issues.

Without wishing to offend, are you the person who helped her through her PTSD? It is just that IME some people find it difficult to accept help from their other half. Yet if a certain friend says the exact same thing, it is accepted by that person. If I can make that more of an example to try and explain it better - my parents - I can tell them all the legal advice in the world and they don't follow it, BUT if someone else tells them the same (or at times the wrong information), they will believe it.

However, that said, I have recently become aware of a treatment which is f***ng strange, and in all honesty I would not believe it BUT I now know two people who have been very, very ill (one being totally unable to work or leave the house due to nervous exhaustion) who, within months of starting treatment, were near as damn it back to full health. It is a system call kinesiology - a quick google search finds this

http://www.hk4health.co.uk/

Which might give you more information about the treatment - it is an alternative therapy and to my mind it takes a leap of faith.

Also, what steps have you taken to try to convince her that she needs help?

[Smallend]

omgus said:

Good stuff

Thanks for this.

I have read up a LOT on this since it started, and all I'm seeing is that the individual concerned has to WANT to get help and that it will happen when something dramatic happens.

There's been so much drama over the last couple of months that I hate to think what needs to happen for reality to hit.

[ascayman]

bottom line - you cant sorry, until they realise themselves there is literally nothing you can do, i speak from experience i tried for 10 years and in the end it cost me my childhood.

Sorry to be the bearer of bad news, I wish you all the best.

[Smallend]

Jasandjules - Thanks

The PTSD was before we were married. She won't accept any help from anyone right now.
The only communicating she is doing in the 'real world' is 'transferring' the problem by blaming me for anything and everything. Then in her on-line world she is spending her time being massively inappropriate and disrespectful and effectively undermining our relationship by destroying my trust in her.

I am racking my brains to think of someone that she will listen to, but I keep drawing a blank. She stubborn at the best of times, and is now so sensitive to

Agree on not wanting to go the medication route - she is nervous of any medication and is very sensitive to it.

I will look into the kinesiology - thanks

The steps I have taken to try to convince her that she needs help are to gently talk it through basically. We've been to see a chap together once from a marital point of view. She then went alone for a 'rant'. I have been three times alone. She doesn't see any benefit of it, and in fact decided that it was making me 'controlling' as I was trying to talk about things more.

'Rock' and 'Hard place' are currently my neighbours...

[Jasandjules]

I don't think a relationship counsellor will help at all, as, from what you have put, the problem is in her head. Therefore it might be worth her while speaking to a counsellor on her own about her past? (though I will also say that I have experience of a couple of different counsellors and one I found actually informed a depressed person that they were useless - Not ideal IMHO. I don't know how to find a "good one" but IMHO a counsellor really needs to have experienced something very dramatic in their own life and overcome it so that when they say "I understand", they actually do.)

Has she pushed all her friends away as well?

[daveco]

If this person is refusing advice and blaming others then you need to be blunt with them. Half measures such as explaining to them the situation or the ramifications of their actions will only come across as childish and condescending to the recipient so just be straight with them.

[Smallend]

Jasandjules said:

I don't think a relationship counsellor will help at all, as, from what you have put, the problem is in her head. Therefore it might be worth her while speaking to a counsellor on her own about her past? (though I will also say that I have experience of a couple of different counsellors and one I found actually informed a depressed person that they were useless - Not ideal IMHO. I don't know how to find a "good one" but IMHO a counsellor really needs to have experienced something very dramatic in their own life and overcome it so that when they say "I understand", they actually do.)

Has she pushed all her friends away as well?

The guy we have been seeing actually specialises in PTSD after experiencing all sorts in his earlier life. She has said that she would need to talk to a woman, but now is refusing to talk about it.

She has pushed away the one friend who has been through similar...

[V8mate]

Divorce.

Life really is too short to spend it with people who are a drain on existence.

I realise that's not a very 'for better or worse' approach, but no-one's going to thank you for spending a major part of your life supporting a failing human once you drop, emotionally worn out, into your own grave.

[omgus]

Smallend said:

There's been so much drama over the last couple of months that I hate to think what needs to happen for reality to hit.

Strangely i have discovered that it is very often a small and easily solved problem that causes the final realisation that help is needed. I know it is of scant comfort but it is quite likely to be something like a broken tumble dryer or a dropped glass that finally does it. It is culmination of everything else that can cause even the smallest thing to be beyond the person in questions ability to deal with.
Last year my OH broke a bone her back, luckily there was no nerve damage and she has now made a nearly full recovery, she held up remarkably well under the strain and was very positive until one day she dropped a glass of lemonade and started to worry about the cat walking on the glass, suddenly everything caught up with her and she broke down. All you can do is be ready for it.

Good luck with the situation and having had a stressfull experience as a temporary career last year i will offer the advice that throughout all this you need to ensure you look after yourself. if you get stressed/despondent/depressed yourself you will find it harder to help her.

[ShadownINja]

I suppose it could be like alcoholism in that you might only take action when you hit rock bottom. I wonder (and this is not advice) if you can engineer a fake rock bottom so that someone would take responsibility for their problem and deal with it in a suitable fashion? By engineer, for instance, if it's a spouse, then threatening divorce and to take the kids by using their inability to look after themselves as a reason for the court siding with you? It is harsh but it's a rock bottom threat as every other option has been tried (and perhaps should be discussed with a close family member or friend so they know you're not being an unsupportive ahole) and as I say, it's not advice but just wondering about the impact it would have.

I suppose the complete alternative is also a possibility - they're currently in a terrible state and in need of extra comforting, love, security and support, so give more than you would normally give to such a person so they can cope with everyday life and eventually, maybe, the problem that affects your day to day life will be overcome. Maybe.

Edited by ShadownINja on Thursday 10th June 12:22

[Smallend]

V8mate said:

Divorce.

Life really is too short to spend it with people who are a drain on existence.

I realise that's not a very 'for better or worse' approach, but no-one's going to thank you for spending a major part of your life supporting a failing human once you drop, emotionally worn out, into your own grave.

Our 10 year marriage and two wonderful boys will not be thrown away over this.
These major problems have only started to manifest themselves in the last few months.
When we have a chat on a good day, we both know that we want things to work.

I appreciate that it's your opinion, but I guess we're very different. I will fight to the death to make this work, I just need to either bide my time and be supportive, or try and find some way to get help.

[Justayellowbadge]

V8mate said:

Divorce.

Life really is too short to spend it with people who are a drain on existence.

I realise that's not a very 'for better or worse' approach, but no-one's going to thank you for spending a major part of your life supporting a failing human once you drop, emotionally worn out, into your own grave.

So touchy-feely.

You'll be on telly espousing the benefits of a 'locked in' core and wrap around wings next.