HItting a wall...overtraining?

[Haggleburyfinius]

For the last 8 weeks I have been here in Thailand at Muay Thai camp.

The training is incredibly tough and I've been training between 3 and 7 hours per day (energy levels permitting), for 6 days per week.

My last week starts today but for the last few days I have barely managed more than an hour's training; today I actually feel a bit ill...tight chest, generally under the weather. I just don't want to train, frankly.

I want to blame this lethargy on this being my last week and I'm psychologically winding down; however having spoken to my brother about this, he thinks I've overtrained and have "hit a wall" (he's some fancy sports performance grad thing).

I have lost over 3 stone since i got here (a fair proportion of which is muscle as my body has adapted to MT) and my bro says this has taken too much of a toll on my body.

So what should I do?

Brave it out and risk injury/further illness

or

Relax, forget about training until I feel 100%...if that doesn't happen in the next week so be it?

If I were advising one of my own students (although it would be impossible I think for any of them to have engaged in such a schedule for so long) I would tell them their body is crying out for rest and to go to the beach for the last week.

It's a real dilemma as I'm only a short way from regaining the physique I had as a 20 year old fighter (I am 31 btw)

[Ordinary_Chap]

Sounds like you are heavily drained.

You could try vitamin C for your immune system and increasing rest if possible. If you aren't able to rest and recover then there is no shame in cutting back a little.

I've always had the mentality to push harder no matter the pain, this is useful up to a point but I continued to push and push far too hard which resulted in me suffering various injuries (I'm 32).

So in answer to your question you can try to change a few things but listen to your body and if you've had enough then do not continue to train as its clearly not good for your body.

[Haggleburyfinius]

Well I started feeling a bit drained about two weeks ago but mental strength got me through.

I did nothing yesterday and nothing today either...it's just so hard when I can hear the thwack thwack of the pads whilst lying on my bed :-)

I've done over 200hours of training in the last 8 weeks which is probably too much.

If I was home I wouldn't really care; I'd just rest till i felt better then get cracking again.

Thanks for the advice, vit C wise; hadn't even thought about a vitamin deficiency!

[ewenm]

It does sound like over-training/exhaustion to me. Can you use this final week of the camp as a consolidation week? So recovering from the previous weeks of training, and planning how you're going to continue training after the camp, so that when you go home you can get straight into a structured routine to achieve your goals (that final bit to get back to the 20-y-o you for example!).

If you go home knackered, it's possible you'll just fall back into bad habits and lose everything you've gained in the camp. If you go home recovered and motivated, that should be less likely.

[Hoofy]

What OC said. It's not a lack of vitamins. Your body has been put under severe stress. Your immunity is low. If you push much more, you might survive the course but when you come back, you could come down with the flu, some infection or worse.

My cousin doesn't listen to his body and trains hard and plays hard. He's had pneumonia twice.

[Ordinary_Chap]

Hoofy said:

What OC said. It's not a lack of vitamins. Your body has been put under severe stress. Your immunity is low. If you push much more, you might survive the course but when you come back, you could come down with the flu, some infection or worse.

My cousin doesn't listen to his body and trains hard and plays hard. He's had pneumonia twice.

I have the same problem with weight lifting.

If I push very hard for a few weeks if I don't take vitamin C I often start getting ill, suffer throbbing gums and other problems.

Vitamin C seems to do the trick for me but even with it I often feel on the edge of what my body can cope with.

Its worth trying I guess, but other than that more rest and more food.

Lee

[mattikake]

Yep to the above. I used to do Muay Thai years ago and it is hard (and on bones, bone brusing, toughness mostly I found, but each has their own weaknesses!) although I wasn't mad enough to do it on a boot camp!

I will add that you need to consider in addition to Vit C, Vits D, E, Omega-3 and L-Glutamine supplements/food sources to speed your recovery. Exhaustion may well have set in because you weren't getting quite enough of these and you've exhausted your stores (muscle wastage for Glutamine, bones for Vit D etc.)

[Hoofy]

Ordinary_Chap said:

I have the same problem with weight lifting.

If I push very hard for a few weeks if I don't take vitamin C I often start getting ill, suffer throbbing gums and other problems.

Vitamin C seems to do the trick for me but even with it I often feel on the edge of what my body can cope with.

Its worth trying I guess, but other than that more rest and more food.

Lee

Yep. I recognise early signs when I feel I'm dragging myself around and using willpower to keep moving (and I don't mean just during training).

[Haggleburyfinius]

ewenm said:

It does sound like over-training/exhaustion to me. Can you use this final week of the camp as a consolidation week? So recovering from the previous weeks of training, and planning how you're going to continue training after the camp, so that when you go home you can get straight into a structured routine to achieve your goals (that final bit to get back to the 20-y-o you for example!).

If you go home knackered, it's possible you'll just fall back into bad habits and lose everything you've gained in the camp. If you go home recovered and motivated, that should be less likely.

That's not a bad idea...right now I just cannot even contemplate getting changed for a session let alone actually doing it

Your last paragraph is very poignant; the main reason I came here was for that "last roll of the dice" thing...I realise that my physical peak has probably been in the recent past and just wanted to prove to myself that I could still hack it really.

I did try and get a fight arranged (first time in the ring in many years competitively) but there was nobody on Phuket to be matched against; I'm way, way too big for the Thais and 99% of the newbs here are newbs. I'm sorta glad now as I'd have scheduled it for my last weekend haha.

[Haggleburyfinius]

Hoofy said:

What OC said. It's not a lack of vitamins. Your body has been put under severe stress. Your immunity is low. If you push much more, you might survive the course but when you come back, you could come down with the flu, some infection or worse.

My cousin doesn't listen to his body and trains hard and plays hard. He's had pneumonia twice.

Yup. I feel like I'm on the verge of coming down with something now.

[Haggleburyfinius]

Ordinary_Chap said:

I have the same problem with weight lifting.

If I push very hard for a few weeks if I don't take vitamin C I often start getting ill, suffer throbbing gums and other problems.

Vitamin C seems to do the trick for me but even with it I often feel on the edge of what my body can cope with.

Its worth trying I guess, but other than that more rest and more food.

Lee

I did a 10 week intense strength gaining routine before I left for here as I knew my body would want to shed some via the training here.

I was training with a coach 2 hours per day, 5 days per week and just before Christmas I got really ill. Couldn't do anything for 2 weeks.

History is repeating itself!

[Haggleburyfinius]

mattikake said:

Yep to the above. I used to do Muay Thai years ago and it is hard (and on bones, bone brusing, toughness mostly I found, but each has their own weaknesses!) although I wasn't mad enough to do it on a boot camp!

I will add that you need to consider in addition to Vit C, Vits D, E, Omega-3 and L-Glutamine supplements/food sources to speed your recovery. Exhaustion may well have set in because you weren't getting quite enough of these and you've exhausted your stores (muscle wastage for Glutamine, bones for Vit D etc.)

Thankfully, I have trained kickboxing my whole life and work in the industry now so the bruises and bone bashing hasn't really been noticeable.

I suspect you are definitely right re food stuffs. I'm gonna pop down to boots for some tablets.

[Haggleburyfinius]

Ok....thanks for the input guys.

You've really all just confirmed what I really knew...I'm knackered and need a rest!

I bet this is a how long is a piece of string question, but if I take another 3 days off making 5 in total will I be ok?

Or should I just go find a nice beach and chill till I go home?

[Ordinary_Chap]

Haggleburyfinius said:

Ok....thanks for the input guys.

You've really all just confirmed what I really knew...I'm knackered and need a rest!

I bet this is a how long is a piece of string question, but if I take another 3 days off making 5 in total will I be ok?

Or should I just go find a nice beach and chill till I go home?

Only you can answer that question, we all recover at different rates. My recovery tends to be quite slow compared to others I train with for instance.

You'll just have to see how you get on.

Lee

[Haggleburyfinius]

Ordinary_Chap said:

Only you can answer that question, we all recover at different rates. My recovery tends to be quite slow compared to others I train with for instance.

You'll just have to see how you get on.

Lee

Damn you!!

(another answer I really knew but wanted everyone to say "no, no, you'll be fine by Monday")

[Hoofy]

Oh, try zinc tablets as well, as they boost your immunity. Perhaps if you sleep until you just wake up, you might recover quicker.

[Haggleburyfinius]

Hoofy said:

Oh, try zinc tablets as well, as they boost your immunity. Perhaps if you sleep until you just wake up, you might recover quicker.

Added to the list

[Regiment]

If this is your last week, take it easy and enjoy the last few days. It does sound like over training and that your body hasn't had the necessary sustenance to sustain it through the 8 weeks, next time you know to eat more. Food is cheap and if you go to the right places can be very good so eat as much as you're comfortable with but 3 stone in 2 month is a massive amount of weight loss, you'll probably have lost a good bit of muscle/strength doing it but Itll soon get put back on.

Who's camp are you at over in Thailand?

[Haggleburyfinius]

Regiment said:

If this is your last week, take it easy and enjoy the last few days. It does sound like over training and that your body hasn't had the necessary sustenance to sustain it through the 8 weeks, next time you know to eat more. Food is cheap and if you go to the right places can be very good so eat as much as you're comfortable with but 3 stone in 2 month is a massive amount of weight loss, you'll probably have lost a good bit of muscle/strength doing it but Itll soon get put back on.

Who's camp are you at over in Thailand?

It's called Sumalee Boxing Gym. British owned which is a godsend. Nice hotel standard rooms and relatively well run compared to the Thai owned camps.

[Regiment]

Looks like a good camp, I trained at Sinbi which southern Phuket. Looks like there is only one Thai trainer, thought it'd be more with some foreigners wanting the genuine experience. Did you manage to get over to the stadium and see any fights?