Vaping & medical opinion.
Discussion
Big Al, I'm not extracting the urine, I'm after medical opinions rather than brand and liquid stuff, I think I'm more likely to get that here than trying to go through 365 pages of the lounge thread.
The good people of the health forum.
As per the locked post really, what is the medical opinion of these things ?
It seems really odd that the people questioning me are much more interested in am I using an electronic ciggy than the real things.
The good people of the health forum.
As per the locked post really, what is the medical opinion of these things ?
It seems really odd that the people questioning me are much more interested in am I using an electronic ciggy than the real things.
Nigel Worc's said:
Big Al, I'm not extracting the urine, I'm after medical opinions rather than brand and liquid stuff, I think I'm more likely to get that here than trying to go through 365 pages of the lounge thread.
The good people of the health forum.
As per the locked post really, what is the medical opinion of these things ?
It seems really odd that the people questioning me are much more interested in am I using an electronic ciggy than the real things.
Evening Nigel,The good people of the health forum.
As per the locked post really, what is the medical opinion of these things ?
It seems really odd that the people questioning me are much more interested in am I using an electronic ciggy than the real things.
I gave up smoking some Thirty years so. So I can understand something of the dilemma but not really have up to date experience.
Seems to me that one tobacco cigarette is very bad, two are a diaster and from thereon it goes very rapidly and very steeply downhill. Cigarette smoking is definitely not good for your health. My father smoked 100 Senior Service/Capstan Full Strength a day for some 50 odd (he was odd, but charming) a day, stopped at once when he had his first heart attack on the advice of the Cardiologist (which I thought woukd definitely kill him) and lived a very happy life fit more than 20 years and died if old age at 80. I stopped dead about thirty years ago now when first diagnosed as Diabetic. Doctors advice (correctly) again.
Electronic cigarettes are definitely not as bad for you but there do seem to be some issues regarding their affect on health. But definitely better than tobacco which really is bad news. Therefore I would suggest electronic cigarettes are definitely not as bad for you. Still fairly expensive and still better to quit altogether.
But as I know from bitter experience being by nature on the autistic spectrum and batty as a fruitcake and compulsive/obsessive and umpteen other things we can only do what we can do.
I would suggest that is what you do. Good luck.
Many thanks Steffan.
Like yourself I'm diabetic, the breathing issues are something else though, quite sudden and very unexpected (by me at least).
I'm going to give the e-ciggy a go and see if that weans me off tobacco, although I'm one of those odd ball cases that actually likes smoking.
I've done some "googling" and haven't come up with why they are so interested in these e-ciggys, I was expecting something similar in the way of reports to those "tobacco teabag things" you may remember, I think they were called skolls or something like that.
My GP is at a loss as to the interest, he couldn't imagine they'd be any worse than the real thing.
Like yourself I'm diabetic, the breathing issues are something else though, quite sudden and very unexpected (by me at least).
I'm going to give the e-ciggy a go and see if that weans me off tobacco, although I'm one of those odd ball cases that actually likes smoking.
I've done some "googling" and haven't come up with why they are so interested in these e-ciggys, I was expecting something similar in the way of reports to those "tobacco teabag things" you may remember, I think they were called skolls or something like that.
My GP is at a loss as to the interest, he couldn't imagine they'd be any worse than the real thing.
Op,
Pretty simple.
Smoking is bad.
Vaping* is less bad**.
Smoking e- cigs is worse than not doing any of the above.
k. You know you're only trying to justify your habit to yourselves.
Pretty simple.
Smoking is bad.
Vaping* is less bad**.
Smoking e- cigs is worse than not doing any of the above.
* vaping is an utterly gay term. That makes it bad in itself.
Ps - i'm out before the e-cig vigilatntes even start. If you want to quit, quit. If you are not man enough to quit, vape if you want. Just don't pretend the adverts aren't aimed at kids, or that sucking on some sort of anodised small biro tab thing isn't utterly w- they think. No long term studies have been done because well the term isn't long enough. Also, it's a fairly unregulated market - what chemicals are actuaully in fruit / peppermint / bacon and egg flavour "juice"?
k. You know you're only trying to justify your habit to yourselves.Some Gump said:
Op,
Pretty simple.
Smoking is bad.
Vaping* is less bad**.
Smoking e- cigs is worse than not doing any of the above.
k. You know you're only trying to justify your habit to yourselves.
Thank you, but I almost have no idea what you're on about. Pretty simple.
Smoking is bad.
Vaping* is less bad**.
Smoking e- cigs is worse than not doing any of the above.
* vaping is an utterly gay term. That makes it bad in itself.
Ps - i'm out before the e-cig vigilatntes even start. If you want to quit, quit. If you are not man enough to quit, vape if you want. Just don't pretend the adverts aren't aimed at kids, or that sucking on some sort of anodised small biro tab thing isn't utterly w- they think. No long term studies have been done because well the term isn't long enough. Also, it's a fairly unregulated market - what chemicals are actuaully in fruit / peppermint / bacon and egg flavour "juice"?
k. You know you're only trying to justify your habit to yourselves.I've seen no adverts, aimed at children or otherwise, and I'm 54, so a tad over the 16 needed.
Nigel Worc's said:
Many thanks Steffan.
Like yourself I'm diabetic, the breathing issues are something else though, quite sudden and very unexpected (by me at least).
I'm going to give the e-ciggy a go and see if that weans me off tobacco, although I'm one of those odd ball cases that actually likes smoking.
I've done some "googling" and haven't come up with why they are so interested in these e-ciggys, I was expecting something similar in the way of reports to those "tobacco teabag things" you may remember, I think they were called skolls or something like that.
My GP is at a loss as to the interest, he couldn't imagine they'd be any worse than the real thing.
Every individual is entitled to live ther lives in the manner they wish to live their lives, IMO. Your choice, as are the consequences. I have been a madcap volupturian since i discovered what being a volupturian offerred. However post Diabetes diagnosis I have made strenuous efforts to lose weight (was 25 stone+) now around 13st 7 lbs. I also stopped smoking. Never smoked again. Too many risks IMO. Some you can remove with a change of approach. Not easy but very beneficial.Like yourself I'm diabetic, the breathing issues are something else though, quite sudden and very unexpected (by me at least).
I'm going to give the e-ciggy a go and see if that weans me off tobacco, although I'm one of those odd ball cases that actually likes smoking.
I've done some "googling" and haven't come up with why they are so interested in these e-ciggys, I was expecting something similar in the way of reports to those "tobacco teabag things" you may remember, I think they were called skolls or something like that.
My GP is at a loss as to the interest, he couldn't imagine they'd be any worse than the real thing.
I still do some really stupid things and I still take excessive risks in business. Nature of the animal in me. In fact even I cannot believe how stupid and selfish I can be so easily. But I can. I am not in any sense a paragon of virtue. Nor woukd I want to be!
I suggest respectfully that since you already have the heightened risk to health associated with Type 2 Duabetes that smoking is really bad news for your health? I would respectfully suggest no Doctor will disagree with that suggestion. Personally I would stop smoking altogether. But it is your life and your choice. I do wish you well with whatever you decide.
Edited by Steffan on Wednesday 5th August 00:45
Sorry for the lack of reply Steffan, I've just been busy at work.
I'm going to use this e-cig for a bit I think.
It is strange but I actually don't want to stop smoking, and in the few days I've been using the e-cog instead of smoking tobacco I feel much better, not completely, but a lot.
I've been nagged into trying to give up in the past, and it doesn't work for me.
I'm going to use it as a way of stopping (hopefully). I'm currently using the 18mg liquid (the top 24mg as way too strong for me, even though I'd class myself as a heavy smoker). The next bottle I'll buy will be the 12 mg, then the 6 mg, and hopefully I'll stop after that, if not I'm guessing the effects of what I'm doing will be much reduced over smoking tobacco.
I just can't seem to find any information on e-cigs regarding the health benefits or not, like those skols that were available in the 1970s (if you remember them), the effects of the e-cig could actually be worse, although it doesn't feel that way to me at the moment.
From the lack of response on here, the health forum, I'd guess people don't really know, as they'd have said by now.
I do admire how you just stopped by the way.
Best Regards.
I'm going to use this e-cig for a bit I think.
It is strange but I actually don't want to stop smoking, and in the few days I've been using the e-cog instead of smoking tobacco I feel much better, not completely, but a lot.
I've been nagged into trying to give up in the past, and it doesn't work for me.
I'm going to use it as a way of stopping (hopefully). I'm currently using the 18mg liquid (the top 24mg as way too strong for me, even though I'd class myself as a heavy smoker). The next bottle I'll buy will be the 12 mg, then the 6 mg, and hopefully I'll stop after that, if not I'm guessing the effects of what I'm doing will be much reduced over smoking tobacco.
I just can't seem to find any information on e-cigs regarding the health benefits or not, like those skols that were available in the 1970s (if you remember them), the effects of the e-cig could actually be worse, although it doesn't feel that way to me at the moment.
From the lack of response on here, the health forum, I'd guess people don't really know, as they'd have said by now.
I do admire how you just stopped by the way.
Best Regards.
Nigel Worc's said:
Sorry for the lack of reply Steffan, I've just been busy at work.
I'm going to use this e-cig for a bit I think.
It is strange but I actually don't want to stop smoking, and in the few days I've been using the e-cog instead of smoking tobacco I feel much better, not completely, but a lot.
I've been nagged into trying to give up in the past, and it doesn't work for me.
I'm going to use it as a way of stopping (hopefully). I'm currently using the 18mg liquid (the top 24mg as way too strong for me, even though I'd class myself as a heavy smoker). The next bottle I'll buy will be the 12 mg, then the 6 mg, and hopefully I'll stop after that, if not I'm guessing the effects of what I'm doing will be much reduced over smoking tobacco.
I just can't seem to find any information on e-cigs regarding the health benefits or not, like those skols that were available in the 1970s (if you remember them), the effects of the e-cig could actually be worse, although it doesn't feel that way to me at the moment.
From the lack of response on here, the health forum, I'd guess people don't really know, as they'd have said by now.
I do admire how you just stopped by the way.
Best Regards.
I am compulsive/obsessive by nature and on the Austic spectrum which explains many of the lunatic disasters I have enjoyed throughout my life so far. I have also lost 12 stone 8 lbs over the last twenty years. I was 25 stone 7lbs now 12 stone 7lbs. Again being omulisive obseeive undoubtedly made it easer. I can and do concentrate on doing something to the exclusion of all else. We can only do what we can do and I do wish you well. Stick with it!!I'm going to use this e-cig for a bit I think.
It is strange but I actually don't want to stop smoking, and in the few days I've been using the e-cog instead of smoking tobacco I feel much better, not completely, but a lot.
I've been nagged into trying to give up in the past, and it doesn't work for me.
I'm going to use it as a way of stopping (hopefully). I'm currently using the 18mg liquid (the top 24mg as way too strong for me, even though I'd class myself as a heavy smoker). The next bottle I'll buy will be the 12 mg, then the 6 mg, and hopefully I'll stop after that, if not I'm guessing the effects of what I'm doing will be much reduced over smoking tobacco.
I just can't seem to find any information on e-cigs regarding the health benefits or not, like those skols that were available in the 1970s (if you remember them), the effects of the e-cig could actually be worse, although it doesn't feel that way to me at the moment.
From the lack of response on here, the health forum, I'd guess people don't really know, as they'd have said by now.
I do admire how you just stopped by the way.
Best Regards.
Nigel Worc's said:
although I'm one of those odd ball cases that actually likes smoking.
No one actually enjoys smoking they just think they do.Try reading the Alan Carr book - you have nothing to lose as you can even smoke whilst reading it - it will change the way you think about smoking. I was a relative light weight at 10 years of 20 a day, my uncle was 40 a day man for at least 30 years. We both found it very easy to stop after reading the book.
I apologise for taking the thread on a brief tangent!
My Dr fiancee says health wise they're better than smoking.
Slightly O/T - As a secondary school teacher I hate them, they're the new cool thing to have for teenagers but incredibly easy to get hold of and apparently far more addictive, not to mention marketed at the younger generation a lot.
Slightly O/T - As a secondary school teacher I hate them, they're the new cool thing to have for teenagers but incredibly easy to get hold of and apparently far more addictive, not to mention marketed at the younger generation a lot.
As a toxicologist by trade I think e-cigs are on the whole pretty good, the main ingredients (propylene glycol, glycerine and nicotine) are all inocuous in the concentrations used and most UK suppliers use pharma grade ingredients for this part of the formulation.
Prop glycol is used in a large number of pharmaceutical delivery systems including nebulisers and it would be pretty difficult to inhale a toxic dose via an ecig. Although you may experience a little gastro intestinal upset as a side effect of prop glycol exposure (can make you a bit gurgly and farty down there).
Glycerine again very low tox, however there has been one case report of lipoid pneumonia in a user due to the sheer volume inhaled, which cleared once use was stopped. Must have been hammering that ecig.
Nicotine, yes very toxic compound but it's all about the dose. My one warning would be for high strength users and DIY liquid makers to be very careful with the liquids as nicotine is readily absorbed through the skin.
My biggest concern with the whole ecig thing is the flavourings, the vast majority of them have not been tested or approved for administration via inhalation. Most of the flavouring suppliers are in the USA and the stuff they supply has the GRAS (Generally Recognised as Safe) notification, which translates to 'a reasonable certainty in the minds of competent scientists that the substance is not harmful under the intended conditions of use', intended use is via oral administration and potentially different concentrations. The definition in my mind is all a bit vague and woolly.
Other than that there are potential breakdown products if the coils on the ecig get too hot, namely formaldehyde, acrolein & acetaldehyde. HOWEVER your taste buds will scream blue murder if there's any acrolein formed as it tastes foul and there has yet to be any definitive evidence that a correctly operated ecig will produce concentrations of formaldehyde which will be hazardous to health.
Any questions feel free to shout, I've been looking at these things for quite a while now.
Prop glycol is used in a large number of pharmaceutical delivery systems including nebulisers and it would be pretty difficult to inhale a toxic dose via an ecig. Although you may experience a little gastro intestinal upset as a side effect of prop glycol exposure (can make you a bit gurgly and farty down there).
Glycerine again very low tox, however there has been one case report of lipoid pneumonia in a user due to the sheer volume inhaled, which cleared once use was stopped. Must have been hammering that ecig.
Nicotine, yes very toxic compound but it's all about the dose. My one warning would be for high strength users and DIY liquid makers to be very careful with the liquids as nicotine is readily absorbed through the skin.
My biggest concern with the whole ecig thing is the flavourings, the vast majority of them have not been tested or approved for administration via inhalation. Most of the flavouring suppliers are in the USA and the stuff they supply has the GRAS (Generally Recognised as Safe) notification, which translates to 'a reasonable certainty in the minds of competent scientists that the substance is not harmful under the intended conditions of use', intended use is via oral administration and potentially different concentrations. The definition in my mind is all a bit vague and woolly.
Other than that there are potential breakdown products if the coils on the ecig get too hot, namely formaldehyde, acrolein & acetaldehyde. HOWEVER your taste buds will scream blue murder if there's any acrolein formed as it tastes foul and there has yet to be any definitive evidence that a correctly operated ecig will produce concentrations of formaldehyde which will be hazardous to health.
Any questions feel free to shout, I've been looking at these things for quite a while now.
Limeymk1 said:
As a toxicologist by trade I think e-cigs are on the whole pretty good, the main ingredients (propylene glycol, glycerine and nicotine) are all inocuous in the concentrations used and most UK suppliers use pharma grade ingredients for this part of the formulation.
Prop glycol is used in a large number of pharmaceutical delivery systems including nebulisers and it would be pretty difficult to inhale a toxic dose via an ecig. Although you may experience a little gastro intestinal upset as a side effect of prop glycol exposure (can make you a bit gurgly and farty down there).
Glycerine again very low tox, however there has been one case report of lipoid pneumonia in a user due to the sheer volume inhaled, which cleared once use was stopped. Must have been hammering that ecig.
Nicotine, yes very toxic compound but it's all about the dose. My one warning would be for high strength users and DIY liquid makers to be very careful with the liquids as nicotine is readily absorbed through the skin.
My biggest concern with the whole ecig thing is the flavourings, the vast majority of them have not been tested or approved for administration via inhalation. Most of the flavouring suppliers are in the USA and the stuff they supply has the GRAS (Generally Recognised as Safe) notification, which translates to 'a reasonable certainty in the minds of competent scientists that the substance is not harmful under the intended conditions of use', intended use is via oral administration and potentially different concentrations. The definition in my mind is all a bit vague and woolly.
Other than that there are potential breakdown products if the coils on the ecig get too hot, namely formaldehyde, acrolein & acetaldehyde. HOWEVER your taste buds will scream blue murder if there's any acrolein formed as it tastes foul and there has yet to be any definitive evidence that a correctly operated ecig will produce concentrations of formaldehyde which will be hazardous to health.
Any questions feel free to shout, I've been looking at these things for quite a while now.
Interesting, informed opinion.Prop glycol is used in a large number of pharmaceutical delivery systems including nebulisers and it would be pretty difficult to inhale a toxic dose via an ecig. Although you may experience a little gastro intestinal upset as a side effect of prop glycol exposure (can make you a bit gurgly and farty down there).
Glycerine again very low tox, however there has been one case report of lipoid pneumonia in a user due to the sheer volume inhaled, which cleared once use was stopped. Must have been hammering that ecig.
Nicotine, yes very toxic compound but it's all about the dose. My one warning would be for high strength users and DIY liquid makers to be very careful with the liquids as nicotine is readily absorbed through the skin.
My biggest concern with the whole ecig thing is the flavourings, the vast majority of them have not been tested or approved for administration via inhalation. Most of the flavouring suppliers are in the USA and the stuff they supply has the GRAS (Generally Recognised as Safe) notification, which translates to 'a reasonable certainty in the minds of competent scientists that the substance is not harmful under the intended conditions of use', intended use is via oral administration and potentially different concentrations. The definition in my mind is all a bit vague and woolly.
Other than that there are potential breakdown products if the coils on the ecig get too hot, namely formaldehyde, acrolein & acetaldehyde. HOWEVER your taste buds will scream blue murder if there's any acrolein formed as it tastes foul and there has yet to be any definitive evidence that a correctly operated ecig will produce concentrations of formaldehyde which will be hazardous to health.
Any questions feel free to shout, I've been looking at these things for quite a while now.
I gave up smoking 40 a day 30 years ago because I became diabetic (at 25+stone!, then!) and I realised this combination was seriously stupid. Never smoked ever since. Absolutely loved smoking but I also like living.
Subsequently over the years I have addressed my weight (with difficulty) with excercse and sensible eating. It does take some time to effect long term serious changes to lifestyes. Now down to 13 stone 5 pounds and I have now given up all the Dabetes medication. On medical advice.
I no longer take Metphormin three times a day and Gliclizide twice. No need to. Sugar leves never exceed 5 in blood tests! As ny consultant reminds me, that is quite exceptional and my good fortune. Took that combination forever 30 years, now no longer need to do so.
I am a compulsive obsessive individual and on the autistic spectrum. Once I make up my mind to stop something I can and do. However I coud do a PHD in procrastination and self justification. Entirely up to each individual how they live their lives. But there are aways consequences to any excess. Up to you!
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