Cheaper Fuel - Veg Oil and Bio-Diesel

[dontlift]

OK guys for those of us running diesel motors there is hope....

I have been experimenting with producing my own fuel - namely bio-diesel (and yes before anyone says it yes i do have the correct paperwork from HM Customs & Excise)

So far I have tried:

25/75 Veg Oil / Standard Diesel (didnt notice anything different)
50/50 Veg Oil / Standard Diesel (van runs a treat)
75/25 Veg Oil / Standard Diesel (OOOh she doesnt like cold starts on that - but runs great)

I am now playing with various mixes for genuine bio-diesel i.e. no standard diesel - made with pure rape seed oil.... + plus a couple of addatives and alot of stirring

So far i reckon i can get it down to a mix at around 66p a litre duty paid (yes there is 27.1p duty per litre to pay even on pure rapeseed oil based fuels)

We are also looking at plant facilites for mass production once the mix etc is sorted out.

I guess the question is that if we could get the mix right at the right price, would people be willing to put it in their diesel motors --- we are thinking delivery service either in 20litre drums (keep in mind that bio-diesel doesnt smell like traditional diesel) or pumped straight into your motor from our delivery truck - no more waiting at the pumps let the pump come to you........

Any thoughts

>>> Edited by dontlift on Saturday 4th September 01:14

[Pigeon]

By "couple of additives and a lot of stirring" do you mean transesterification? Or just purifying/drying/thinning?

[dontlift]

Pigeon said:

By "couple of additives and a lot of stirring" do you mean transesterification? Or just purifying/drying/thinning?

Essentially bio-diesel grade methanol plus a catalyst added to the oil to make true bio-deisel, it also has to be washed and dried to removed what is essentially soap from the mix (makes great pressure washer detergent)

>> Edited by dontlift on Saturday 4th September 01:50

[cptsideways]

Let me know if you need sources for plant etc, my line of work is vessels & process plant, happy to help.

Having my contacts it would be fairly to easy to build a mini plant set up in a garden shed, enough to supply the avaerage 2 family car for a year.

[atom290]

Doesnt heating oil work?

This can be bought extremely cheap about 8p per litre

[XM5ER]

From a delivery truck I would probably buy (500miles to a tank from the golf), in drums I would think twice.

I was born in a chippy, the smell would be like coming home.

[gopher]

I would certainly consider it, does the cost you predict also include distribution?

[dontlift]

Yes cost would include distribution (within reason) and no it doesnt smell like a chippy because we use new oil, smells more like popcorn - just makes me hungry when i am driving..

You can indeed use heating oil etc, however you still need to pay duty and you will need to do work to your engine as they dont like stopping or starting on anything but diesel, properly made bio-diesel, or a mix of diesel and oil

>> Edited by dontlift on Saturday 4th September 14:36

[thebluemonkey]

Would it make a warranty void ?

[dontlift]

thebluemonkey said:

Would it make a warranty void ?

Interesting point, i am guessing you would have to check with your warranty but given that in some places it is sold as a pump fuel then i would have thought not.

[glocko]

Always thought you were a bit lardy Patrick!!!

[dontlift]

glocko said:

Always thought you were a bit lardy Patrick!!!

Naff off Glocko

[Mr2Mike]

atom290 said:

Doesnt heating oil work? This can be bought extremely cheap about 8p per litre

My cousin had a ZX TD that he used to run by stealing heating oil from his folks central heating tank. It did run, but it poured out white smoke when the engine was cold.

[dontlift]

The worst of it all is that the duty is actually higher on the nice clean burning sustainable veggie oil based fuel than on LPG which is not sustainable..

Of course the government are absolutely in this for the environment it is not at all about ripping off diesel motor users.

A study done in N.I. a couple of years back concluded that large scale bio-diesel processing would only be profitable / cost effective if the duty was lowered to a sane and sensible level

[wanty1974]

I would use it for the bouncy castle van - we would probably use it as a selling point! (Popcorn extra)

[Nighthawk]

Bosch, Delphi and Ford will all void warranty on fuel injection components is more than 5% of bio diesel or this newer emulsion/diesel fuel is used in the system.

[towman]

My suggestion..... Truckies will make the biggest savings. Find someone with a big fleet of older trucks (i.e.no warranty problems) and let them try it. They will do more miles very quickly and will be able to spot any side effects quicker.

Steve

[dontlift]

towman said:

My suggestion..... Truckies will make the biggest savings. Find someone with a big fleet of older trucks (i.e.no warranty problems) and let them try it. They will do more miles very quickly and will be able to spot any side effects quicker. Steve

Already on that with a local fleet signed up

[mcspreader]

As a graduate chemist I am somewhat suspect as to the claims herein.
1. Transasterification of rape oil (scrap or not) is an endothermic process therby using energy at cost to convert rape oil to either RME (Rape Metyl Ester) or REE (Rape Ethyl Ester) using Methanol or Ethanol respectively.
2. The cost of recovering used rape oil is not insignificant. Filters for particulates. Ion exchange towers to remove acids etc. (Water washing in industrial volumes is illegal!) These MUST be done before chemical processes take place or PHUT.
3. I HAVE TRIED LOW ENERGY(that is slow speed transesterification without adding energy) AND I CANT MAKE IT WORK. I've used catalytic systems which are not available off the shelf and it DOES NOT WORK.
There is not a free way!

The solution is to have a modern high performance Diesel engine designed to run on natural rape oil.(Unestered)
The Companies can do it in trice.
BUT DO THEY WANT TO?
I doubt it!
They make money from killing the globe.
Support your local rape farmer .
Say no no no to OIL!

[dontlift]

The other answer to this of course is to do a small amount of conversion work on the engine to make it stop and start from diesel - but run pure rape the rest of the time

>> Edited by dontlift on Sunday 5th September 05:51