Car buying advice (NOT "What Car?")!
Discussion
Chaps,
I need the full weight of PH advice on this one.
Situation.
I am looking for a new car. I have found a nice Porsche 944 S2. It is the right colour (blue metallic), has the right interior (white leather) and I have seen it and driven it. It has had all the right things done to it, and I think I trust the guy selling it - he seems as straight as any car seller I have come across.
That's the good bit.
Bad bits ... it is on eBay, and the auction ends on Wednesday, at around 9.30pm. The guy selling it would (I think) take what I am offering (£6k) to take it off eBay and sell it as a private sale. BUT, he (very reasonably) wants to know sooner rather than later if he is going to have to take it off eBay, so I will need to tell him by tomorrow evening (Tuesday evening.)
So, I need to make my mind up quickly.
Problem? This is the first example I have seen, and I heed the advice not to buy the first car you look at. I would also very much like to have a professional inspection by a porsche expert, and given the timescales I can't do this.
So, I would be buying blind. Not totally blind - I have looked quite closely at the car, and it all seems to be as the seller says. But, as this is the first such example I have seen, I don't really know a best-of-breed from a dog. The price (£6k) is a good one - more than I think the chap would get on eBay, but less than similar examples would get on the open market. The service history is all as it should be, and he has every invoice for all the work done on the car, in very tidy binders. It all smacks of fastidious ownership.
The seller is a bit coy about why he is selling. He says he is selling "for personal reasons", but won't elaborate. Why is this suspect? Because he has footed about £3.5k of bills in the 2.5 years since he bought the car, and it *should* place the car in good stead for a good few miles to come. This makes me start to think "has he been told that something is on the way out - something with a big bill?" I have nothing to suggest this, it's just a thought.
(For those who know 944's - it has had the belts done, and has also had two new cams in the last 10k miles. This equates to a lot of money, and for a car of this spec - colour and leather - and having had this work, it is a good price, compared to others that I have seen advertised.)
I have agreed to let him know my decision by tomorrow evening. I have the details of the last place to service the car, so will call them tomorrow and ask what they know of the car. If they say it really is a good example, I'll ask to see it again tomorrow, and take Mrs zcacogp.
All advice welcomed. One one side, it looks like a good price, for a good car. As a good example, I don't want to let it get away. I am attracted by the work that has been done to it. Against it, I would be buying a car that I don't know much about, in a rush - I would be buying the first one I have seen.
Does anyone have any wise words?
FWIW, the eBay link is here:
http://cgi.ebay.co.uk/ws/eBayISAPI.dl
(No, that's not an invite for everyone to bid to put the price up, thanks!)
Oli.
I need the full weight of PH advice on this one.
Situation.
I am looking for a new car. I have found a nice Porsche 944 S2. It is the right colour (blue metallic), has the right interior (white leather) and I have seen it and driven it. It has had all the right things done to it, and I think I trust the guy selling it - he seems as straight as any car seller I have come across.
That's the good bit.
Bad bits ... it is on eBay, and the auction ends on Wednesday, at around 9.30pm. The guy selling it would (I think) take what I am offering (£6k) to take it off eBay and sell it as a private sale. BUT, he (very reasonably) wants to know sooner rather than later if he is going to have to take it off eBay, so I will need to tell him by tomorrow evening (Tuesday evening.)
So, I need to make my mind up quickly.
Problem? This is the first example I have seen, and I heed the advice not to buy the first car you look at. I would also very much like to have a professional inspection by a porsche expert, and given the timescales I can't do this.
So, I would be buying blind. Not totally blind - I have looked quite closely at the car, and it all seems to be as the seller says. But, as this is the first such example I have seen, I don't really know a best-of-breed from a dog. The price (£6k) is a good one - more than I think the chap would get on eBay, but less than similar examples would get on the open market. The service history is all as it should be, and he has every invoice for all the work done on the car, in very tidy binders. It all smacks of fastidious ownership.
The seller is a bit coy about why he is selling. He says he is selling "for personal reasons", but won't elaborate. Why is this suspect? Because he has footed about £3.5k of bills in the 2.5 years since he bought the car, and it *should* place the car in good stead for a good few miles to come. This makes me start to think "has he been told that something is on the way out - something with a big bill?" I have nothing to suggest this, it's just a thought.
(For those who know 944's - it has had the belts done, and has also had two new cams in the last 10k miles. This equates to a lot of money, and for a car of this spec - colour and leather - and having had this work, it is a good price, compared to others that I have seen advertised.)
I have agreed to let him know my decision by tomorrow evening. I have the details of the last place to service the car, so will call them tomorrow and ask what they know of the car. If they say it really is a good example, I'll ask to see it again tomorrow, and take Mrs zcacogp.
All advice welcomed. One one side, it looks like a good price, for a good car. As a good example, I don't want to let it get away. I am attracted by the work that has been done to it. Against it, I would be buying a car that I don't know much about, in a rush - I would be buying the first one I have seen.
Does anyone have any wise words?
FWIW, the eBay link is here:
http://cgi.ebay.co.uk/ws/eBayISAPI.dl
(No, that's not an invite for everyone to bid to put the price up, thanks!)
Oli.
I'd agree about getting an inspection. It's so easy to be caught up with new car fever.
Nearly did the same on the first Saab Turbo I saw - glad I walked as I found mine (eventually...).
On the other hand, this flat was the first we saw, then looked about about 10 or 15 others, and came back to this one as being the best...
Sorry, not much help. Personally, if you can't get a specialist to inspect it tomorrow, I would leave it. Better to miss out on a good one than buy a duffer IMHO. As a wise man once said, your perfect car is out there - you just haven't met it yet!
Great choice BTW!
Edit: if he was genuine I can't see why he wouldn't give a reason for why he was selling
Surely he can see it's only going to make people suspicious....
>> Edited by nicecupoftea on Tuesday 11th April 01:23
Nearly did the same on the first Saab Turbo I saw - glad I walked as I found mine (eventually...).
On the other hand, this flat was the first we saw, then looked about about 10 or 15 others, and came back to this one as being the best...
Sorry, not much help. Personally, if you can't get a specialist to inspect it tomorrow, I would leave it. Better to miss out on a good one than buy a duffer IMHO. As a wise man once said, your perfect car is out there - you just haven't met it yet!
Great choice BTW!
Edit: if he was genuine I can't see why he wouldn't give a reason for why he was selling
Surely he can see it's only going to make people suspicious.... >> Edited by nicecupoftea on Tuesday 11th April 01:23
Compared to my partners '86 944, it looks bloody immaculate. There are 3 very minor things that I don't like, the indicators have been changed for clear ones, the alloy pedals and the fact that a switch has been fitted to allow the roof to be taken out (although this could be that he never read the handbook to find out how you do it with the switch Ferdinand supplied in the first place). However, the important bits look good and you've seen, and liked, the car.
Personally, I would not make an offer (unless he withdraws the car before the auction ends), I'd sit there waiting during the auction and watch the price slowly rise. Having seen this sort of thing on eBay numerous times, I suspect it will peak at about £3.5-4k. Then, with less than a minute to go, whack in a bid for £6k. Personally, I like to live dangerously and whack in a bid with 5 seconds to go, if my bid doesn't beat someone elses proxy, I don't spend more than I intended. If it is the highest no other bidder has time to push it up.
At the sort of price you should be able to get it for, even if there is extra work that needs doing, you'll have the cash left over to pay for it.
Personally, I would not make an offer (unless he withdraws the car before the auction ends), I'd sit there waiting during the auction and watch the price slowly rise. Having seen this sort of thing on eBay numerous times, I suspect it will peak at about £3.5-4k. Then, with less than a minute to go, whack in a bid for £6k. Personally, I like to live dangerously and whack in a bid with 5 seconds to go, if my bid doesn't beat someone elses proxy, I don't spend more than I intended. If it is the highest no other bidder has time to push it up.
At the sort of price you should be able to get it for, even if there is extra work that needs doing, you'll have the cash left over to pay for it.
Dont recon its worth £6k. Ive just bought one. 62,000 miles, 3 owners from new full service history etc... and I paid £6k trade. Private youve got to be looking at £3 - £4.5k for something like this. I would follow the advice of the other posters, wait for the auction to end, if there is no reserve and he doesn't remove it then someone could get a bargain.
Brief reply Oli, £6k is (waaaaay) too much & you may wish to buy without seeing- I've bought blind on ebay a few times, never paid till ive seen & driven the car tho, but take someone experience along with you when you got to pay & if its not as described- i.e it has any of the expensive S2 faults you can just walk away.
Guys,
Thanks for the input all. The concensus seems to be that £6k is too much, and I shouldn't buy it. Makes it simple ...
He would take £6k to remove the vehicle from the eBay auction.
There is lots of history ... but I have no way of getting it inspected. However, I will 'phone up the garage which did the big engine work (cams and belts and tensioner - all of which were replaced) and ask what they know of the car.
Thanks again for your input. Sage advice is always welcome. (And going to see the first car, on your own, with no prior experience of the marque, is not sensible!)
Oli.
Thanks for the input all. The concensus seems to be that £6k is too much, and I shouldn't buy it. Makes it simple ...
He would take £6k to remove the vehicle from the eBay auction.
There is lots of history ... but I have no way of getting it inspected. However, I will 'phone up the garage which did the big engine work (cams and belts and tensioner - all of which were replaced) and ask what they know of the car.
Thanks again for your input. Sage advice is always welcome. (And going to see the first car, on your own, with no prior experience of the marque, is not sensible!)
Oli.
themaskedavenger said:
Make him a reasonable offer (prices above in other posts) that he takes it off ebay and it passes an inspection.
If he declines then you can walk away safe and sound (there will be others) if he says yes its his choice to take it off ebay and you get the peace of mind you seek.
Good idea TMA- buy it for a fair price, subject to an inspection not picking up a major issue
i was offered one a 1989 944S2 for £2900 (it's on a previous link).
similar mileage, unfettled, but needs some cosmetic work.
don't reckon this is worth abother £3k unless it's pristine - no problems with the engine etc. just reading more about the 944/968, and HGF was mentioned as a possible problem - is this somethign one can look out for? still hasn't put me of getting one though...
Chaps,
It is on eBay with no reserve, so it will sell (presuming that he lets the auction run it's course.)
Is £6k too much? Good question. It seems that good ones go for between £5k and £6k, and this one seems to be better than most. Well, not that I have seen any others - hence the problem.
He told me he paid £6k for it 2 1/2 years ago, and he has spent a good £3.5k on it since.
I think my thoughts are firming up ...
Oli.
It is on eBay with no reserve, so it will sell (presuming that he lets the auction run it's course.)
Is £6k too much? Good question. It seems that good ones go for between £5k and £6k, and this one seems to be better than most. Well, not that I have seen any others - hence the problem.
He told me he paid £6k for it 2 1/2 years ago, and he has spent a good £3.5k on it since.
I think my thoughts are firming up ...
Oli.
themaskedavenger said:
Make him a reasonable offer (prices above in other posts) that he takes it off ebay and it passes an inspection.
If he declines then you can walk away safe and sound (there will be others) if he says yes its his choice to take it off ebay and you get the peace of mind you seek.
What he said.Andy_Clap said:Tried it. He declined to take it off eBay unless he had a definite buyer. He felt that if it was on eBay, came off and was later back on again, potential buyers may think there is something fishy going on. I can see his point of view, in fairness.
Make him a reasonable offer (prices above in other posts) that he takes it off ebay and it passes an inspection.
If he declines then you can walk away safe and sound (there will be others) if he says yes its his choice to take it off ebay and you get the peace of mind you seek.
I am recalling the wise words of a very good friend a few years ago ... "Oli, there are always more cars out there."
Oli.
zcacogp said:
Chaps,
It is on eBay with no reserve, so it will sell (presuming that he lets the auction run it's course.)
Is £6k too much? Good question. It seems that good ones go for between £5k and £6k, and this one seems to be better than most. Well, not that I have seen any others - hence the problem.
He told me he paid £6k for it 2 1/2 years ago, and he has spent a good £3.5k on it since.
I think my thoughts are firming up ...
Oli.
FWIW, just because someone has kept the car in good condition, ie. routine maintenance (regardless of cost) does not mean that the car is necessarily worth a premium. Porsche's are not cheap to fix or maintain (cue, "I've only ever spent £5 a year on mine in servicing" etc...) so just because he has bills for X£ doesn't mean it is still worth what he paid for it. They are not rare and they are getting older.
Keep looking, get a good one and they are a great drive. (With a lovely view of the curving rear wing in your mirrors
)Chaps,
Thanks for your comments. Appreciated.
I didn't go for it. It eventually reached £3,600 on eBay, so I really think that someone got a bargain. I think that it probably was as good as it looked ... but am happy that I didn't pay £6k for it!
Looking at another one this weekend, similar spec but rather cheaper!
Oli.
Thanks for your comments. Appreciated.
I didn't go for it. It eventually reached £3,600 on eBay, so I really think that someone got a bargain. I think that it probably was as good as it looked ... but am happy that I didn't pay £6k for it!
Looking at another one this weekend, similar spec but rather cheaper!
Oli.
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