RE: Pic Of The Week: Datsun 240Z
Friday 18th September 2009
Click here to previewLong nose, short tail, rear-wheel drive and a hearty six-cylinder engine. Sounds like the perfect ingredients for a classic European sports car, right?
Pic Of The Week: Datsun 240Z
The only Datsun you could ever drool over
Click here to preview
Datsun thought so too when, in the late 1960s, it created its own take on said European sports car. The result was the Datsun 240Z, a kind of Big Healey in a Kimono.
It was proof that the Japanese could make mainstream sports cars that were every bit as desirable as their European opposition, and paved the way for such wonderful creations as the 370Z and Nissan GT-R.
You can see the Granddaddy of Nissan sports cars alongside the new 370Z Roadster and GT-R this weekend at the Goodwood Revival. Until then, or if you can't make it, why not pop it on your desktop?
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Discussion
427James said:
Shinobi said:
Beautiful car, the sound of these is amazing. I was lucky enough to be taken out in an amazing example of one in Bristol and it was a fantastic experience.
Am I the only one to think that these are just a bit derivative of better looking and more desirable cars? 
Edited by LuS1fer on Friday 18th September 14:51
The start of the Japanese explosion in sports cars.
I still relish the 240Z Super Samuri!
However, the 240Z was not launched properly until 1970 - known as the Fairlady Z in Japan.
An interesting point is that these shores had a small maker with a match (though not a rival) at the same time
(it is arguable as to which was first - both cars in the making in the late 60s).
The shape of the Brit coupe is surprisingly similar to the 240Z.
Coincidentally, there has always been a close relationship between Japan and this company in question.
Power in this case of the Brit was from a Ford 3-litre V6,
it was to be sold only fully built and type-approved.
It's launch was at the Earls Court Motor Show in 1970 and one well-known
motoring journalist of the time gave it his 'Car of the Show'.
Yet it's aim was not the 240Z but the MGB GT.
A surprisingly good car, so good that its crash test at MIRA was logged as
the best ever seen at that point in time.
But fewer than a hundred were ever sold.
I still relish the 240Z Super Samuri!
However, the 240Z was not launched properly until 1970 - known as the Fairlady Z in Japan.
An interesting point is that these shores had a small maker with a match (though not a rival) at the same time
(it is arguable as to which was first - both cars in the making in the late 60s).
The shape of the Brit coupe is surprisingly similar to the 240Z.
Coincidentally, there has always been a close relationship between Japan and this company in question.
Power in this case of the Brit was from a Ford 3-litre V6,
it was to be sold only fully built and type-approved.
It's launch was at the Earls Court Motor Show in 1970 and one well-known
motoring journalist of the time gave it his 'Car of the Show'.
Yet it's aim was not the 240Z but the MGB GT.
A surprisingly good car, so good that its crash test at MIRA was logged as
the best ever seen at that point in time.
But fewer than a hundred were ever sold.
Edited by dandarez on Friday 18th September 15:15
LuS1fer said:
427James said:
Shinobi said:
Beautiful car, the sound of these is amazing. I was lucky enough to be taken out in an amazing example of one in Bristol and it was a fantastic experience.
Am I the only one to think that these are just a bit derivative of better looking and more desirable cars? Fair enough, we all have our opinions of cars like this shaped by our memories of childhood, but I can't help but feel you are looking at these particular rust boxes with rose tinted spectacles. The styling was not revolutionary and to be honest leaves me a little underwhelmed. I don't dislike the cars, I am just surprised at others' enthusiasms. Still, each to their own.
Edited by LuS1fer on Friday 18th September 14:51
tegwin said:
Pfft.. thats a blatant wripoff of the Tvr M series!!
Yes, I can imagine Japan's finest designers thinking "We need a sports car design, anyone up for a trip to Blackpool?"The 240Z was launched in 1969 and would have completed it's development cycle over the preceding years whereas
"By the end of the 1960s TVR were ready to launch a completely new chassis/body combination which was to form the basis of all TVRs for the following decade. The M-Series made its public debut at the 1971 Earl’s Court Motor Show where a 2500M graced the stand. The first production M-Series model was built in April 1972 and the fixed head coupé body style evolved slightly over the years . In 1976 a hatchback version, the Taimar, was launched and in 1978 the convertible 3000S appeared .
Three engine versions were available initially for the M-Series: the 1600M (Ford Kent 1.6 litre), the 2500M (Triumph 2.5 litre) and the 3000M (Ford Essex 3 litre)."
My own view is that the TVR copied much of the MGB design cues and mixed it with the rear end styling of the earlier Vixen and had nothing to do with the 240Z. I have no doubt the 240Z was influenced by the MGB as the Japanese love British cars.
As for the TVR M series rip off?
The M series came out in 72, it was 'after' the Z.
And anyway, looks nowt like a 240Z.
The British marque that DID have 'the' similar car
(were they first, who knows?) is the true comparison.
AND Japanese did come onto this marque's stand at the 68 69 and 70 Motor Shows.
Don't laugh just cos you've never read it in the press.
It's how a long relationship was struck up and is still there today.
so nice little teaser for you. Designed around same time as 240Z,
launched similar time, looks similar, but as I said in my earlier post,
was not aimed at the 240Z and as said, this Brit was aimed against the
car just mentioned, the MGB (the GT version).
The M series came out in 72, it was 'after' the Z.
And anyway, looks nowt like a 240Z.
The British marque that DID have 'the' similar car
(were they first, who knows?) is the true comparison.
AND Japanese did come onto this marque's stand at the 68 69 and 70 Motor Shows.
Don't laugh just cos you've never read it in the press.
It's how a long relationship was struck up and is still there today.
so nice little teaser for you. Designed around same time as 240Z,
launched similar time, looks similar, but as I said in my earlier post,
was not aimed at the 240Z and as said, this Brit was aimed against the
car just mentioned, the MGB (the GT version).
Edited by dandarez on Friday 18th September 15:30
Not with Datsun. They just struck up a good relationship with Japanese motoring business in general and public. Probably the only place in the world where you can find a Ginetta G12 on the streets!
That's the G21 in the pic for the uninitiated - so does it look more like the 240Z than the TVR?
not a very good pic, but here is the MIRA crash test of the G21.
Rear wheels lifted 6 inches off the ground, front screen intact, s/wheel moved just a few inches and 'both' doors still able to be opened and locked normally. Press reaction was odd. Ginetta tried desperately for the road test they wanted... a back to back proper test against the MGB GT. It never happened... ever.
Remember this was a fully type-approved car and Motor magazine asked for a top of the range example, the G21S to road test - Ginetta's MD went wild at the insult, Motor tested it against Arkley and Davrian kit cars and headed it '3 for fun!'
That's the G21 in the pic for the uninitiated - so does it look more like the 240Z than the TVR?
not a very good pic, but here is the MIRA crash test of the G21.
Rear wheels lifted 6 inches off the ground, front screen intact, s/wheel moved just a few inches and 'both' doors still able to be opened and locked normally. Press reaction was odd. Ginetta tried desperately for the road test they wanted... a back to back proper test against the MGB GT. It never happened... ever.
Remember this was a fully type-approved car and Motor magazine asked for a top of the range example, the G21S to road test - Ginetta's MD went wild at the insult, Motor tested it against Arkley and Davrian kit cars and headed it '3 for fun!'
Edited by dandarez on Friday 18th September 16:08
For the record, the Datsun 240Z's first showing was the 1969 Tokyo Motor Show. Just who did how much in the design is debated ("Success has many fathers, Failure only one") even today, but what's certain is that Albrecht Graf von Goertz, a German-born American industrial designer was a consultant to Nissan and had designed the Silvia coupe for the Japanese market. It gets complicated because Goertz left midstream, and Datsun had been working with Yamaha on a sports car project that went to Toyota to become the Toyota 2000GT, which is when Yutaka Katayama, chief of Nissan's operations in the U.S., pushed to have hit pet project pushed through. That was to become the 240Z. One of Mr. K's prime requirements? That the car be large enough inside to fit Americans in. Americans went crazy for the car when it was brought over as a 1970 model and the rest is history.
Actually, if you want to get all fired up over Japanese/British lookalikes, compare the Datsun 1500/1600/2000 Fairlady Roadster to the MGB. Looks like Nissan ripped off MG on that one...except that the Datsun debuted within several months before the B.
If you still want to get all het up, Nissan built Austin cars under license in the 1950s. Those really did look like British cars.
Actually, if you want to get all fired up over Japanese/British lookalikes, compare the Datsun 1500/1600/2000 Fairlady Roadster to the MGB. Looks like Nissan ripped off MG on that one...except that the Datsun debuted within several months before the B.
If you still want to get all het up, Nissan built Austin cars under license in the 1950s. Those really did look like British cars.
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