How much faster is a big sports car than a hot hatch?
Discussion
How much faster is something like a Porsche Turbo / Gallardo / BMW M6 / F430 than a hot hatch if they were racing side by side? I mean would it pull away slowly or fly off into the distance? I have a friend with a Focus ST and he said he was racing a F430 and it only slowly pulled away? Are hot hatches and these cars closer than most people would think in acceleration from say 50 mph? Or is my friend dalusional?
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=1zXekcSs9oQ
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=YwyLbjkm5nk&fea...
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=YwyLbjkm5nk&fea...
Edited by Chris_w666 on Friday 19th March 13:04
it all depends if the person driving the Ferrari actually knew they were racing another car...................... I once had a guy come up to me in a petrol station, to tell me that he "almost had me just before that tight corner" I hadnt a clue that he was even behind me, let alone that I was racing the guy!
From my limited experience and based on my previous cars: when I had jap turbo's (impreza's and MR2 T's) I always thought that they would easily keep up with most things. Then I started looking at slightly different fast cars and had my eyes opened a little. I know it's not the same league as some of the cars that you've listed but my current 911 4S certainly felt a fair bit quicker than the previous prodrive scooby wrx I had when moving - say overtaking on an A road etc. Those sorts of cars are only just getting into their stride when a hatch is starting to get out of puff. I would expect a 911t or similar to easily pull away from an ST if both rolling at 60-80. Totally different league of car IMO.
http://www.fastestlaps.com/comparisons/45857713d06...
A good website for comparing lap times aswell as just 'stats' such as 0-60. I'd guess for it to be remotely close the Fezza driver wasn't giving it all the beans and your mate was revving the nuts off his ST. Good cars the ST with good performance, but not Ferrari performance!
A good website for comparing lap times aswell as just 'stats' such as 0-60. I'd guess for it to be remotely close the Fezza driver wasn't giving it all the beans and your mate was revving the nuts off his ST. Good cars the ST with good performance, but not Ferrari performance!
It all depends really. My T350 can hit 60 in around 4.5 seconds. A good modern hot hatch around 1-1.5 seconds behind which is not enough to create a massive gap. Where modern sports/supercars excel is beyond this. Mine will go on to crack 100 in sub 10 whereas the hatch may take up to 14 seconds to do so.
Also a missed gear change can have a significant affect.
Also a missed gear change can have a significant affect.
Gaz. said:
gbgt22 said:
How much faster is something like a Porsche Turbo / Gallardo / BMW M6 / F430 than a hot hatch if they were racing side by side? I mean would it pull away slowly or fly off into the distance? I have a friend with a Focus ST and he said he was racing a F430 and it only slowly pulled away? Are hot hatches and these cars closer than most people would think in acceleration from say 50 mph? Or is my friend dalusional?
An F430 would utterly destroy a Focus ST, I doubt the Ferrari driver even realised your mate was thrashing the tits off his car just to keep up.There is some very quick light-weight jap metal with rather large turbos out there mind so I wouldn't completely rule out hot hatches with super car peformance but a standard ST againt a F430 is just silly.
Zippee said:
It all depends really. My T350 can hit 60 in around 4.5 seconds. A good modern hot hatch around 1-1.5 seconds behind which is not enough to create a massive gap. Where modern sports/supercars excel is beyond this. Mine will go on to crack 100 in sub 10 whereas the hatch may take up to 14 seconds to do so.
Also a missed gear change can have a significant affect.
Easy example, and one i have experienced Classic Scooby STI (around 300bhp) vs. R8 (18 months ago so a V8 - 400bhp+)Also a missed gear change can have a significant affect.
A good start can hustle my scooby to 60 in just over 5 seconds, so the poor start that the R8 driver got didn't help, i had a nose ahead till my 3rd-4th change, when it started to pull past, at many leptons it was still pulling away and i was at full tilt to just watch it move ahead.
I can come up with so many reasons why a big sports car is going to pull away from a hot hatch in a straight line, but having an STI with relatively short gearing highlights one massively, by the time i was coming to the end of 4th gear, he was coming to the end of 3rd, not many cars, let alone hot hatches, pull into 3rd well over 100 leptons. It makes a serious difference.
Scoobys didn't make their name in drag racing though, and short gears can make a lot of difference in the right enviroment as more than one supercar owner has discovered over the years.
ETA: If i am not mistaken 430's are faster than R8's, and trust me, my car is faster than a standard Focus ST.
Edited by omgus on Friday 19th March 14:04
Gaz. said:
An F430 would utterly destroy a Focus ST, I doubt the Ferrari driver even realised your mate was thrashing the tits off his car just to keep up.
Absolutely! I've been lucky enough (and still am) to drive some stupendous machinery and they would all leave a hot hatch like my S3 for dead, I simply wouldn't be able to see what way it went.The F430 driver probably didn't even notice that an ST was trying to 'race'
Zippee said:
It all depends really. My T350 can hit 60 in around 4.5 seconds. A good modern hot hatch around 1-1.5 seconds behind which is not enough to create a massive gap. Where modern sports/supercars excel is beyond this. Mine will go on to crack 100 in sub 10 whereas the hatch may take up to 14 seconds to do so.
Also a missed gear change can have a significant affect.
There's just no replacement for horse power once you're moving.Also a missed gear change can have a significant affect.
Like your TVR, my track car can hit 60 in around 4 seconds thanks to it being mid engined, very light and big turbo. This means with the right launch it could peg a 360, or a averaged launched 430 to 60 without breaking a sweat. Once I go for 3rd though it's good by "race" and hello "watching a supercar disappear into the distance".
50mph roll on you'd need equal HP, which your mates STD doesn't even come close to having, even with all the remaps in the world.
RobM77 said:
What the?! A 325ci does the quarter mile in 15 seconds!
In my opinion the real world difference is not as clearcut as some would have you believe. Maximum acceleration at low speeds is often determined by grip rather than power and then the time it takes to change gear can make a huge difference. There's also the point that whatever car you are driving you can only go as fast as visibility permits - unless you're a complete idiot.
But once a big sports car can put its power down it's all over. Especially at higher speeds where the a big engine gets into its stride, an aerodynamic sports car faces less wind resistance and the sports car also remains much more stable.
One of the daily hazards of driving a nice sports car is making allowance for all the idiots who thrash their econoboxes/white vans/4x4s to death just to get in front..... In my experience it's generally best just to leave them to it if that's what makes them happy.
But once a big sports car can put its power down it's all over. Especially at higher speeds where the a big engine gets into its stride, an aerodynamic sports car faces less wind resistance and the sports car also remains much more stable.
One of the daily hazards of driving a nice sports car is making allowance for all the idiots who thrash their econoboxes/white vans/4x4s to death just to get in front..... In my experience it's generally best just to leave them to it if that's what makes them happy.
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