WOW - Just had a day in a Raw Striker
Discussion
Just had a day in a Raw Striker... and i'm completely sold on it.
I have an old lotus seven and love the tub format of the car, it's just fun as a toy. I had the opportunity to try the striker, so thought why not, should be fun. It was the 1600cc toyota engined car which seemed to pull really well and rev to the sky for such a little engine. Handling and grip seemed beyond any limits i was prepared to push on the roads. This got me to wondering, how many of them are there out there? Any experiences with them anyone? Track & road opinions?
I have an old lotus seven and love the tub format of the car, it's just fun as a toy. I had the opportunity to try the striker, so thought why not, should be fun. It was the 1600cc toyota engined car which seemed to pull really well and rev to the sky for such a little engine. Handling and grip seemed beyond any limits i was prepared to push on the roads. This got me to wondering, how many of them are there out there? Any experiences with them anyone? Track & road opinions?
musclecarmad said:
clum said:
Just had a day in a Raw Striker... and i'm completely sold on it.
I have an old lotus seven and love the tub format of the car, it's just fun as a toy. I had the opportunity to try the striker, so thought why not, should be fun. It was the 1600cc toyota engined car which seemed to pull really well and rev to the sky for such a little engine. Handling and grip seemed beyond any limits i was prepared to push on the roads. This got me to wondering, how many of them are there out there? Any experiences with them anyone? Track & road opinions?
Try a Westfield Megablade or any bike engined car they are even more fun!I have an old lotus seven and love the tub format of the car, it's just fun as a toy. I had the opportunity to try the striker, so thought why not, should be fun. It was the 1600cc toyota engined car which seemed to pull really well and rev to the sky for such a little engine. Handling and grip seemed beyond any limits i was prepared to push on the roads. This got me to wondering, how many of them are there out there? Any experiences with them anyone? Track & road opinions?
musclecarmad said:
clum said:
Just had a day in a Raw Striker... and i'm completely sold on it.
I have an old lotus seven and love the tub format of the car, it's just fun as a toy. I had the opportunity to try the striker, so thought why not, should be fun. It was the 1600cc toyota engined car which seemed to pull really well and rev to the sky for such a little engine. Handling and grip seemed beyond any limits i was prepared to push on the roads. This got me to wondering, how many of them are there out there? Any experiences with them anyone? Track & road opinions?
Try a Westfield Megablade or any bike engined car they are even more fun!I have an old lotus seven and love the tub format of the car, it's just fun as a toy. I had the opportunity to try the striker, so thought why not, should be fun. It was the 1600cc toyota engined car which seemed to pull really well and rev to the sky for such a little engine. Handling and grip seemed beyond any limits i was prepared to push on the roads. This got me to wondering, how many of them are there out there? Any experiences with them anyone? Track & road opinions?
clum said:
This got me to wondering, how many of them are there out there? Any experiences with them anyone? Track & road opinions?
Good, aren't they? 
There are a fair number of Strikers out there, with a variety of engines fitted. They're definitely one of the unsung heros of the kit car market - lighter, better handling and much better value than the competition (and I've owned both Caterham and Westfield, so I can draw direct comparison from experience).
They're just one of a series of designs from a very talented but modest chap by the name of Jeremy Phillips, who tends to develop cars under the banner of his own company ( Sylva Autokits), then sell them on to others once production is established. His latest design is the J15, which is effectively a mid-engined, aerodynamically bodied 'Striker'-type car:
(that's Jeremy himself at the wheel, by the way)
The Jeremy Phillips Sportscar Club gives a potted history of all the cars, but seems to be down this morning.
RAW took on the open-wheel 'Seven' style version of the Striker, but there are other variants in production that use similar chassis but have more aerodynamic bodyshells including Raw's own Fulcrum. These give better top-end performance (the aerodynamic drag starts to tell on conventional 'Sevens' at track speeds), and these variants have been good enough to dominate the kit car racing championships for literally decades.
You can see an early 'Clubman' aero bodied version of the Striker on my profile; the very similar Sylva Fury was taken on by Fisher Sportscars and he did a slightly updated version that's still available via Cyana Sportscars. There were other models, too, but you get the picture (no doubt some outraged Leader and Stylus owners will be along shortly, angry that they didn't get a mention!).
I rate Jeremy up there with Colin Chapman, Gordon Murray and Lee Noble, but self-promotion has never been his strong point...
havoc said:
musclecarmad said:
Try a Westfield Megablade or any bike engined car they are even more fun!
But hard work if you intend to use them regularly on road. Better if they've got a reverse-gear conversion to the 'box, but still harder work than a car-engine...
The bike engine vs. car engine debate gets quite heated at times, but IMO they are not well suited to road use... apart from the reverse gear problem (now a legal requirement on newly registered cars), the sequential dog boxes are fragile and clunky in traffic (and embarassing if you find yourself at a standstill in the wrong gear and have to shuttle through to first), clutches are a weak point, gearing is heavily compromised and the constant high revs can get on your tits when you're actually trying to get somewhere at a steady, high speed cruise.Brilliant fun on the track of for a short hoon on clear country roads, though.
"dominate the kit car racing championships for literally decades..."
(thanks for the potted history BTW).
Interesting, It did feel like it would just grip and grip. It's small frame also would suggest it's lighter than it's counterparts ie. westy/caterham which seem a bit creature comfort-full in comparison! If it's so good on the circuit, why has it taken so long to notice them, i have looked at seven type cars for a while and this has only just entered my radar as it were.
I like the Fulcrum too, although as stated somewhere else on here it has a funny rear end. Although i can't see me racing any time soon, so the high speed issue is not a big one for me. (The cost difference is not justifiable). Track days are all about cornering in my book and the fun to be had doing it, catching something you shouldn't is hugely satisfying especially in the old lotus i have, which does surprise some, until the straights when the x-flow can't keep up with the new motors. But i feel it's time for MORE POWER and the 7 is not rigid enough to start beefing up the horses without major alterations and besides, i like it fairly original.
"bike engine in its original home..."
I never have been able to trust myself with a bike. I have had a little go now and then, (airfields and the like) sometimes i think i should get my licence. I just feel too vulnerable, but it's all in the mind i know as the seven type cars are not exactly brimming with crumple zones!!
...and i agree with the too frantic to drive comfortably statement RE: bike engine in a car. A friend had one and it was huge on WOW factor, but became tedious, no cruise option, your always thrashing, or that's how it felt. The twin bike engined Westy was so madly quick you can forgive it though, I wouldn't want to own it, ear defenders don't suit me... 8)
(thanks for the potted history BTW).
Interesting, It did feel like it would just grip and grip. It's small frame also would suggest it's lighter than it's counterparts ie. westy/caterham which seem a bit creature comfort-full in comparison! If it's so good on the circuit, why has it taken so long to notice them, i have looked at seven type cars for a while and this has only just entered my radar as it were.
I like the Fulcrum too, although as stated somewhere else on here it has a funny rear end. Although i can't see me racing any time soon, so the high speed issue is not a big one for me. (The cost difference is not justifiable). Track days are all about cornering in my book and the fun to be had doing it, catching something you shouldn't is hugely satisfying especially in the old lotus i have, which does surprise some, until the straights when the x-flow can't keep up with the new motors. But i feel it's time for MORE POWER and the 7 is not rigid enough to start beefing up the horses without major alterations and besides, i like it fairly original.
"bike engine in its original home..."
I never have been able to trust myself with a bike. I have had a little go now and then, (airfields and the like) sometimes i think i should get my licence. I just feel too vulnerable, but it's all in the mind i know as the seven type cars are not exactly brimming with crumple zones!!
...and i agree with the too frantic to drive comfortably statement RE: bike engine in a car. A friend had one and it was huge on WOW factor, but became tedious, no cruise option, your always thrashing, or that's how it felt. The twin bike engined Westy was so madly quick you can forgive it though, I wouldn't want to own it, ear defenders don't suit me... 8)
clum said:
Just had a day in a Raw Striker... and i'm completely sold on it.
I have an old lotus seven and love the tub format of the car, it's just fun as a toy. I had the opportunity to try the striker, so thought why not, should be fun. It was the 1600cc toyota engined car which seemed to pull really well and rev to the sky for such a little engine. Handling and grip seemed beyond any limits i was prepared to push on the roads. This got me to wondering, how many of them are there out there? Any experiences with them anyone? Track & road opinions?
I've got one I have an old lotus seven and love the tub format of the car, it's just fun as a toy. I had the opportunity to try the striker, so thought why not, should be fun. It was the 1600cc toyota engined car which seemed to pull really well and rev to the sky for such a little engine. Handling and grip seemed beyond any limits i was prepared to push on the roads. This got me to wondering, how many of them are there out there? Any experiences with them anyone? Track & road opinions?
Its been on the road 5 years now . Vauxhall 2.0 16v engine on TB'S in mine . Its my second so I guess I must like em Funnily enough I was at Raws factory in Hereford on Saturday putting my order in for one.
Mel Coppock has just had his hip replaced so they are unlikely to be at Stoneleigh this year, but its still very much business as usual. I hope to collect mine in about 4-6 weeks, perfect time of year to start building!
Mel Coppock has just had his hip replaced so they are unlikely to be at Stoneleigh this year, but its still very much business as usual. I hope to collect mine in about 4-6 weeks, perfect time of year to start building!
Edited by loggyboy on Monday 12th April 16:15
clum said:
If it's so good on the circuit, why has it taken so long to notice them...
Partly 'cos Sylva have always kept a fairly low profile in terms of marketing (Fisher did a better job, so you'll find that there are a lot more Fisher Furies around than Sylvas, ironically), partly because they are a bit less 'Airfix kit' than some of the other 'Sevens', which puts off some less confident builders, I think.clum said:
...i can't see me racing any time soon, so the high speed issue is not a big one for me.
Personal preference, of course, but unless you have huge power, the average traditional 'Seven' will struggle to pull enough speed on the straights to prevent itself being overtaken by some relatively mundane (but more aerodynamic) machinery, which you'll then find in front of you, getting in the way, at the next corner...Even in road use, you'll find that enough of the power is being absorbed in aerodynamic drag that there's not as much as you might hope left over for acceleration when you want to overtake at higher motorway/A-road speeds.
havoc said:
musclecarmad said:
clum said:
Just had a day in a Raw Striker... and i'm completely sold on it.
I have an old lotus seven and love the tub format of the car, it's just fun as a toy. I had the opportunity to try the striker, so thought why not, should be fun. It was the 1600cc toyota engined car which seemed to pull really well and rev to the sky for such a little engine. Handling and grip seemed beyond any limits i was prepared to push on the roads. This got me to wondering, how many of them are there out there? Any experiences with them anyone? Track & road opinions?
Try a Westfield Megablade or any bike engined car they are even more fun!I have an old lotus seven and love the tub format of the car, it's just fun as a toy. I had the opportunity to try the striker, so thought why not, should be fun. It was the 1600cc toyota engined car which seemed to pull really well and rev to the sky for such a little engine. Handling and grip seemed beyond any limits i was prepared to push on the roads. This got me to wondering, how many of them are there out there? Any experiences with them anyone? Track & road opinions?
On mine, the clutch is lighter, its more torquey, easier to park etc etc etc than my road car. It is so far from hard work, people just presume they are and for some reason it is always brought up by car engine owners in the CEC vs BEC argument. The simple answer is, they are both a doddle, it just comes down to preference.
matt frost said:
Are you actually basing this on anything, or just what you have heard from other people who are also just assuming they are hard work?
I've driven several BECS. 'Hard work' is possibly the wrong term, though in my experience the clutches and gearboxes do need more concentration than a typical car engined installation.
'Irritating' is a more accurate description, IMO, when they're not been driven at 9/10ths or above. The short gearing/high revs and clunky dog-engagement gearboxes in stop-start traffic just get on my tits a bit (though to be fair they're a lot less brutal than the heavy-duty dogs in the Hewland in my Westfield... the flip side being that they're nothing like as tough, of course).
They're brilliant on track, but I think you just have to accept that they're a bit marmite for road use: you definitely need to try before you buy.
Sam_68 said:
matt frost said:
Are you actually basing this on anything, or just what you have heard from other people who are also just assuming they are hard work?
I've driven several BECS. 'Hard work' is possibly the wrong term, though in my experience the clutches and gearboxes do need more concentration than a typical car engined installation.
'Irritating' is a more accurate description, IMO, when they're not been driven at 9/10ths or above. The short gearing/high revs and clunky dog-engagement gearboxes in stop-start traffic just get on my tits a bit (though to be fair they're a lot less brutal than the heavy-duty dogs in the Hewland in my Westfield... the flip side being that they're nothing like as tough, of course).
They're brilliant on track, but I think you just have to accept that they're a bit marmite for road use: you definitely need to try before you buy.
As far as I am concerned, they are not hard work or irritating at all to drive on the road and even though I am sure most people would disagree, these people have no clue and just heard someone else say it, think it makes sense and then repeat it. Obviously I know this isn't the case with you, but probably with the person I originally quoted.
Maybe some old BEC's are annoying or hard work, but mine and my buddy's MK aren't so I guess its not too much my concern. I just get fed up with people claiming they are bad on the road when they aren't at all. Maybe people just need to make adjustments to their cars? My clutch was horrid until it was adjusted, the same with the gear change until the idol was lowered and the blip until the trickshifter was adjusted etc etc. Now everything is great.
All I can think is it comes down to getting used to it because the sequential is different to the car setup? The first couple of drives were a chore until I got used to the gears (and we didn't have a gear indicator at the time) and the clutch was bad but it is just a case of getting used to it.
Edited by matt frost on Tuesday 13th April 12:46
I have to agree that bike engines can be a pain in the bum, my gearbox in particular can be a real chore in stop/start traffic... though I'm sure a more modern lower mileage engine would be less hassle than a 15 year old fireblade.
I've taken a few bike owning friends out for rides in it and they have been impressed. Obviously it doesn't have the straight line acceleration of a bike, but comments tended to be that it felt more brutal - because you can just snap the throttle wide open without falling off the back, and also you get to blat through much more of the gears and use all the revs on country roads without getting up to prison speeds like you would on a bike that's geared to do 100mph in first gear.
I've taken a few bike owning friends out for rides in it and they have been impressed. Obviously it doesn't have the straight line acceleration of a bike, but comments tended to be that it felt more brutal - because you can just snap the throttle wide open without falling off the back, and also you get to blat through much more of the gears and use all the revs on country roads without getting up to prison speeds like you would on a bike that's geared to do 100mph in first gear.
matt frost said:
The only gear that clunks is first...
mr_fibuli said:
my gearbox in particular can be a real chore in stop/start traffic...
QEDIt's a matter of perspective, I guess. Personally, I find that the clonking and drivetrain shunt that you inevitably get with any dog box (there needs to be some slack in the dogs for them to work, so anyone who claims it's not there is either lying or not paying attention) in stop/start traffic makes it a rather trying experience after a while. It doesn't stop me owning and driving a car with a (quite coarse) dog-engagement box, but I don't deny the problem exists or pretend that the car is perfect. But others might barely notice it, or not consider it significant perhaps?
I recall another BEC enthusiast on these forums stating that he'd only destroyed a gearbox and 3 clutches in the sort of mileage that wouldn't even require an oil change in the average modern car, and he actually used this as justification of the bullet-proof reliability of BEC drivetrains! Personal perspective, again.
But the bike engine vs. car engine debate is drifting off topic, really. If your goggles are rose-tinted enough, that's cool, and good luck to you...
Crikey..... I didn't mean BECs were carp, just not my cup of tea.
I think the one i have driven was a bit short on maintenance, hence the throwaway comment. Now i think about it i seem to remember the engine was discovered to be minus or losing a mount at some point after i drove it, (i know the owners mechanic) and so the gears were perhaps a little effected by this!?
I think the owner felt a bit silly when this was pointed out to him, obviously not the mechanical sort!
That said, Ahem...
Yes, it is a tad off topic;
so what other gems can you tell me about the striker then people!?
I think the one i have driven was a bit short on maintenance, hence the throwaway comment. Now i think about it i seem to remember the engine was discovered to be minus or losing a mount at some point after i drove it, (i know the owners mechanic) and so the gears were perhaps a little effected by this!?
I think the owner felt a bit silly when this was pointed out to him, obviously not the mechanical sort!
That said, Ahem...
Yes, it is a tad off topic;
so what other gems can you tell me about the striker then people!?
clum said:
Bike engine... funny you should say that, i took the striker to see a friend who has a westy, with... 2 bike engines, its apparently a famous well known monster, it has "fluke" branding all over it, but was put together somewhere else i think but that is a TOTAL weapon.
Sounds like Tim's old car, IIRC he sold it to someone who worked at Fluke:
http://www.timduncan.co.uk/just-the-one/index.html
Gassing Station | General Gassing [Archive] | Top of Page | What's New | My Stuff