Renault Clio 182 / Focus ST170

[vescaegg]

http://cgi.ebay.co.uk/2004-RENAULT-CLIO-2-0-16V-Re...

http://cgi.ebay.co.uk/FORD-FOCUS-2-0-ST170-3DR-FSH...

has anyone had any experiences with these? im thinking of swapping the 320d for something smaller and more exciting!

wish i could afford an RS or a 197 but i cant!

[anonymous-user]

personally i would go for the clio as its lighter, smaller and subsequently more nimble. make sure the cambelts have been done, and go for the "cup" chassis. hunt long and hard for a good one and sign up to the cliosport forum and buy one from them.

[Martin_Hx]

Both good cars for the cash, how about a Ford Racing Puma ? for similar cash ?

[rb5230]

is a civic type-r not in the price range?

the focus is not exactly a fast car but is better built than the clio which is a more fun car. a type-r is kind of the best of both worlds.

[skyslimit]

Avoid the Focus. The one I drove felt really, really slow. It didn't feel like 170 bhp or anywhere near it.

[anonymous-user]

Clio.

122k on the focus as well, yikes.

[vescaegg]

I didn't really consider a Type R. I thought they might be out of my price range (Max £6k but would prefer less)

are the racing pumas worth the extra?

I wasn't actually looking at those two specifically, just the type of car.

Edited by vescaegg on Tuesday 11th May 15:02

[sday12]

I had a ST170 and was underwhelmed by the power delivery, good chassis though.


Clio

[stevenr]

I've owned both and i can assure you the Clio is the one to go for.
As for the reliability issues with french cars that you hear so many times on here,30k very hard miles in mine and not one single problem.
The Focus on the other hand was the most unreliable bucket of turd i have ever owned,never again!

Clio all the way for me.

[rb5230]

vescaegg said:

I didn't really consider a Type R. I thought they might be out of my price range (Max £6k but would prefer less)

are the racing pumas worth the extra?

I wasn't actually looking at those two specifically, just the type of car.

Edited by vescaegg on Tuesday 11th May 15:02

the puma racing is a limited edition rare car and will become a classic and will not lose any money (may even appreciate in value)if looked after properly, it wont be the fastest of the bunch but will be the one that gets the most admiring comments.

a friend of mine recently picked up a low mileage typr-r for £6k and it is in great condition, i would have thought it would also be less prone to losing money than the clio or focus.

[The Hitman]

I just bought a FF 182 with the cup packs about a month ago. Lovely car. I don't think mine has the cup chassis, but on the road it doesn't make much differance if any at all IMO.

The power is great, and with the right tyres grips the road like white on rice. (I bought myself Toyo T1-R's all round, best thing I could have done)

Can't comment on the ST170 mechanicals, but I understand they are decent if the styling is a little non-existant to separate it from the lower models.

2 very respectable cars. Good Hunting!!

[130R]

I'd look at the SEAT Leon rather than the Focus.

[homerjay]

182 all day long.

why anyone would even consider the focus is beyond me.

[AMST09]

Rather than the focus, if you don't need the space get the fiesta ST
Same speed, but a supposedly a much nicer gearbox
Great handling little car

[Rammy76]

I've had no experience with the Clio but heard they're fun cars and probably more of a 'raw' drivers car than the Focus.
As for the ST170, with that mileage and the fact it is quite basic spec it does not seem particularly good value in my opinion. Look out for one with Xenons, full leather Recaros, digital climate and premium sound system.
Performance-wise, the Focus I had wasn't bad as long as you kept it well up in the rev range although strangely Ford made them quite high geared, that and the fact they're quite refined also blunts the impression of performance. The handling was excellent, yet it still had a compliant ride.

[Chris71]

vescaegg said:

has anyone had any experiences with these?

Yes. I've driven both recently as potential new daily drivers.

Even as a Focus owner and former Fordie I found the ST170 a huge dissapointment. It's just not a very big step up from a standard Focus dynamcially - at least it certainly doesn't feel hugely different, which, lets face it, is half the point if you're after something 'small and fun'. It's still considerably more money to buy than the lower models, costs a lot more to run (the insurance quote was double my 1.6 Zetec and economy is said to be sub-30 mpg if driven at all enthusiastically) and doesn't give that much more than the hugely competent base models.

The Renault was far more like it. Initially it seems slightly dissapointing too, then once the revs pass a certain point it just goes nuts. The one I drove torque steered a lot, but I'm told that's not normal (possibly manky tyres or something), the damping was spot on and it was even possible to get comfortable (despite what some people say) if you fiddled with the seat controls. On the downside it didn't feel as well screwed together as the Focus and the space in the back is pretty restricted. But it does 0-60mph in under seven seconds in Trophy form and yet people still claim nearly 40mpg on a run. Plus you can still get xenons, cruise control etc. in there.

So out of the two I'd definitely go for the Clio, but be aware it does feel like a bit of an Old School frantic hot hatch on occasions. I think the ST170 is trying to pull off the grown up sports hatch thing that the Mk5 Golf GTi and the later 5-cylinder Focus ST did. It's just nothing like as good at it.

[vescaegg]

http://www.pistonheads.com/sales/1702981.htm

Is this an even remotely sensible thing to be looking at?!

[Flat_Steve]

There's an ST170 in the PH classifieds that has only done 55,000 miles and is cheaper than that eBay one you listed by £500 too. I won't list it here because it's, er, mine. But there are good low mileage ST170's available for the same money as tiny-engined boggo-spec higher mileage Focuses. They are a LOT of car for the money.

Mine has been reliable, handles very nicely and it does have a bit of power there if you press on. It's not as racuous or manic as a Clio but it feels altogether more grown up which is what swung it for me - I've done the hot hatch thing with my first car (205 GTi).

The downsides are not-fantastic MPG (high 20's if you use it properly) and inexplicably expensive insurance (mine's going up from £450 to £600 this year and I'm 35 with 8 years NCB?!). This last issue is the main reason I've been looking to sell, however what I've found is that the money I'd get from the sale of my ST170 wouldn't buy me anything even remotely as nice, despite being totally open-minded as to its replacement.

In fact so poor are our options at this price point it looks likely we're going to keep the ST170 until at least later in the year as we don't want to be driving around in something soul-destroying - 3.5k only buys you a bag of spanners. Yes I'd jump at a 172 and they are out there at that money but the insurance problem is the same for me so that's out of the window unfortunately.

[andye30m3]

I would go for the clio over the focus or the civic type R.

A friend bought a focus and has been disappointed with it, just not much fun to drive and doesn't go that well, nothing that wrong with though.

I can think of a reason to buy a civic type R over an integra type R.

The only hot hatch I'd go for over the clio would be the integra, well actually I sold a clio 172 to buy an integra and didn't look back. Again nothing really wrong with the clio but the integra's better driving position, LSD and reliability made it a better ownership experience

[AB]

Focus... fantastic chassis, could handle so much more power but the 170 is not something that can be considered a hot hatch. It's a luke warm family hatchback, and that is being generous.

Clio is fun, Focus is a nippy version of a not so special family hatch.

Civic Type-R... well, I always enjoy driving it, something a bit more special about it.

Clio gets my vote.