Best measure of car performance?
Discussion
What's the best way to measure a car's performance? Looking at stats for modern fast cars, I find myself at a loss of how to work out what they might feel like performance-wise to drive every day compared to other cars of their ilk.
1) With the power of current performance cars, 0-60ph is almost irrelevant now as as it's all about how clever the electronics/drivetrain is at getting you off the line and how quick your uber-new 18 clutch german gearbox is swapping cogs. Same can be said about 0-100mph times as cars get even more powerful.
2) Nurburgring/<insertfamoustracknamehere> lap time willy waving is irrelevant as the average driver will get nowhere near the absolute limits required to achieve it
3) Power(-to-weight) ratios are irrelevant for similar reasons to (1), as well as because different engines develop their torque at different points and gearboxes have different ratios/number of gears etc etc. Additionally, for lightweight sports cars like NA Elises, the ratio can be misleading as acceleration is compromised (more than might be expected) at higher speeds due to lack of engine power
4) Top speed is irrelevant for everyone who doesn't drive on an Autobahn at 3am
5) Cornering G is irrelevant as per (2)
The best measures IMO seem to be in-gear acceleration times between speeds, and thru-the-gears times, but these are much less easy to find than other stats.
I once tried to come up with some empirical formula/measurement for a cars performance based on power, torque, rpm for max torque, weight, gearing, number of gears and top speed (probably missed a couple out there!) that might allow me to compare cars in a meaningful real world way....needless to say it was a bit of a waste of time
What do you look for when "assessing" a car's relative performance on paper?! What's most important for you?
Edit to fix (3)
1) With the power of current performance cars, 0-60ph is almost irrelevant now as as it's all about how clever the electronics/drivetrain is at getting you off the line and how quick your uber-new 18 clutch german gearbox is swapping cogs. Same can be said about 0-100mph times as cars get even more powerful.
2) Nurburgring/<insertfamoustracknamehere> lap time willy waving is irrelevant as the average driver will get nowhere near the absolute limits required to achieve it
3) Power(-to-weight) ratios are irrelevant for similar reasons to (1), as well as because different engines develop their torque at different points and gearboxes have different ratios/number of gears etc etc. Additionally, for lightweight sports cars like NA Elises, the ratio can be misleading as acceleration is compromised (more than might be expected) at higher speeds due to lack of engine power
4) Top speed is irrelevant for everyone who doesn't drive on an Autobahn at 3am
5) Cornering G is irrelevant as per (2)
The best measures IMO seem to be in-gear acceleration times between speeds, and thru-the-gears times, but these are much less easy to find than other stats.
I once tried to come up with some empirical formula/measurement for a cars performance based on power, torque, rpm for max torque, weight, gearing, number of gears and top speed (probably missed a couple out there!) that might allow me to compare cars in a meaningful real world way....needless to say it was a bit of a waste of time
What do you look for when "assessing" a car's relative performance on paper?! What's most important for you?
Edit to fix (3)
Edited by Mario149 on Friday 28th May 15:45
I still find 0-100mph useful to look at as it makes more use of the gears than the dash to 60. Over 100mph and I suppose aerodynamics have far more effect, hence Caterfields will lose out but still have staggering performance below this.
If something has 0-100mph of less than 10s then I consider it pretty quick.
If something has 0-100mph of less than 10s then I consider it pretty quick.
Zod said:
Ring times are a rough measure of all round performance in the dry.
In-gear acceleration is a worthless measure. There are plenty of highly strung engines that need gear changes to achieve highest performance and the people who drive them know and expect that.
And there's plenty of fast, but low powered cars that don't do so well around the ring due to the lonnnng straights!In-gear acceleration is a worthless measure. There are plenty of highly strung engines that need gear changes to achieve highest performance and the people who drive them know and expect that.
MacW said:
Best measure is the size of your smile after the test drive.
^this^Best measure of a car's performance is the experience of driving it. Whilst a 911 GT3 and an F430 may give broadly the same performance you may hate one and love the other. Or hate both and love a 911 Turbo/335d (mapped)/MX-5/Gallardo etc etc.
Performance in a straight line is only a small part of the story, the real fun bit is the twirly round thing in front of you. Tough to accurately measure things like turn-in, power on handling, front to rear grip balance, etc.
If you just want monster straight line performance, there's any number of 1000cc bikes will pop your cork.
If you just want monster straight line performance, there's any number of 1000cc bikes will pop your cork.
The problem is that any one of these measures on their own will tell you very little about the car. The relevance of any performance figures depend on the cars intended use.
What a range of performance figures, power delivery graphs etc... can do is give you an overall idea of a cars capabilities, but as has been said by others, there is no substitution for 'bum in seat' time to tell you if a car is any good.
ETA: personally I check power/weight first and then overall weight, I find thats a good starting point.
What a range of performance figures, power delivery graphs etc... can do is give you an overall idea of a cars capabilities, but as has been said by others, there is no substitution for 'bum in seat' time to tell you if a car is any good.
ETA: personally I check power/weight first and then overall weight, I find thats a good starting point.
Edited by patmahe on Friday 28th May 16:25
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