Very specific dealer servicing query
Discussion
OK, this thread must NOT turn into the normal 'fecking dealers' thread like all the others.
I've just dropped my 4yr old Civic diesel off at Honda for its 50k service. Now I would like to make it clear that I do not have a problem with dealers making a profit and I fully understand we all need them to sell cars and indeed do work on our cars.
HOWEVER...this 50k service is going to cost £340. On top of that I need an MOT, new wipers, clutch fluid and two new tyres which I won in a competition and therefore do not need to pay for. The total bill will be in the region of £450.
My question is, leaving aside the need for the dealer to pay all the costs that go with running a franchise and make a profit, does this offer good value for the customer? I will be changing cars next year and so a FHondaSH is probably (just) worth maintaining, but I am mightily hacked off at the thought of handing over nearly 100 five Pound notes later this afternoon and getting a car back that feels no different to when I droppped it off. I could have taken it round to my local mechanic and saved £300.
Please ignore your hatred of dealers and give me your thoughts.
I've just dropped my 4yr old Civic diesel off at Honda for its 50k service. Now I would like to make it clear that I do not have a problem with dealers making a profit and I fully understand we all need them to sell cars and indeed do work on our cars.
HOWEVER...this 50k service is going to cost £340. On top of that I need an MOT, new wipers, clutch fluid and two new tyres which I won in a competition and therefore do not need to pay for. The total bill will be in the region of £450.
My question is, leaving aside the need for the dealer to pay all the costs that go with running a franchise and make a profit, does this offer good value for the customer? I will be changing cars next year and so a FHondaSH is probably (just) worth maintaining, but I am mightily hacked off at the thought of handing over nearly 100 five Pound notes later this afternoon and getting a car back that feels no different to when I droppped it off. I could have taken it round to my local mechanic and saved £300.
Please ignore your hatred of dealers and give me your thoughts.
Difficult to give a view without knowing what the 50K service involves. What are they doing over and above the usual oil/filters?
As for the rest of it (MOT,wipers, etc) I guess it's just bad luck that they need doing at the same time. It would be a very fussy buyer who expected you to get the clutch fluid changed at Honda - most will just look at the service stamps in the book. Either do it yourself or take it to an indy.
Similarly, I'm sure wipers can be had much cheaper on eBay. It's not going to reduce the bill massively but might help a little.
As for the rest of it (MOT,wipers, etc) I guess it's just bad luck that they need doing at the same time. It would be a very fussy buyer who expected you to get the clutch fluid changed at Honda - most will just look at the service stamps in the book. Either do it yourself or take it to an indy.
Similarly, I'm sure wipers can be had much cheaper on eBay. It's not going to reduce the bill massively but might help a little.
Edited by Risotto on Wednesday 13th October 10:52
Stop stop stop.
You're missing the point. I am not bothered about wipers, or tyres etc etc. The point is the basic service which will be much the same as all the other manufacturer's 50k services is going to cost £320. As a customer I do not think that offers me good value for money. Even though I get the whole dealer experience that comes with getting them to do the service I still think it is too much.
Oh, and I don't believe anyone makes the price of the 50k service one of their main criteria when buying a car. It's hard enough choosing a car let alone worrying what the annual service is going to cost in 5 years time.
You're missing the point. I am not bothered about wipers, or tyres etc etc. The point is the basic service which will be much the same as all the other manufacturer's 50k services is going to cost £320. As a customer I do not think that offers me good value for money. Even though I get the whole dealer experience that comes with getting them to do the service I still think it is too much.
Oh, and I don't believe anyone makes the price of the 50k service one of their main criteria when buying a car. It's hard enough choosing a car let alone worrying what the annual service is going to cost in 5 years time.
I'm also running a 2007 Civic diesel as a hack around - the service prices at Honda do seem a little toppy. They wanted £280 for the last 62k service that is a simple oil change and visual check of the car. I paid £140 at my local garage and that included them changing the front brake pads and putting the correct oil in (£50 worth)! I plan to keep this car for a while so I'm less bothered about not maintaining the FHSH.
I think the UK dealer network charges outrageous prices for very little.
I live in the USA and drive a newish (under 2 years old, under 15000 miles) vehicle from a mainstream manufacturer. My maintenance costs are roughly $35 for an oil change with filter every 7500 miles. Sometimes the oil change light comes on sooner but I am fine with that.
The (franchised) dealer also checks my tyre presures and tread depths, and looks for other glaring issues that need to be fixed for that money.
When the vehicle gets older and needs air filters etc then I am sure that the price will rise and again I am OK with that.
Going back to the OP's car the car will probably need an oil change, oil filter, air filter and fuel filter at the mileage stated. The parts might be quite expensive, but I doubt they are as high as quoted.
I would be tempted to ask if the cost of the service can be broken down so you can understand what you are getting for your money. A US dealer's rate tends to be a lot lower than a UK dealer so that explains some of it, and some parts are cheaper, oil is definitely cheaper, but I know that my franchised dealer isn't being outrageous. The OP's is. Ask for a good explanation.
I live in the USA and drive a newish (under 2 years old, under 15000 miles) vehicle from a mainstream manufacturer. My maintenance costs are roughly $35 for an oil change with filter every 7500 miles. Sometimes the oil change light comes on sooner but I am fine with that.
The (franchised) dealer also checks my tyre presures and tread depths, and looks for other glaring issues that need to be fixed for that money.
When the vehicle gets older and needs air filters etc then I am sure that the price will rise and again I am OK with that.
Going back to the OP's car the car will probably need an oil change, oil filter, air filter and fuel filter at the mileage stated. The parts might be quite expensive, but I doubt they are as high as quoted.
I would be tempted to ask if the cost of the service can be broken down so you can understand what you are getting for your money. A US dealer's rate tends to be a lot lower than a UK dealer so that explains some of it, and some parts are cheaper, oil is definitely cheaper, but I know that my franchised dealer isn't being outrageous. The OP's is. Ask for a good explanation.
Oil Change on the diesel should be around £160.00, so the bigger service I would have expected to cost somewhere around £250.00.
I'm guessing you have left the handbook with the dealer. If you need me to tell you what it includes, i'll go get mine out of the car.
I'm guessing you have left the handbook with the dealer. If you need me to tell you what it includes, i'll go get mine out of the car.
Edited by CatherineJ on Wednesday 13th October 17:50
Not sure what you are driving at. If you want value, go to an indie. if you want the FHSH stamp, go to a dealer and be prepared to subsidise the fixed costs imposed on him by the manufacturer - shiny premises, diagnostics, mechanic re-training etc etc. No point whinging about it, it is what it is. If it bothers you, got to the indie.
Right here is all you need to know...manufacturers insist dealers have shiny posh premises. Example...Peugeot have just insisted my pals dealership rework their service reception, it was only redone 2 years ago and is lovely, but it must fit in with their "current image"...the signage alone is £15K, total cost is £65K.
Local BMW dealer to me built a new showroom and it cost £9M.
The customer pays for the above.
hornetrider said:
Sounds a bit early (50k) but is that a cambelt change?
Can't remember if it is a belt or chain on the diesel. I do know it is not until 75,000 miles if it's a belt.OP, this link should give you an idea of what other owners have paid for their 50k mile service with franchised dealers around the UK.
http://www.civinfo.com/wiki/index.php?title=Servic...
Edited by CatherineJ on Wednesday 13th October 11:48
No cambelt change.
I'll have one last go at making my point clear. I fully accept the extra costs that come with running a dealership. Those costs have to be paid for. However, it seems to me that we have now reached a point where the extra cost of a service over and above an independent's price is not justified by a shiny new building.
If I decide to hang onto this car for a while then this will be the last dealer service for me.
Please understand that this was not a complaint. It was an observation that I wanted people's opinion on. I am no longer prepared to pay a premium for a product that looks better, but does exactly the same job as my friendly mechanic around the corner.
I'll have one last go at making my point clear. I fully accept the extra costs that come with running a dealership. Those costs have to be paid for. However, it seems to me that we have now reached a point where the extra cost of a service over and above an independent's price is not justified by a shiny new building.
If I decide to hang onto this car for a while then this will be the last dealer service for me.
Please understand that this was not a complaint. It was an observation that I wanted people's opinion on. I am no longer prepared to pay a premium for a product that looks better, but does exactly the same job as my friendly mechanic around the corner.
The 50k isn't especially onerous, new oil and replace every filter including fuel and pollen filters, then do all the checks. I'm surprised it's that expensive, especially as they do a 4 year / 50k service plan for £750 now (when I got mine it was £850 for 5 years / 62.5k miles).
Worth shopping around IMO, at least calling other nearby dealers and using that to negotiate on price. Plus if you're happy with going elsewhere, then do so.
Worth shopping around IMO, at least calling other nearby dealers and using that to negotiate on price. Plus if you're happy with going elsewhere, then do so.
SonicHedgeHog said:
If I decide to hang onto this car for a while then this will be the last dealer service for me.
This.Quite a few people will look at a 5 year old car with a FSH and be happy that it has been taken to an independant specialist after it falls out of manufacturer warranty. I wouldn't have any issues buying a car with a stamped up service book if the services were done on time and by a respected indie.
The money you save by using an indie against main dealer service costs could be put into a pot for repairs as the car gets older.
I think the person asking for a break down of the bill had the right idea. Then at least you'll be able to compare dealer parts costs with internet parts costs and you'll know what hourly rate they charge compared to an indy.
As for whether to go dealer or independant with regard to resale value, it's always going to be a tough one. The fact that it had dealer servicing initially will count in your favour. As a car devalues there has to be less inclination to continue with dealer service (unless you're talking about premium models), it's just common sense, so I don't think you'd lose out a lot on resale value as a result. Persoanlly I'd go dealer until the warranty runs out and then indy after that.
As for whether to go dealer or independant with regard to resale value, it's always going to be a tough one. The fact that it had dealer servicing initially will count in your favour. As a car devalues there has to be less inclination to continue with dealer service (unless you're talking about premium models), it's just common sense, so I don't think you'd lose out a lot on resale value as a result. Persoanlly I'd go dealer until the warranty runs out and then indy after that.
Hang on a minute, just how much can really be saved by using an indie? Assuming the SAME work is done (rather than corners cut) and the SAME parts are used I doubt there's even £100 max' to be saved here.
Is full Honda service history worth £100 when you come to sell a 5-year old car? I say "yes".
Is full Honda service history worth £100 when you come to sell a 5-year old car? I say "yes".
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