Alvis in bristol or swansea?
Discussion
hi guys,
I'm in third year at uni studying automotive design and so working on a major project for the length of the year. My design brief is celebrating 100 years of alvis, so designing the car for the year 2019. However, I would really like to get in contact with anyone who owns an alvis, and potentially see them and there car or just have a chat to them. I really need this to happen sometime soon as it'll form a main part of my research in understanding why an Alvis was chosen over, say, a jaguar or bentley etc... I'm studying in swansea but travel back to bristol on weekends, so if anyone owns one and lives here or there it would be great to hear from you. If anyone owns one and doesnt live here or there, it would still be great to here from you (could have a quick chat on the phone?) as I can use anything in my research.
I have tried the Alvis owners club but it looks like my request for a years free membership to carry out research, has been turned down.
Thanks in advance and I look forward to chatting to anyone regarding anything Alvis related.
Brads
I'm in third year at uni studying automotive design and so working on a major project for the length of the year. My design brief is celebrating 100 years of alvis, so designing the car for the year 2019. However, I would really like to get in contact with anyone who owns an alvis, and potentially see them and there car or just have a chat to them. I really need this to happen sometime soon as it'll form a main part of my research in understanding why an Alvis was chosen over, say, a jaguar or bentley etc... I'm studying in swansea but travel back to bristol on weekends, so if anyone owns one and lives here or there it would be great to hear from you. If anyone owns one and doesnt live here or there, it would still be great to here from you (could have a quick chat on the phone?) as I can use anything in my research.
I have tried the Alvis owners club but it looks like my request for a years free membership to carry out research, has been turned down.
Thanks in advance and I look forward to chatting to anyone regarding anything Alvis related.
Brads
You are working on your major project and you can't find £35 for a sub and access to the owners club?
Have you talked to your uni - sometimes they carry a fund to cover final year project "reasonable costs" - in the same way if you were accessing a rare archive they may help with travel costs, etc.
Given it's a bit of a strange one, you might need to be really clear to your dept as to why this is the most effective way to get the information.
Have you talked to your uni - sometimes they carry a fund to cover final year project "reasonable costs" - in the same way if you were accessing a rare archive they may help with travel costs, etc.
Given it's a bit of a strange one, you might need to be really clear to your dept as to why this is the most effective way to get the information.
Didn't Alan Stote just do this with his (Red Triangle) re-release of the 4.3 continuation? 
I assume you've seen the Ken Day books, or even just the AOC website so know the basic chronology.
After the 10/30 they eventually got to the 12/50 model, a modified version of which won a major race at Brooklands in 1923. Some of the 1924 race cars still exist. They then went in to FWD, which are known as Hells Confetti by their owners, but they did win their class at Le Mans. The cars were about 1.5 litre with a standard (Carbodies or Cross and Ellis) body so not really in the same market segment as Bentley. The cars got heavier and are much heavier than say the equivalent LeaF. Jaguar at this time was making side cars.
After the 1929 crash and the re introduction of the 12/50 and 12/60 cars, Alvis then went more up market with the Speed 20 (25 and 4.3) models. The London Agent, Chas Follet, got Van den Plas to make bodies. The cars were usually smaller (engined) and cheaper than the Derby Bentley. The now famed SS100 was a late comer and regarded by the founders of the VSCC as a spiv's car - they also didn't like MG's either. The auction trade is talking up the values of the short chassis VDP 4.3, so much so it was re announced at Goodwood.
Alvis were in the forefront of development, the Speed 20 SB had IFS and full syncro box, a world first.
After the war Alvis did the TC models and eventually the Graber style models, but by then Alvis were concentrating on the helicopter engine and armoured cars, they merged with Rover (then BL) and the car division was closed, the repair division became Red Triangle. The TC models were capable of 100mph with a heavy saloon body. The Graber/PW models were a nice gentleman's sport saloon. So to my mind Alvis were makers of Sporty cars for the middle class, not the wealthy like Bentley, or as down market as Jaguar. Today if we had a successful BL, Alvis would be doing a XF or M5 equivalent, in Aluminium.
Much of what Alvis did was the engineering, the overall look was determind by their body suppliers, Carbodies, Cross and Elis, Van den Plas, Mulliner, Park Ward and Graber. In the 1930's many chassis (Alvis, Bentley, Talbot, Lagonda) were fitted with very similar VdP bodies.
Which era are you going to base your design clues on? I have a 12/50, my brother in law a Speed 20, Dad has a MkVI Bentley and did have a few Mk2 Jags. I've driven them all, but they are products of their age.
Winter is a bad time to ask this question as there aren't so many events on, but you could try going to see Red Triangle, or even Earley in Abergavenny.
I assume you've seen the Ken Day books, or even just the AOC website so know the basic chronology.
After the 10/30 they eventually got to the 12/50 model, a modified version of which won a major race at Brooklands in 1923. Some of the 1924 race cars still exist. They then went in to FWD, which are known as Hells Confetti by their owners, but they did win their class at Le Mans. The cars were about 1.5 litre with a standard (Carbodies or Cross and Ellis) body so not really in the same market segment as Bentley. The cars got heavier and are much heavier than say the equivalent LeaF. Jaguar at this time was making side cars.
After the 1929 crash and the re introduction of the 12/50 and 12/60 cars, Alvis then went more up market with the Speed 20 (25 and 4.3) models. The London Agent, Chas Follet, got Van den Plas to make bodies. The cars were usually smaller (engined) and cheaper than the Derby Bentley. The now famed SS100 was a late comer and regarded by the founders of the VSCC as a spiv's car - they also didn't like MG's either. The auction trade is talking up the values of the short chassis VDP 4.3, so much so it was re announced at Goodwood.
Alvis were in the forefront of development, the Speed 20 SB had IFS and full syncro box, a world first.After the war Alvis did the TC models and eventually the Graber style models, but by then Alvis were concentrating on the helicopter engine and armoured cars, they merged with Rover (then BL) and the car division was closed, the repair division became Red Triangle. The TC models were capable of 100mph with a heavy saloon body. The Graber/PW models were a nice gentleman's sport saloon. So to my mind Alvis were makers of Sporty cars for the middle class, not the wealthy like Bentley, or as down market as Jaguar. Today if we had a successful BL, Alvis would be doing a XF or M5 equivalent, in Aluminium.
Much of what Alvis did was the engineering, the overall look was determind by their body suppliers, Carbodies, Cross and Elis, Van den Plas, Mulliner, Park Ward and Graber. In the 1930's many chassis (Alvis, Bentley, Talbot, Lagonda) were fitted with very similar VdP bodies.
Which era are you going to base your design clues on? I have a 12/50, my brother in law a Speed 20, Dad has a MkVI Bentley and did have a few Mk2 Jags. I've driven them all, but they are products of their age.
Winter is a bad time to ask this question as there aren't so many events on, but you could try going to see Red Triangle, or even Earley in Abergavenny.
The domain name http://www.redtriangle.co.uk/history.php might be worth exploring in your quest for more information about Alvis.
Another avenue which can work very well if you're interested in researching a subject with pictures is to go on to Google images and use the query
site:http://www.redtriangle.co.uk/
This will show all the pictures from this site indexed by Google.
By varying the sites you search you will be able to refine your search, so site:http://www.alvisoc.org will search the Alvis Owners Club.
Many people find that Google produces too many results, but with some advanced user tips it is amazing how you can narrow down what you are looking for - this can be a tricky topic to explain but this link on power user tips for Google might help http://www.website-doctor.com/google-power-user-ti... you refine your searches.
All the best
Charlie Willcock
Another avenue which can work very well if you're interested in researching a subject with pictures is to go on to Google images and use the query
site:http://www.redtriangle.co.uk/
This will show all the pictures from this site indexed by Google.
By varying the sites you search you will be able to refine your search, so site:http://www.alvisoc.org will search the Alvis Owners Club.
Many people find that Google produces too many results, but with some advanced user tips it is amazing how you can narrow down what you are looking for - this can be a tricky topic to explain but this link on power user tips for Google might help http://www.website-doctor.com/google-power-user-ti... you refine your searches.
All the best
Charlie Willcock
Edited by CharlieWebsite on Monday 8th November 18:19
Thanks for all the information (especially davepen (dave i assume)), you've provided me with alot of information and confirmed some queries i had regarding the coachbuilders.
In terms of design, it will be a celebration of 100 years (so conceptual for the year 2019) but will take styling cues and brand DNA from the last cars they produced, namely the TF21, The surfacing of the rear arch and shoulder line, is something traceable through many of the latest models and will definitely feature in the final design. Other factors i am working with is the keeping the proportions of the TF21 silhouette but giving the car a smaller DLO (daylight opening). I am also trying to include the twin headlights in the design, but not sure how this will turn out, as ultimately I would like smaller, thin lights.
thanks again
In terms of design, it will be a celebration of 100 years (so conceptual for the year 2019) but will take styling cues and brand DNA from the last cars they produced, namely the TF21, The surfacing of the rear arch and shoulder line, is something traceable through many of the latest models and will definitely feature in the final design. Other factors i am working with is the keeping the proportions of the TF21 silhouette but giving the car a smaller DLO (daylight opening). I am also trying to include the twin headlights in the design, but not sure how this will turn out, as ultimately I would like smaller, thin lights.
thanks again
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