Audi A8/ 7 series- seems like a 2nd hand bargan? Any good?
Discussion
Been looking at Luxo barges recently, and narrowed possible contenders down to Audi A8s and BMW 7 series. Was initially looking at more basic spec cars with the smaller motors at around the 10k mark, (seemingly decent 730d s for that) but then started to notcie far newer very high spec'd cars in the 750-760 (and L) range, as well as various powered Audi A8s with 4wd and up to 6litre w12s. These are available, newer, and for not a lot more cash (12-15k).
My situation is I have various cars for big long journeys and journeys that require 35mpg etc, but many of my weekly mileages are less than 100 miles now. So the attraction of the big car with a 3itre diesel compared to a 6 litre petrol (ie fuel consumption) is not a massive issue, (if the pretol is 2x the fuel bill it still wont kill me).
So anyone any experience of the big spec big engined verions of these barges? Never had as big a car as this, I knwo some brake services etc are pretty scary price wise and of course a 12cyl is three times more than a 4 for plugs, but surely the larger engines are less stressed so in pretty god nick? Also many of the 5-6 litre cars are say 5 years old and only done 35k miles, presuably in towns or low miles due to the fuel consumption. So surely a good buy potentially??
Are the leccys fragile? I have more concern perhaps on the beemer than the A8 about this, but I dont know why!
I just think a LWB version of these would be ace for cruising about in and taking the missus and sprog out in! May slow me down a bit, too!
My situation is I have various cars for big long journeys and journeys that require 35mpg etc, but many of my weekly mileages are less than 100 miles now. So the attraction of the big car with a 3itre diesel compared to a 6 litre petrol (ie fuel consumption) is not a massive issue, (if the pretol is 2x the fuel bill it still wont kill me).
So anyone any experience of the big spec big engined verions of these barges? Never had as big a car as this, I knwo some brake services etc are pretty scary price wise and of course a 12cyl is three times more than a 4 for plugs, but surely the larger engines are less stressed so in pretty god nick? Also many of the 5-6 litre cars are say 5 years old and only done 35k miles, presuably in towns or low miles due to the fuel consumption. So surely a good buy potentially??
Are the leccys fragile? I have more concern perhaps on the beemer than the A8 about this, but I dont know why!
I just think a LWB version of these would be ace for cruising about in and taking the missus and sprog out in! May slow me down a bit, too!
A8's have a bad reputation for gearboxes.... do a lot of googling on this before buying one.
I bought one with an alleged rebuilt box. 3 months later BANG and I'm 2.5K lighter in the bank balance.
Be also aware that even some "simple" jobs require much more labour as they have to dismantle huge amounts to get to the components. e.g. alternator took 5 hours in total to change........ A water leak cost over 1K to find involving new cambelts along the way.
They may be 10K motors now but they still have 60K motor running costs!
I bought one with an alleged rebuilt box. 3 months later BANG and I'm 2.5K lighter in the bank balance.
Be also aware that even some "simple" jobs require much more labour as they have to dismantle huge amounts to get to the components. e.g. alternator took 5 hours in total to change........ A water leak cost over 1K to find involving new cambelts along the way.
They may be 10K motors now but they still have 60K motor running costs!
It's more a case of there being a lot to go wrong, rather than them being any more fragile than a lesser specced car.
Depends how fussy you are, if you're buying a 10+ year old car and want every bell and whistle to work flawlessly you may be in for a bit of a hard time replacing sensors, switches, and whatever else keeps heated seats, electric window blinds and solar panel sunroofs working. Having said that I had my S8 for 12-14 months ish and had no electrical issues what-so-ever and everything worked perfectly.
A catastrophic failure resulting in an undrivable car isnt any more likely to occur in one of these than a 10 year old eco-box, everything is ECU driven these days, even my mums jazz. OF course the price of a new part may differ a bit but that's what breakers are for!
Depends how fussy you are, if you're buying a 10+ year old car and want every bell and whistle to work flawlessly you may be in for a bit of a hard time replacing sensors, switches, and whatever else keeps heated seats, electric window blinds and solar panel sunroofs working. Having said that I had my S8 for 12-14 months ish and had no electrical issues what-so-ever and everything worked perfectly.
A catastrophic failure resulting in an undrivable car isnt any more likely to occur in one of these than a 10 year old eco-box, everything is ECU driven these days, even my mums jazz. OF course the price of a new part may differ a bit but that's what breakers are for!
hmm, awkward age and price. In that kind of zone these cars are:
Out of warranty
Still depreciating like you can't imagine
Starting to get a few problems here and there
Too expensive to scrap if something goes bigly awry
Too nice to treat as a banger
Still worth keeping-up expensive FSH and having expensive preventative maintenance.
My advice is an either/or:
Spend twice as much and keep it forever
or
Spend 20% as much and treat it like a grouchy pit-pony.
Out of warranty
Still depreciating like you can't imagine
Starting to get a few problems here and there
Too expensive to scrap if something goes bigly awry
Too nice to treat as a banger
Still worth keeping-up expensive FSH and having expensive preventative maintenance.
My advice is an either/or:
Spend twice as much and keep it forever
or
Spend 20% as much and treat it like a grouchy pit-pony.
I had a D3 4.2 A8 that was just out of warranty. Lovely car but it did have some electrical issues which cost me a fair whack to sort out.
Personally I'd spend £15-£20k on an A8 or 7 series that has warranty or is from a main dealer.
Or, as has been said, buy something like this for much less money...
2000 BMW 7 SERIES 740i V8 4dr Auto Saloon
Trade Seller: www.ultimate7.co.uk
48,000 miles, First registered on the 18th of January 2000, this BMW 740i Sport is finished in metallic titan silver with black leather comfort sports seats piped black and walnut detailing. Fitted with 18" M-Tech parallel spoke alloys, the car has covered 48,000 miles and has a full BMW service history. The specification includes: sat nav, tv with teletext, dual zone climate controlled air conditioning, cruise control, front and rear park distance control, dynamic stability control, electric sunroof, auto dimming rear view mirror, rain sensing wipers, heated seats, fully automated open and close boot lid operation with soft close, 6 CD auto-changer, high gloss shadowline. The car has a full BMW service history with many receipts, an inspection two service has recently been completed. Originally a BMW car then one private owner from six months old. Sold with 12 months MOT, taxed until the end of December. Presented in superb condition throughout. Cost in excess of £57,000. We specialise in the sale on the 7 series. For more details, visit our website at ultimate7.co.uk. £5,995
Personally I'd spend £15-£20k on an A8 or 7 series that has warranty or is from a main dealer.
Or, as has been said, buy something like this for much less money...
2000 BMW 7 SERIES 740i V8 4dr Auto Saloon
Trade Seller: www.ultimate7.co.uk
48,000 miles, First registered on the 18th of January 2000, this BMW 740i Sport is finished in metallic titan silver with black leather comfort sports seats piped black and walnut detailing. Fitted with 18" M-Tech parallel spoke alloys, the car has covered 48,000 miles and has a full BMW service history. The specification includes: sat nav, tv with teletext, dual zone climate controlled air conditioning, cruise control, front and rear park distance control, dynamic stability control, electric sunroof, auto dimming rear view mirror, rain sensing wipers, heated seats, fully automated open and close boot lid operation with soft close, 6 CD auto-changer, high gloss shadowline. The car has a full BMW service history with many receipts, an inspection two service has recently been completed. Originally a BMW car then one private owner from six months old. Sold with 12 months MOT, taxed until the end of December. Presented in superb condition throughout. Cost in excess of £57,000. We specialise in the sale on the 7 series. For more details, visit our website at ultimate7.co.uk. £5,995
Edited by edo on Thursday 2nd December 15:41
I own a 7 Series around the age and mileage you're looking at, so I think I can guide you in the right direction, albeit that I bought mine at two years old with 19,000 on the clock from a BMW stealer. I can honestly say that three years and 53,000 miles later the car still feels box fresh although this might be partly down to the fact it gets a full valet once a month from the Albanian car washers round the corner and I've always been thorough with servicing and maintenance, originally with BMW and now a really good indie. I only use BMW parts (you can't really use anything else) and the tyres have been replaced with OEM Pirelli P Zeros.
Running costs are pretty good. My car has cost no more in consumables than the Mini Cooper S I drove for a couple of years before it and for those niggly things that have gone wrong the parts have been surprisingly cheap. A good indie is worth his weight in gold for stuff like this as BMW stealers will rinse you dry for jobs like a sticking door handle or a bit of trim that needs some stripping down.
I'd love a petrol 7 but the 730d has stood me in good stead so far and returns astonishing economy for such a big car. On some runs I've seen 46 mpg at times and this for a car that can show my wife's Z4 a clean pair of heels when it wants to. Don't worry about the big car thing as like all BMWs the 7 seems to shrink around you on the move and the drive is impeccable with a super smooth auto box, sorted ride and of course the driven wheels in the right place. When it comes to parking you've got PDC front and rear with a visualisation of the car to help. It's a cinch.
I'd agree with the idea of paying a bit more to get a really good one and keep it. I'm keeping mine for at least another two years and it'll be seven years old then, an age I'd never normally keep a motor until but I honestly can't think of anything that has such comfort, performance, handling and toys, yet still three years on people climb in and say, 'wow, this is such a nice car', which is always nice!
Running costs are pretty good. My car has cost no more in consumables than the Mini Cooper S I drove for a couple of years before it and for those niggly things that have gone wrong the parts have been surprisingly cheap. A good indie is worth his weight in gold for stuff like this as BMW stealers will rinse you dry for jobs like a sticking door handle or a bit of trim that needs some stripping down.
I'd love a petrol 7 but the 730d has stood me in good stead so far and returns astonishing economy for such a big car. On some runs I've seen 46 mpg at times and this for a car that can show my wife's Z4 a clean pair of heels when it wants to. Don't worry about the big car thing as like all BMWs the 7 seems to shrink around you on the move and the drive is impeccable with a super smooth auto box, sorted ride and of course the driven wheels in the right place. When it comes to parking you've got PDC front and rear with a visualisation of the car to help. It's a cinch.
I'd agree with the idea of paying a bit more to get a really good one and keep it. I'm keeping mine for at least another two years and it'll be seven years old then, an age I'd never normally keep a motor until but I honestly can't think of anything that has such comfort, performance, handling and toys, yet still three years on people climb in and say, 'wow, this is such a nice car', which is always nice!
poo at Paul's said:
Well I have found a 1998 A8 2.8 non Quattro with a genuine 30k miles and one owner for less than 2k. Naybe worth a look.
I dont like the "older" 7 series like is shown above although it looks like a nice car. Prefer the later shape from 2002 onwards. Particularly for the interior.
That sounds very promising indeed if there's nothing else wrong with it. Sounds pretty cheap...but at that level risks are not big ones.I dont like the "older" 7 series like is shown above although it looks like a nice car. Prefer the later shape from 2002 onwards. Particularly for the interior.
ETA: Is it gold or pale green?
Edited by BarnatosGhost on Thursday 2nd December 16:58
Thought I'd add my 2ps worth...
A new battry and everything still works as expected though it's a low millage example at < 60k on the clock!
Dan
poo at Paul's said:
Are the leccys fragile? I have more concern perhaps on the beemer than the A8 about this, but I dont know why!
From what I've seen no. I've had the use of a D2 S8 which has I got running after sitting for a few years for a friend. When it was recovered the recovery ppl tryed to get them to flog it to them as the 'ecu' is probably dead as it wouldnt start.A new battry and everything still works as expected though it's a low millage example at < 60k on the clock!
entwisi said:
They may be 10K motors now but they still have 60K motor running costs!
Have a look at some prices for parts to see what your likly to be paying out. The S8 engine bay has very little room for any work so I guess alot of it is a engine out job!.Dan
BarnatosGhost said:
poo at Paul's said:
Well I have found a 1998 A8 2.8 non Quattro with a genuine 30k miles and one owner for less than 2k. Naybe worth a look.
I dont like the "older" 7 series like is shown above although it looks like a nice car. Prefer the later shape from 2002 onwards. Particularly for the interior.
That sounds very promising indeed if there's nothing else wrong with it. Sounds pretty cheap...but at that level risks are not big ones.I dont like the "older" 7 series like is shown above although it looks like a nice car. Prefer the later shape from 2002 onwards. Particularly for the interior.
ETA: Is it gold or pale green?
Edited by BarnatosGhost on Thursday 2nd December 16:58
But it is not all perfect, (well it is now!) but it appears it was Cat D in 2007 after a "minor tump" up the front. Guy showed me piccies, was light, needed an OS wing, bonnet and bumper only the headlight survived. Still drove, he video'd himself doing so (!), no suspension or anything.
I got some photos done yesterday, it is really clean and the engine bay looks properly like new. Both keys and history with last service at Audi in May 10 inluding new cats.
But it doesnt have cruise control which is a shame.
Still interested if it is sub £2k I suppose. It's a non Quattro too which I am not is good or bad. Less to worry about I suppose.
Seems like a lot of car, not double glazed though either. Maybe worth a go to run about in for a year or so and see how I like big cars. At that price, if the gearbox goes I can just break it for panels etc!
poo at Paul's said:
BarnatosGhost said:
poo at Paul's said:
Well I have found a 1998 A8 2.8 non Quattro with a genuine 30k miles and one owner for less than 2k. Naybe worth a look.
I dont like the "older" 7 series like is shown above although it looks like a nice car. Prefer the later shape from 2002 onwards. Particularly for the interior.
That sounds very promising indeed if there's nothing else wrong with it. Sounds pretty cheap...but at that level risks are not big ones.I dont like the "older" 7 series like is shown above although it looks like a nice car. Prefer the later shape from 2002 onwards. Particularly for the interior.
ETA: Is it gold or pale green?
Edited by BarnatosGhost on Thursday 2nd December 16:58
But it is not all perfect, (well it is now!) but it appears it was Cat D in 2007 after a "minor tump" up the front. Guy showed me piccies, was light, needed an OS wing, bonnet and bumper only the headlight survived. Still drove, he video'd himself doing so (!), no suspension or anything.
I got some photos done yesterday, it is really clean and the engine bay looks properly like new. Both keys and history with last service at Audi in May 10 inluding new cats.
But it doesnt have cruise control which is a shame.
Still interested if it is sub £2k I suppose. It's a non Quattro too which I am not is good or bad. Less to worry about I suppose.
Seems like a lot of car, not double glazed though either. Maybe worth a go to run about in for a year or so and see how I like big cars. At that price, if the gearbox goes I can just break it for panels etc!
My dads A8 MY07 had some software issue that required a £2000 part under warranty, likewise the gearwheels are broken so the MMI interface is either up or part way down. It did do something amazing the other day buy lowering a window and opening the sunroof a bit, all on its own. Only done it the once though.
But he does get over 35mpg from it, he drives relatively normally and it is very barge like - it does not encourage you to rag it.
But he does get over 35mpg from it, he drives relatively normally and it is very barge like - it does not encourage you to rag it.
It's true that the parts, and perhaps the time, for any repairs is likely to be more for a 'barge' than for a normal car, but this has to be balanced against the fact that the 7 series and A8 are the 'flagship' (mainstream) vehicles for the respective manufacturers, and are engineered and built accordingly.
poo at Paul's said:
Been looking at Luxo barges recently, and narrowed possible contenders down to Audi A8s and BMW 7 series. Was initially looking at more basic spec cars with the smaller motors at around the 10k mark, (seemingly decent 730d s for that) but then started to notcie far newer very high spec'd cars in the 750-760 (and L) range, as well as various powered Audi A8s with 4wd and up to 6litre w12s. These are available, newer, and for not a lot more cash (12-15k).
My situation is I have various cars for big long journeys and journeys that require 35mpg etc, but many of my weekly mileages are less than 100 miles now. So the attraction of the big car with a 3itre diesel compared to a 6 litre petrol (ie fuel consumption) is not a massive issue, (if the pretol is 2x the fuel bill it still wont kill me).
So anyone any experience of the big spec big engined verions of these barges? Never had as big a car as this, I knwo some brake services etc are pretty scary price wise and of course a 12cyl is three times more than a 4 for plugs, but surely the larger engines are less stressed so in pretty god nick? Also many of the 5-6 litre cars are say 5 years old and only done 35k miles, presuably in towns or low miles due to the fuel consumption. So surely a good buy potentially??
Are the leccys fragile? I have more concern perhaps on the beemer than the A8 about this, but I dont know why!
I just think a LWB version of these would be ace for cruising about in and taking the missus and sprog out in! May slow me down a bit, too!
I own an Audi A8 3.0 TDI (2005) as my daily drive, it is a great car which I have owned for 2 years, I had a costly problem with the electronic parking brake mechanism which cost over £800 to get rectified and several trips to the Audi garage, apart from an emissions warning light on the dashboard recently (which turned out to be nothing)My situation is I have various cars for big long journeys and journeys that require 35mpg etc, but many of my weekly mileages are less than 100 miles now. So the attraction of the big car with a 3itre diesel compared to a 6 litre petrol (ie fuel consumption) is not a massive issue, (if the pretol is 2x the fuel bill it still wont kill me).
So anyone any experience of the big spec big engined verions of these barges? Never had as big a car as this, I knwo some brake services etc are pretty scary price wise and of course a 12cyl is three times more than a 4 for plugs, but surely the larger engines are less stressed so in pretty god nick? Also many of the 5-6 litre cars are say 5 years old and only done 35k miles, presuably in towns or low miles due to the fuel consumption. So surely a good buy potentially??
Are the leccys fragile? I have more concern perhaps on the beemer than the A8 about this, but I dont know why!
I just think a LWB version of these would be ace for cruising about in and taking the missus and sprog out in! May slow me down a bit, too!
The car is superb, starts on the button every day, I usually clock up around 15k miles per annum and long journeys are a pleasure.
One word of warning, if the battery goes dead you will get warning lights on the dashboard which can be reset in Audi for a paltry sum.
Overall, I would highly recommend it.
I had an 03 plate 4.2Q A8 with all the bits on it (blue with tan leather and 20" wheels). It had Paddles on the steering wheel and dynamic ride I think its called, basically able to raise/lower the car. Bought at 4.5yrs old for £16k with 55k mls on it, including the remainder of a 5yr service/warranty pack. In 2yrs of ownership Audi swopped the battery and indicator switch and I had to pay for a satnav unit (£800). Lovely car, alot lighter and better looking than the 7series equivalent. Managed 31mpg on one run in heavy traffic otherwise low 20s. I'd buy another one if I was going up and down motorways on a regular basis. Mechanically these cars are solid like most cars upto 100k mls and then things can start to fail.
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