Exit Mercedes ?
Discussion
sparta6 said:
Made more sense before Coronavirus hit. I highly doubt with the debt that Stroll has taken on to buy Aston Martin that the team will be as solvent as it might have been during the winter.Ever since the rumours began I've felt there is probably some truth about him and stroll doing 'something' together. Then stroll bought in to Aston Martin... Thus proving some parts of the rumours were based on reality, albeit distorted in how it was originally reported.
And I feel it's likely there is more to come, probably involving Toto in some way, as he's been at the centre of all these rumours. Also friends with, and previously co invested with stroll. I'm not going to be bold enough to guess exactly what the overall plan is, but I do get the impression stroll buying in to AM was part of a larger plan.
And now the plan could well change in any case, the whole world has changed since the rumours began..
If it were true, and Toto did go to tracing point and also bought in to AM, I could see the team could make a strong battle for third or at least fourth in the championship and quite possibly help boost AM's sales significantly. Toto at AM? Something feels right about that to me.
And I feel it's likely there is more to come, probably involving Toto in some way, as he's been at the centre of all these rumours. Also friends with, and previously co invested with stroll. I'm not going to be bold enough to guess exactly what the overall plan is, but I do get the impression stroll buying in to AM was part of a larger plan.
And now the plan could well change in any case, the whole world has changed since the rumours began..
If it were true, and Toto did go to tracing point and also bought in to AM, I could see the team could make a strong battle for third or at least fourth in the championship and quite possibly help boost AM's sales significantly. Toto at AM? Something feels right about that to me.
Seven years at Mercedes may well be enough, can't imagine a guy like Toto has ever spent seven years in a single role in his career prior. May well want a new project. If you wanted a project lower down the grid, Aston Martin would be an alluring prospect. He is heavily financially invested in the Mercedes racing effort too though so he wouldn't want to upset the apple cart too much and he'd want a solid successor in place. Who is that? can't imagine James Allison wanting it.
So Toto Wolff is going to leave the current top F1 team for a mid-pack team that changes owner every couple of years, one assume to try and make IT the top team in F1. Or to put it another way, he's going to go and work for someone else to try and make their team better than the one he owns 30% of. Humm...
//j17 said:
So Toto Wolff is going to leave the current top F1 team for a mid-pack team that changes owner every couple of years, one assume to try and make IT the top team in F1. Or to put it another way, he's going to go and work for someone else to try and make their team better than the one he owns 30% of. Humm...
Depends how he judges success. He's done winning in F1... Perhaps he sees AM itself as a new project, a firm he can turn around and add value to - via the accompanying F1 team which he can also elevate. He can sell his 30% in Mercedes F1 to buy in to AM. If he wants to do it, it's all on the table, assuming stroll does want him at AM, which seems fairly likely.The guy gets bored and looks for new challenges. Pretty typical in many an entrepreneur.
And when Merc F1 pull out and just become an engine supplier, how much is his shareholding worth? He will know that it is worthless already.
Assuming that this news is correct, and it's come from BCE, so some caution is required. He is leaving for a midfield team because Mercedes are pulling out, and he either joins Mrs W in Formula E or does something else.
I suspect that he will broker a deal to sell the Mercedes operation to himself and Stroll, keep the base and re-name it Aston Martin. It makes sense to do that rather than spend money expanding the Force India/Racing Point premises at Silverstone, which they got planning permission to do last November. They can sell those premises with the benefit of planning permission.
Merc will then keep the F1 engine operation and supply Aston, Williams and McLaren
Assuming that this news is correct, and it's come from BCE, so some caution is required. He is leaving for a midfield team because Mercedes are pulling out, and he either joins Mrs W in Formula E or does something else.
I suspect that he will broker a deal to sell the Mercedes operation to himself and Stroll, keep the base and re-name it Aston Martin. It makes sense to do that rather than spend money expanding the Force India/Racing Point premises at Silverstone, which they got planning permission to do last November. They can sell those premises with the benefit of planning permission.
Merc will then keep the F1 engine operation and supply Aston, Williams and McLaren
sgtBerbatov said:
Made more sense before Coronavirus hit. I highly doubt with the debt that Stroll has taken on to buy Aston Martin that the team will be as solvent as it might have been during the winter.
The flipside of this means Toto can acquire a larger equity slice in Aston Martin at a lower price.sparta6 said:
"according to Bernie Ecclestone"I thought he would be in deep isolation and keeping his trap shut at the moment.
I personally don't take any of Bernie's comments seriously anymore. He has been very sharp and clever through his life but he's now at an age at which the brain stops learning and starts rejecting - he's a fully baked fruitcake! And I hope he'll hang around because like it or or, he's part of F1 history.
But even without Bernie's comments, I don't struggle to believe Toto might be looking for the next challenge - it's what he's done all his life. Get Aston Martin back in to fashion? That's the sort of job role he could excel at I think.
Has anyone reading this ever met an Aston driver that isn't an F1 fan!? I know three, and all are F1 fans.. they'll be very happy if Toto ends up at the helm.
But even without Bernie's comments, I don't struggle to believe Toto might be looking for the next challenge - it's what he's done all his life. Get Aston Martin back in to fashion? That's the sort of job role he could excel at I think.
Has anyone reading this ever met an Aston driver that isn't an F1 fan!? I know three, and all are F1 fans.. they'll be very happy if Toto ends up at the helm.
Mr Tidy said:
sparta6 said:
The flipside of this means Toto can acquire a larger equity slice in Aston Martin at a lower price.
True, but who needs a bigger slice of a company that seems to be going down the pan - yet again!Now they buy in all the tech stuff, and a lot more.. from Mercedes. That should have been a good solution but sadly they then also got hammered by the EU emissions levy - and now.. the world has new problems which will hammer them yet again.
If they can get enough new cash to survive and further evolve their range however, I think the core brand is strong enough to eventually deliver a return on that investment. Perhaps Toto and Stroll feel the same way.
TheDeuce said:
The AM brand itself is strong, it's just the cars for a long time were pretty dated. As a company they're simply too small to develop the tech kit (think of latest gen BMW i-drive etc) that car buyers expect these days.
Now they buy in all the tech stuff, and a lot more.. from Mercedes. That should have been a good solution but sadly they then also got hammered by the EU emissions levy - and now.. the world has new problems which will hammer them yet again.
If they can get enough new cash to survive and further evolve their range however, I think the core brand is strong enough to eventually deliver a return on that investment. Perhaps Toto and Stroll feel the same way.
Mercedes also own a share in Aston themselves don't forget. Unless a real disaster happens to them as a company they won't pull out of F1, it makes more sense to have Force Racing Aston Point as a B team with Stroll and his cronies funding it and an engine/parts discount. Now they buy in all the tech stuff, and a lot more.. from Mercedes. That should have been a good solution but sadly they then also got hammered by the EU emissions levy - and now.. the world has new problems which will hammer them yet again.
If they can get enough new cash to survive and further evolve their range however, I think the core brand is strong enough to eventually deliver a return on that investment. Perhaps Toto and Stroll feel the same way.
DanielSan said:
Bernie's also said he would have cancelled the whole season by now if he was in charge, and that's bulls
t as well.
Exactly he is full of st as well. t he would have attempted to run the thing at any costs he is ruthless.Just another sensational story to stay relevant another Eddie Jordan
Bo_apex said:
SmoothCriminal said:
Exactly he is full of st he would have attempted to run the thing at any costs he is ruthless.
That, or maybe he's mellowed with aget he would have attempted to run the thing at any costs he is ruthless.sparta6 said:
Complete tosh!It must be hard being an F1 journalist / blogger when no racing is occurring.
rdjohn said:
Complete tosh!
It must be hard being an F1 journalist / blogger when no racing is occurring.
It makes no sense at all. Toto isn’t just a team manager at Mercedes, he’s a shareholder in the company. He isn’t just going to leave the team and turn up somewhere else, when he’s invested in the whole project. It must be hard being an F1 journalist / blogger when no racing is occurring.
The most likely of all the weird scenarios, is that Mercedes the car company want to get out of F1 as a team (but why would they, the team turns a profit and they’re winning everything!), and Toto buys them out with Stroll’s help, leaving the two teams to operate in a similar way to Red Bull and Toto Rosso with Toto in the Marko role.
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