Which large diesel auto estate - up to £4k?
Discussion
I've already ruled out the A6 V6 TDi and the E320CDi so I'm now posting on General Gassing to see what else is left.
There have been suggestions of the E39 5 series, though I'm not overly impressed with the economy. Doesn't look to be too much between the 525d and the 530d as they both only manage 33mpg combined. I'd also have to get over the image thing.
Only other cars I can think of are the V70 D5 and the 9-5 2.2 TiD. At the moment I'm leaning towards the Saab, as you can get a newer car for your money than any of the others.
Any suggestions / comments / recommendations - any other cars?
[ETA - there's also the Passat, though they seem very expensive at the moment. Also, I guess I'd have to stay away from the 2.5V6 TDi for the same reasons as the A6.]
There have been suggestions of the E39 5 series, though I'm not overly impressed with the economy. Doesn't look to be too much between the 525d and the 530d as they both only manage 33mpg combined. I'd also have to get over the image thing.
Only other cars I can think of are the V70 D5 and the 9-5 2.2 TiD. At the moment I'm leaning towards the Saab, as you can get a newer car for your money than any of the others.
Any suggestions / comments / recommendations - any other cars?
[ETA - there's also the Passat, though they seem very expensive at the moment. Also, I guess I'd have to stay away from the 2.5V6 TDi for the same reasons as the A6.]
Edited by kprm77 on Monday 8th August 10:22
Not quite as smooth, but an A6 1.9 TDI, can be remapped to give slightly more power than the 2.5 TDI, and still much better economy. And possibly more reliable as well.
Mine is around 170-180bhp, and I'm averaging around 50mpg. The normal commute is pretty sedate, but last few tanks have had some cruising at a few too many leptons, but overall economy doesn't seem to change.
Typically used to get at most 600 miles out of a tank, since the remap its now more like 650 miles. Despite a mildly heavy right foot.
Mine is around 170-180bhp, and I'm averaging around 50mpg. The normal commute is pretty sedate, but last few tanks have had some cruising at a few too many leptons, but overall economy doesn't seem to change.
Typically used to get at most 600 miles out of a tank, since the remap its now more like 650 miles. Despite a mildly heavy right foot.
clonmult said:
Not quite as smooth, but an A6 1.9 TDI, can be remapped to give slightly more power than the 2.5 TDI, and still much better economy. And possibly more reliable as well.
Mine is around 170-180bhp, and I'm averaging around 50mpg. The normal commute is pretty sedate, but last few tanks have had some cruising at a few too many leptons, but overall economy doesn't seem to change.
Typically used to get at most 600 miles out of a tank, since the remap its now more like 650 miles. Despite a mildly heavy right foot.
Thanks for that - but if I get an 1.9A6 auto, won't that have the same problems with the auto box (CVT)?Mine is around 170-180bhp, and I'm averaging around 50mpg. The normal commute is pretty sedate, but last few tanks have had some cruising at a few too many leptons, but overall economy doesn't seem to change.
Typically used to get at most 600 miles out of a tank, since the remap its now more like 650 miles. Despite a mildly heavy right foot.
I had a PD130 Skoda Superb remapped - my economy went down from 44mpg to 38mpg. Did like using the power which may explain things...
Any comments on the BM's - what's the real world economy like? I do mostly motorway stuff, so although my current 1.9TiD 9-5 has an official combined figure of 37.2mpg, I'm averaging closer to 45mpg on my commute. So, if the BM 530d can reasonably be expected to achieve over 40mpg on the same run with a light foot, then I'd be interested...
A 525/530d auto can just about do 40mpg if you are sensible. It won't do any more and it will only do that on a motorway at no more than 70mph.
The Audi's do indeed have the CVT box which is good from the point of view that it is the only auto from that era which does not result in a big drop in mpg but it can have issues at high mileage.
Volvo V70 would be a good choice but in your price range will have a lot of miles and the autos also give problems - a good choice if you go manual.
The Audi's do indeed have the CVT box which is good from the point of view that it is the only auto from that era which does not result in a big drop in mpg but it can have issues at high mileage.
Volvo V70 would be a good choice but in your price range will have a lot of miles and the autos also give problems - a good choice if you go manual.
I had an E39 530d (2002 car / 193bhp engine, 5-speed auto), bought it with 40K on the clock, remapped at 70K and then sold it at 175K
I recall averaging 36-37mpg before the remap and closer to 40mpg afterwards. I did a hell of a lot of motorway driving however these were always 'fast, hard' runs not economy focussed in the slightest. I lent the car to my brother once and on a run between Gloucester and Basingstoke one rush hour he got 48mpg by driving carefully and because the M4 was sitting at 60mph in all three lanes.
Towards the end of the time I had the car I used it on a 16 mile station commute based on A-roads and some in-town driving and it was scoring about 36mpg.
Overall a fantastic car and I wouldn't hesitate to have another if I were spending £3-6k. There seems to be a premium for tourings especially in Sport guise that don't have huge mileage so you may struggle to get what you want for £4k. If you can manage with a saloon (the boot is still very accomodating) you will get more car for the money.
Running costs weren't particularly low but as I was doing extreme mileage (50K in one very busy year) I really did service it with no expense spared, it even had some £1k+ main dealer services towards the end of my ownership. I never had any problems with the auto box (never serviced it either) nor injectors, but it did require a new turbo at 72K which BMW contributed towards (despite the car being out of warranty, remapped, imported and non main-dealer supplied)
I recall averaging 36-37mpg before the remap and closer to 40mpg afterwards. I did a hell of a lot of motorway driving however these were always 'fast, hard' runs not economy focussed in the slightest. I lent the car to my brother once and on a run between Gloucester and Basingstoke one rush hour he got 48mpg by driving carefully and because the M4 was sitting at 60mph in all three lanes.
Towards the end of the time I had the car I used it on a 16 mile station commute based on A-roads and some in-town driving and it was scoring about 36mpg.
Overall a fantastic car and I wouldn't hesitate to have another if I were spending £3-6k. There seems to be a premium for tourings especially in Sport guise that don't have huge mileage so you may struggle to get what you want for £4k. If you can manage with a saloon (the boot is still very accomodating) you will get more car for the money.
Running costs weren't particularly low but as I was doing extreme mileage (50K in one very busy year) I really did service it with no expense spared, it even had some £1k+ main dealer services towards the end of my ownership. I never had any problems with the auto box (never serviced it either) nor injectors, but it did require a new turbo at 72K which BMW contributed towards (despite the car being out of warranty, remapped, imported and non main-dealer supplied)
I can't say I'd recommend the E320 CDi, those shape E classes are not brilliant in all honesty. The build quality is disappointing to say the least and the rust issue is not overblown at all, my dad's E240 went from completely rust free to cornflakes in three years and I have never seen an S210 without tinworm of some sort. Rust on the rear quater panels is also a major issue as they are part of an entire side body panel which would need replacing and is a big job, they even manage to rust throught the paint on the roof which is impressive seeing as there were no blemishes in the paint on it. The roof is also a very thin sheet of metal which makes a racket when it rains and allows for a lot of wind noise at motorway speeds. The front suspension mounts are also weak so the front suspension is another fairly common failiure point, especially if the rust spreads to it and you drive on roads full of potholes. Another major disappointment was the seats, they're awful: they lack any sort of lumbar support and are incredibly difficult to get in to a comfortable position. The centrally mounted single winscreen wiper can also fail and is not cheap to put right, wears through wiper blades at an astonishing rate and is incredibly noisy. If you really do want one then I would spend no more than £2k on an E300 TD because at the very least you can part it out for roughly what it cost you if it fails in some way. On the plus side they are mechanically very solid, have an absolutely cavernous boot and vast quantities of cabin space and offer cracking vfm.
With regards to the E39 it may not be as good on fuel, but it is a far superior car. They are good to drive, very refined in SE trim with small wheels and feel very solidly put together. They are also generally less likely to throw big bills at you with your only major concerns being the cooling system and the gearbox. The cooling system is pretty fragile and if there are no reciepts to show that the system has been replaced recently then you need to have it done and the gearbox failiure, though expensive, is not particularly common and is fairly easy to see coming with reluctance to change gear and very notchy changes.
From what I've heard the Audi A6 is a pretty solid car which should not let you down, but the gearbox is a common failiure point. If you do go for an A6 then avoid the multitronic CVT box, they tend to lunch themselves leaving you with a £3-4k bill to put it right. The seats are also on the uncomfortable side of firm IMO.
The Saab and Volvo are good options, but neither are as big as the Merc or BMW. The Saab in particular is very narrow, so if width is a deciding factor then the Saab may not be the best bet. The V70 is a very good car and your budget will get you a good one, but they do have problems with the Electronic Throttle Module on 01 and 02 cars. Both are otherwise very practical, reliable and exceptionally comfortable.
HTH.
With regards to the E39 it may not be as good on fuel, but it is a far superior car. They are good to drive, very refined in SE trim with small wheels and feel very solidly put together. They are also generally less likely to throw big bills at you with your only major concerns being the cooling system and the gearbox. The cooling system is pretty fragile and if there are no reciepts to show that the system has been replaced recently then you need to have it done and the gearbox failiure, though expensive, is not particularly common and is fairly easy to see coming with reluctance to change gear and very notchy changes.
From what I've heard the Audi A6 is a pretty solid car which should not let you down, but the gearbox is a common failiure point. If you do go for an A6 then avoid the multitronic CVT box, they tend to lunch themselves leaving you with a £3-4k bill to put it right. The seats are also on the uncomfortable side of firm IMO.
The Saab and Volvo are good options, but neither are as big as the Merc or BMW. The Saab in particular is very narrow, so if width is a deciding factor then the Saab may not be the best bet. The V70 is a very good car and your budget will get you a good one, but they do have problems with the Electronic Throttle Module on 01 and 02 cars. Both are otherwise very practical, reliable and exceptionally comfortable.
HTH.
kprm77 said:
Thanks for that - but if I get an 1.9A6 auto, won't that have the same problems with the auto box (CVT)?
I had a PD130 Skoda Superb remapped - my economy went down from 44mpg to 38mpg. Did like using the power which may explain things...
Any comments on the BM's - what's the real world economy like? I do mostly motorway stuff, so although my current 1.9TiD 9-5 has an official combined figure of 37.2mpg, I'm averaging closer to 45mpg on my commute. So, if the BM 530d can reasonably be expected to achieve over 40mpg on the same run with a light foot, then I'd be interested...
Not got a clue on the gearbox; I've got a 5sp manual, no idea what the auto options were on the 1.9TDI. But I thought it was a regular autobox, not a CVT.I had a PD130 Skoda Superb remapped - my economy went down from 44mpg to 38mpg. Did like using the power which may explain things...
Any comments on the BM's - what's the real world economy like? I do mostly motorway stuff, so although my current 1.9TiD 9-5 has an official combined figure of 37.2mpg, I'm averaging closer to 45mpg on my commute. So, if the BM 530d can reasonably be expected to achieve over 40mpg on the same run with a light foot, then I'd be interested...
chrisispringles said:
The Saab and Volvo are good options, but neither are as big as the Merc or BMW.
From Parkers..V70 - 485l
E39 - 410l
SAAB 9-5 - 416l
E Class - 650l !
Surely the Merc isn't 50% bigger than the others?
They must measure it to the ceiling whilst the others may do it to top of seats.
Anyway V70 would be my choice. It will be newer than both the Merc & Beemer and the D5 engine is fantastic. Great seats too.
GreatGranny said:
From Parkers..
V70 - 485l
E39 - 410l
SAAB 9-5 - 416l
E Class - 650l !
Surely the Merc isn't 50% bigger than the others?
They must measure it to the ceiling whilst the others may do it to top of seats.
Anyway V70 would be my choice. It will be newer than both the Merc & Beemer and the D5 engine is fantastic. Great seats too.
Comparing my dad's old E class estate to his Volvo 850 and E39 I'd say it definitely feels and awful lot bigger than either of them, it really is huge in there.V70 - 485l
E39 - 410l
SAAB 9-5 - 416l
E Class - 650l !
Surely the Merc isn't 50% bigger than the others?
They must measure it to the ceiling whilst the others may do it to top of seats.
Anyway V70 would be my choice. It will be newer than both the Merc & Beemer and the D5 engine is fantastic. Great seats too.
I would recommend the Honda Accord diesel, I have the saloon version, I've had it nearly 6 years now, and apart from 1 set of tyres, 1 set of brake pads, and the usual services, it's been the very best car that I've ever had (& I'm an old fart!)
See here for a cheap one. £3,200ono
http://www.autotrader.co.uk/classified/advert/2011...
See here for a cheap one. £3,200ono
http://www.autotrader.co.uk/classified/advert/2011...
Gafferjim said:
I would recommend the Honda Accord diesel, I have the saloon version, I've had it nearly 6 years now, and apart from 1 set of tyres, 1 set of brake pads, and the usual services, it's been the very best car that I've ever had (& I'm an old fart!)
See here for a cheap one. £3,200ono
http://www.autotrader.co.uk/classified/advert/2011...
Definately like an Accord, though they don't seem to be any Auto's. I may have to consider a manual as there's a lot more choice and the economy is better..See here for a cheap one. £3,200ono
http://www.autotrader.co.uk/classified/advert/2011...
What's the real world economy of the V70 D5 like? Most of my miles are on M-Way / Dual Carriageway / quiet A-roads, and as I said I manage mid 40's in my Saab 1.9TiD auto with ease (official combined is 37.2mpg)
Official figure for the D5 is 34.9mpg - would it be reasonable to expect low 40's if driven lightly on the M-Way??
Official figure for the D5 is 34.9mpg - would it be reasonable to expect low 40's if driven lightly on the M-Way??
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