why is engine oil so incredibly expensive????
Discussion
I just priced up an oil change for my lotus... 5L of 15w-50 mobil 1 - £49!!!!!!!!!!!!!!
im sure it was less than half that a few years ago..
"Discuss"
(ps - the first person to say "its a small price to pay to keep the engine running" or similar gets a re-production Top Gear 'Golden cock' award..)
im sure it was less than half that a few years ago..
"Discuss"
(ps - the first person to say "its a small price to pay to keep the engine running" or similar gets a re-production Top Gear 'Golden cock' award..)
Edited by darkcat on Tuesday 30th August 08:13
You think you are hard done by over there? Compare these:-
http://classicoils.absolutewebhosting2.co.uk/Produ...
And the same thing in France:-
http://www.rueducommerce.fr/m/ps/mpid:MP-E5C67M128...
A quick bit of maths gives you a staggering price of £165, so £95 dearer than your side of the channel. Any wonder I bring oil back with me every time?
http://classicoils.absolutewebhosting2.co.uk/Produ...
And the same thing in France:-
http://www.rueducommerce.fr/m/ps/mpid:MP-E5C67M128...
A quick bit of maths gives you a staggering price of £165, so £95 dearer than your side of the channel. Any wonder I bring oil back with me every time?
jr502 said:
S3_Graham said:
as its a hell of a lot more complicated than it ever used to be.
that'd be a good starting point!
I think me means the price of the oil, not getting someone to do it for you.that'd be a good starting point!
Many reasons. Most modern cars now run a synthetic oil and the production costs of these are increasing either using PAO synthetic base stock or refined hydrocracked base stock.
The additives in the oil are also increasing in price hugely and driving the price up, there are only a few companies that supply additive packs for oils. One of the main additive suplliers is Lubrizol and this has been purchased by Warren Buffett, so expect prices to get even higher!
The additives in the oil are also increasing in price hugely and driving the price up, there are only a few companies that supply additive packs for oils. One of the main additive suplliers is Lubrizol and this has been purchased by Warren Buffett, so expect prices to get even higher!
There are essentially two elements to the high price of super refined oils.
Firstly there is a significant cost to the refinement and chemistry of modern engine oils. The long chain polymer characteristics which create the ability to adjust the viscosity of the oil to give massively better engine protection is not cheap. The 5/40 oils and so on are really very much better than the old 20/50 of the classic cars days and the SAE30 of the prewar era.
Modern oils produce the sort of protection which saw am Audi A4 diesel in my company cover over 550,000 miles without even having the head off. Try that with an A series engine or an Austin 7. Yes engineering and bearing design has improved but without modern oils this would be impossible.
Secondly, and more importantly, in common with many modern business products engine oils have become a fashion product in common with many other products worldwide.
The pricing of Engine Oils no longer relates to the cost of the product.
The hype and marketing of the car industry has lifted the expectations of the consumer where using the 'Right' oil for their beloved vehicle is vastly more important than the cost.
Oil manufacturers are enjoying a real bonanza as a result: the price of engine oil is grossly above the cost of the oil. Clever hype and advertising has made this product a very high price statement purchase rather like Prada handbags.
In essence the Oil manufacturers charge this much because they can: that is modern business ethics.
Firstly there is a significant cost to the refinement and chemistry of modern engine oils. The long chain polymer characteristics which create the ability to adjust the viscosity of the oil to give massively better engine protection is not cheap. The 5/40 oils and so on are really very much better than the old 20/50 of the classic cars days and the SAE30 of the prewar era.
Modern oils produce the sort of protection which saw am Audi A4 diesel in my company cover over 550,000 miles without even having the head off. Try that with an A series engine or an Austin 7. Yes engineering and bearing design has improved but without modern oils this would be impossible.
Secondly, and more importantly, in common with many modern business products engine oils have become a fashion product in common with many other products worldwide.
The pricing of Engine Oils no longer relates to the cost of the product.
The hype and marketing of the car industry has lifted the expectations of the consumer where using the 'Right' oil for their beloved vehicle is vastly more important than the cost.
Oil manufacturers are enjoying a real bonanza as a result: the price of engine oil is grossly above the cost of the oil. Clever hype and advertising has made this product a very high price statement purchase rather like Prada handbags.
In essence the Oil manufacturers charge this much because they can: that is modern business ethics.
I get my oil at a cost wholesale price (a 10w-40 semi synth) at about £1.10 a litre,change every 8-10k.I know the more expensive are fully synth but by nearly £10 a litre? You only have to look at the marketing for stuff like Castrol Edge to see you are being taken for a ride with expensive oil.
Steffan said:
Secondly, and more importantly, in common with many modern business products engine oils have become a fashion product in common with many other products worldwide.
The pricing of Engine Oils no longer relates to the cost of the product.
The hype and marketing of the car industry has lifted the expectations of the consumer where using the 'Right' oil for their beloved vehicle is vastly more important than the cost.
Oil manufacturers are enjoying a real bonanza as a result: the price of engine oil is grossly above the cost of the oil. Clever hype and advertising has made this product a very high price statement purchase rather like Prada handbags.
In essence the Oil manufacturers charge this much because they can: that is modern business ethics.
That surprises me to be honest. I'd have thought that the majority of car owners wouldn't have a clue what oil spec, let alone brand, goes in their car. They take it down to the local garage for a service whenever the service warning light comes on, pay their money and don't think about it again until next time. What the oil does is a mystery to most.The pricing of Engine Oils no longer relates to the cost of the product.
The hype and marketing of the car industry has lifted the expectations of the consumer where using the 'Right' oil for their beloved vehicle is vastly more important than the cost.
Oil manufacturers are enjoying a real bonanza as a result: the price of engine oil is grossly above the cost of the oil. Clever hype and advertising has made this product a very high price statement purchase rather like Prada handbags.
In essence the Oil manufacturers charge this much because they can: that is modern business ethics.
I'd have said that owners that care about their oil are in the minority and by virtue of the fact that they care, are often more informed and less reliant on marketing.
When I think back to my childhood, you used to see so many adverts in mainstream media for oil brands (I can still remember the Castrol ones now), yet these days they're very few and far between.
23 Litres of Castrol Edge/Syntec synthetic oil 5w30
$169.00 or £103
Whichever you prefer, at my local NAPA
https://www.napaonline.com/Catalog/CatalogItemDeta...
$169.00 or £103
Whichever you prefer, at my local NAPA
https://www.napaonline.com/Catalog/CatalogItemDeta...
http://www.opieoils.co.uk/c-660-15w-50-engine-oil....
You should get Members price being on Pistonheads. Very good service from these guys. Plus if you post a question in the Opie oils thread, the oil man will tell you which is the best oil for your motor/geabox/diff etc
You should get Members price being on Pistonheads. Very good service from these guys. Plus if you post a question in the Opie oils thread, the oil man will tell you which is the best oil for your motor/geabox/diff etc
Or go to an ester based oil such as Fuchs Titan for £40 inc Vat for Pistonheads members from Opie Oils. As I understand it, ester based oils make for better wear protection anyway, plus Mobil 1 15w50 has been discontinued as far as I'm aware, so you'll need to find an alternative soon anyway.
edit: beaten to it
edit: beaten to it
darkcat said:
I just priced up an oil change for my Lotus... 5L of 15w-50 mobil 1
Couple of things,1. I had an S3 N/A Esprit like yours for many years - I'm sure I used 0W-40 in it without any issues. (15w-50 sounds pretty chewy to me for a sensitive DOHC engine but I see it's what LEW recommends)
2. Mobil 1 has always been seriously expensive oil. IIRC it used to come in 4 litre packs so was even MORE expensive!
I get the impression its like all things. You pay a lot more for a little bit better. I used to run my daily driver on Mobil 1 fully synthetic, but now at £50 a time I have started using cheaper fully synthetic oil. Not least because the car isn’t worth much and I get the feeling the engine is going to be the last thing to die on the car.
That said I read an article that stated that cheaper fully synthetic oils are a bit of a stretch of terms. It also said it was better to run a car on poorer mineral oil when running in. Allegedly any "bedding in" is more rapid with a worse grade of oil. Makes sense.
I also wonder what’s the point for my circumstances. I do regular oil changes on my cars in comparison to mileage, which is always low. I just do my cars yearly rather than by mileage. Given that one of our cars has done 2K miles in a year it seems a bit silly to spend massive amounts on oil.
So if there are any real experts out there. What is better if the grade and the cost over 2 years were the same? Run a car on the best oil the market has to offer and do as my dealer recommends 20K miles 2 years. or 10K on cheaper fully synthetic oil in one year
That said I read an article that stated that cheaper fully synthetic oils are a bit of a stretch of terms. It also said it was better to run a car on poorer mineral oil when running in. Allegedly any "bedding in" is more rapid with a worse grade of oil. Makes sense.
I also wonder what’s the point for my circumstances. I do regular oil changes on my cars in comparison to mileage, which is always low. I just do my cars yearly rather than by mileage. Given that one of our cars has done 2K miles in a year it seems a bit silly to spend massive amounts on oil.
So if there are any real experts out there. What is better if the grade and the cost over 2 years were the same? Run a car on the best oil the market has to offer and do as my dealer recommends 20K miles 2 years. or 10K on cheaper fully synthetic oil in one year
5 USA said:
darkcat said:
I just priced up an oil change for my Lotus... 5L of 15w-50 mobil 1
Couple of things,1. I had an S3 N/A Esprit like yours for many years - I'm sure I used 0W-40 in it without any issues. (15w-50 sounds pretty chewy to me for a sensitive DOHC engine but I see it's what LEW recommends)
2. Mobil 1 has always been seriously expensive oil. IIRC it used to come in 4 litre packs so was even MORE expensive!
Bourj said:
I get the impression its like all things. You pay a lot more for a little bit better. I used to run my daily driver on Mobil 1 fully synthetic, but now at £50 a time I have started using cheaper fully synthetic oil. Not least because the car isn’t worth much and I get the feeling the engine is going to be the last thing to die on the car.
That said I read an article that stated that cheaper fully synthetic oils are a bit of a stretch of terms. It also said it was better to run a car on poorer mineral oil when running in. Allegedly any "bedding in" is more rapid with a worse grade of oil. Makes sense.
I also wonder what’s the point for my circumstances. I do regular oil changes on my cars in comparison to mileage, which is always low. I just do my cars yearly rather than by mileage. Given that one of our cars has done 2K miles in a year it seems a bit silly to spend massive amounts on oil.
So if there are any real experts out there. What is better if the grade and the cost over 2 years were the same? Run a car on the best oil the market has to offer and do as my dealer recommends 20K miles 2 years. or 10K on cheaper fully synthetic oil in one year
Try asking in this thread:That said I read an article that stated that cheaper fully synthetic oils are a bit of a stretch of terms. It also said it was better to run a car on poorer mineral oil when running in. Allegedly any "bedding in" is more rapid with a worse grade of oil. Makes sense.
I also wonder what’s the point for my circumstances. I do regular oil changes on my cars in comparison to mileage, which is always low. I just do my cars yearly rather than by mileage. Given that one of our cars has done 2K miles in a year it seems a bit silly to spend massive amounts on oil.
So if there are any real experts out there. What is better if the grade and the cost over 2 years were the same? Run a car on the best oil the market has to offer and do as my dealer recommends 20K miles 2 years. or 10K on cheaper fully synthetic oil in one year
http://www.pistonheads.com/gassing/topic.asp?h=0&a...
I dont think Mobil 1 is the best, and there are some cheaper oils that are just as good.
Gassing Station | General Gassing | Top of Page | What's New | My Stuff